even hired hands loosing jobs.

and it appears green will be first.

When you have a workforce not wanting to work you have to manage somehow.

Neighbor that does custom spraying all ready has rig that does that. Just sets in it.

Its real easy to run a pattern in a field, make hydraulics move at set places.

The problem is, how do you handle problems?

Wind storm blew a tree branch down, or a kyack in the field.

Tire goes flat.

Hyd hose ruptures.

Opener blade jams a rock and stops turning.

Chisel plow plugged up.

Got stuck, or might get stuck ahead.

And 4523000 other oh what do I do now moments.

How does a tractor without a human deal with the unknown.

Driving around the field, no problem. Thats easy.

How do you deal with the odd stuff that happens 12 times a day?

Paul

2 years ago a guy we know had to stop working ground late one night because he couldn't get a GPS signal to his unit. I don't really know details but I think I would be upset when work needed done and you couldn't do it due to technology.

When I drove sugar beet truck in the RR valley 10 years ago the harvester tractors were all steered by GPS. It seemed the operator would make the turn at the end of the field, start it in the correct row, hit enter on the GPS, and then go back to playing with his cell phone! But, he had to keep an eye on my load so it would be somewhat even, and signal me when I was full. I can't see something like that being fully operator-free.

(quoted from post at 09:08:51 01/26/22) When you have a workforce not wanting to work you have to manage somehow.

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Has absolutely nothing to do with that. The problem has been around far longer than the last two years.

The issue is in finding quality people who will work for what a farmer can afford to pay. What you end up with is a revolving door of people who just don't care about the job, wreck equipment, and just stop showing up altogether.

You're best off finding a few good people, paying them well, and putting your money in bigger equipment and automation, than having to deal with dozens of guys who really don't care.

That's my feeling too, I got a neighbor,when they plant, they lose connection with their planting unit, No GPS signal,and have to sit their maybe a half day until they can go again,they use that to certify their acres with ASCS, and the acres for the Insurance Company,with out that they have no map, so they cant plant,until signal is restored.Every year their signal company promise we have that problem fixed now!

I never said it started two years ago.
It's been going on for several years. It's
gotten exponentially worse in the past
couple years however.

Everything thing will be great.until you dont pay your yearly subscription, your GPS unit doesnt work because the receiver is last years model or some hacker hits the system and demands payment.

I would never work for another farmer,low pay,dirty work,long irregular hours,etc etc.I'm stupid enough to do it for myself but sure not stupid enough to do it for someone else.

(quoted from post at 09:21:44 01/26/22) Its real easy to run a pattern in a field, make hydraulics move at set places.

The problem is, how do you handle problems?

Wind storm blew a tree branch down, or a kyack in the field.

Tire goes flat.

Hyd hose ruptures.

Opener blade jams a rock and stops turning.

Chisel plow plugged up.

Got stuck, or might get stuck ahead.

And 4523000 other oh what do I do now moments.

How does a tractor without a human deal with the unknown.

Driving around the field, no problem. Thats easy.

How do you deal with the odd stuff that happens 12 times a day?

Paul

Click to expand...

There's an app for that.

The issue is not just finding quality workers it's also finding a farmer that is honest and will treat a hired man fair and honest. I went to work for a farmer for a small amount of money , bed, board , and , tobacco and every other Sunday off. I hardly ever got the money and not much tobacco. Every Sunday he said I had to milk as he had some place he had to go. After a year later one day I told him he had to milk tomorrow as I was going to be off. He said I own this farm and I will decide when you will be off. I said to plan on milking tomorrow. In the morning when he got up I was gone. Soon after the cows were gone and not long after that the farm was gone. The bank sold him out. I never felt sorry for him. I worked a good union job for the next 38 years and retired with a big Teamsters check and social security and life is just great. So you see it works both ways.

Well, operatorless tractors may have been around longer than one might think. I've heard stories of one operator plowing with 3 tractors at one time. Out in the wheat country back in the 30's and 40's. Where they farmed square mile fields, and farmed in a circle. Tractors of the time didn't plow much faster than a walk. Ounce they got the circle started, start one tractor in the furrow. Another behind it. And a third behind that. One driver run all three. Basically just ride on one unless one of the other 2 popped out of the furrow. Then just basically run to that tractor and steer it back into the furrow IF it didn't happen to be the one you was sitting on. If something big happened,(like dinner time) you'd of course shut all 3 down, and restart em plowing again one at a time. Then of course equipment got bigger. Ran faster.
Bottom line, technology has gotten there again on newer equipment, (IF) in the right situation. In my area where the bulk of the farm ground is terraced hillsides, I think we are aways off from completely operatorless. But, they half way there. Many have GPS row shut off, and auto steer. Driver more less is along for technical difficulties, starting, programming, and what not. Which at this time, is to much of a job to be operatorless for the type of ground in my area. But, I'm sure it will get there. Even for here, where operating equipment is more complex than elsewhere that is simpler with less obstructions.

A man in his working years has to have a steady job, not when the sun shines, crop is ready etc. That pretty well explains labor shortage on a farm.

Well said TF, it's that simple.

When we are out in the field using our GPS equipment we are using the lower quality signal available. The military uses a much better version. Most of the time when we lose signal it is not the fault of the satellite signal. Usually the problem is equipment failure in the machinery. When my planter tractor loses signal I lose auto steer but I can steer manually. I will plant a cooked row to the end of the field because the markers are locked up. When I turn around I will enable the markers so they go down and I have something to follow for awhile. In the rare case something goes haywire with the GPS signal for the planter I am shot out of the water. If the planter can't sense motion from the GPS signal it will not plant. Period. One year I had a problem with the planter not planting when I moved to a new field. After I gnashed my teeth awhile I found out I had lost an icon on the screen. Touching the icon got me planting again. It involved a software glitch. The company took care of it right away with a software update. Last spring I quit planting for the night with the field part way finished. Next morning when I fired up an took off planting again the electronic map on the monitor was gone never to be seen again. The tractor did not know where to go, the planter did not know where the end rows were so it could shut off and kick back in automatically on the ends. One pass across the field got a new line started for the auto steer but I had to kick the planter on and off manually on the end rows. One end had point rows so I over planted that end rows doing it manually. If I still had the map working right each row would individually turn off and on as the planter came to the point rows.

These two problem have been the only problems I have had over the ten years and hundreds of hours I have hused this setup. The individual rows have an electric motor controlled by the monitor in the tractor. There are no chains to come loose and jerk making an uneven stand or get thrown off by a corn stalk, no bearings to go bad no shafts to break or come out of alignment, no clutch to go bad. There is no need to spend a couple hours pulling out a shaft to replace a bearing in the middle of the shaft.

So in the end, yes there is a learning curve to using GPS controlled equipment. I have talked to farmers who won't plant anymore, their son does it because the son understands electronic controls. My Precision dealer told me I am not a common farmer because at my age I am still willing to learn how to use the new electronics. Yes there is equipment that sits a half day because of signal failure but this equipment also has much more simple individual row drives that don't give trouble often. When a planter sits at the end of the field while the farmer is pulling out a long drive shaft and running to the dealer for a new one or is replacing a shaft that bent because a chain came off and wound up no one pays much attention. But if he is sitting there with an electronic failure that is more simple than replacing a mechanical part the neighbors think the world has come to an end.

When we are out in the field using our GPS equipment we are using the lower quality signal available. The military uses a much better version. Most of the time when we lose signal it is not the fault of the satellite signal. Usually the problem is equipment failure in the machinery. When my planter tractor loses signal I lose auto steer but I can steer manually. I will plant a cooked row to the end of the field because the markers are locked up. When I turn around I will enable the markers so they go down and I have something to follow for awhile. In the rare case something goes haywire with the GPS signal for the planter I am shot out of the water. If the planter can't sense motion from the GPS signal it will not plant. Period. One year I had a problem with the planter not planting when I moved to a new field. After I gnashed my teeth awhile I found out I had lost an icon on the screen. Touching the icon got me planting again. It involved a software glitch. The company took care of it right away with a software update. Last spring I quit planting for the night with the field part way finished. Next morning when I fired up an took off planting again the electronic map on the monitor was gone never to be seen again. The tractor did not know where to go, the planter did not know where the end rows were so it could shut off and kick back in automatically on the ends. One pass across the field got a new line started for the auto steer but I had to kick the planter on and off manually on the end rows. One end had point rows so I over planted that end rows doing it manually. If I still had the map working right each row would individually turn off and on as the planter came to the point rows.

These two problem have been the only problems I have had over the ten years and hundreds of hours I have hused this setup. The individual rows have an electric motor controlled by the monitor in the tractor. There are no chains to come loose and jerk making an uneven stand or get thrown off by a corn stalk, no bearings to go bad no shafts to break or come out of alignment, no clutch to go bad. There is no need to spend a couple hours pulling out a shaft to replace a bearing in the middle of the shaft.

So in the end, yes there is a learning curve to using GPS controlled equipment. I have talked to farmers who won't plant anymore, their son does it because the son understands electronic controls. My Precision dealer told me I am not a common farmer because at my age I am still willing to learn how to use the new electronics. Yes there is equipment that sits a half day because of signal failure but this equipment also has much more simple individual row drives that don't give trouble often. When a planter sits at the end of the field while the farmer is pulling out a long drive shaft and running to the dealer for a new one or is replacing a shaft that bent because a chain came off and wound up no one pays much attention. But if he is sitting there with an electronic failure that is more simple than replacing a mechanical part the neighbors think the world has come to an end.

whomever wrote this article know absolutely nothing about farming in 2022!

fixerupper, many more tales like that and you will get kicked off YT.

We don't have any kind of GPS but it
looks like it would be nice....when
it works. I'm the one to normally
bed up and plant everything off of row markers. It does
get tiring at the end of the season
but I don't loose time to some
computer problem that may or may not
get fixed. As for the help
situation, it's been a long coming
down hill slide. We have enough
between equipment repairs and actual farm related stuff to run a person year round full time in addition to myself and dad. Pay for this position isn't a problem, it's just come to the point that no one wants to do no more than necessary to collect a check whether it be actually earn it or stay at the house and wait for the mail to drop it off. Anyone in the agricultural side that cares is either already occupied with they're own operations or too worn out to continue to help someone else once retired. I've got one now that I'd give anything to replace, but there isn't anyone available without going from bad to worse.

I didn't see the trouble with Fixerupper's reply.It is the truth Those fancy planter will do all that and more if you want. And if it screws up it will cost some time for the signal to come back sometimes. I know my brother was working in one field and his signal died. So he waited a bit didn't come back so went to shed. He was watching a couple neighbors planting all of a sudden they quit also. As they packed up and went to the house too. Our equipment is not that new and the planter would do some of those things we don't use a Great Piece of S08789 to plant though he wants to go there in the near future.

Hired hand, that's a term you don't hear often anymore. It makes me think of a low paying part time job with few benefits, minimal opportunity for any training, and almost zero chance of advancement. I doubt very many kids would (or should) select that on career day now-a-days. A part time job at a convenience store or fast food restaurant would probably be a better career choice (with safer working conditions too).

(quoted from post at 05:36:47 01/27/22) I didn't see the trouble with Fixerupper's reply.It is the truth Those fancy planter will do all that and more if you want. And if it screws up it will cost some time for the signal to come back sometimes. I know my brother was working in one field and his signal died. So he waited a bit didn't come back so went to shed. He was watching a couple neighbors planting all of a sudden they quit also. As they packed up and went to the house too. Our equipment is not that new and the planter would do some of those things we don't use a Great Piece of S08789 to plant though he wants to go there in the near future.

Click to expand...

Yes, fixerupper's reply is the truth but he is telling how well modern equipment works. Us yesterday guys don't want to hear it.

(quoted from post at 13:56:22 01/26/22) But if he is sitting there with an electronic failure that is more simple than replacing a mechanical part the neighbors think the world has come to an end.

Click to expand...

I'll bet the guy who was still planting corn by poking holes in the ground with a stick had the same apoplexy when the first mechanical planters started showing up... Bbbbbbbuttt, what if it BREAKS DOWN???

WHEN, not if, it breaks down, you deal with it. Same as always. If it puts you out of the field for the rest of the day, it puts you out of the field for the rest of the day.

Agreed. That has been the whole point of bigger and more productive equipment since the internal combustion engine came to the farm. Used to be cheap to have more kids for farm help - now kids are expensive. You also used to be able to hire cheap labor from ranks of the unemployed - today anyone that you can hire temporarily probably isn't anyone you want operating expensive equipment or relying on to do a professional job. My younger brother covers well over a 1000 acres of row crop and probably twice that in hay ground every year - just him and a 15 year old son. When I was a kid that would have been a pipe dream to do something like that and be good at it. He does it all primarily with two field tractors and a loader tractor. Grain and hay get moved by the semi load and he puts in 20 hours days combining - he catches naps in the cab while the combine uses GPS to go down the rows. He wishes the trucks could at least self drive while waiting in line at the elevator so his son could drop off a truck in line and jump in the one that got unloaded while in the field.

You say that and it seems the same issues arises when you try to have hired help or inexperienced youngsters do work for you. Local hay guy puts up thousands of acres with his grandsons and cheap help from their high school friends. My son worked for him for two years - the guy loved him - he at least new to look back the equipment once in the while. It isn't uncommon for a kid who had never run a tractor before to be put in charge of a baler. Just making sure the baler had twine mystified some of them - let alone adjust a knotter or greasing the machine. The guy is almost 70 and has twice given himself a heart attack while going apocalyptic on some 17 year old that has stuffed a baler full of fencing or forgot to set a brake and rolled a piece of equipment into a pond a ditch.

(quoted from post at 10:19:22 01/27/22) You say that and it seems the same issues arises when you try to have hired help or inexperienced youngsters do work for you. Local hay guy puts up thousands of acres with his grandsons and cheap help from their high school friends. My son worked for him for two years - the guy loved him - he at least new to look back the equipment once in the while. It isn't uncommon for a kid who had never run a tractor before to be put in charge of a baler. Just making sure the baler had twine mystified some of them - let alone adjust a knotter or greasing the machine. The guy is almost 70 and has twice given himself a heart attack while going apocalyptic on some 17 year old that has stuffed a baler full of fencing or forgot to set a brake and rolled a piece of equipment into a pond a ditch.

Click to expand...

Yeah who wants to work for a guy like that? People complain about "Millennials" (really Zoomers) not knowing anything, but that falls squarely on the shoulders of the Boomers (such as this guy) who were "too busy" to show a youngster anything, or felt that the youngster being around was "too dangerous" and shooed them back inside where they did what, exactly? Oh yeah, PLAY VIDEO GAMES BECAUSE THERE WAS NOTHING ELSE TO DO!

They just expect the kids to come out of the womb knowing everything. After all, they did, right?

(quoted from post at 11:18:37 01/26/22) The issue is not just finding quality workers it's also finding a farmer that is honest and will treat a hired man fair and honest. I went to work for a farmer for a small amount of money , bed, board , and , tobacco and every other Sunday off. I hardly ever got the money and not much tobacco. Every Sunday he said I had to milk as he had some place he had to go. After a year later one day I told him he had to milk tomorrow as I was going to be off. He said I own this farm and I will decide when you will be off. I said to plan on milking tomorrow. In the morning when he got up I was gone. Soon after the cows were gone and not long after that the farm was gone. The bank sold him out. I never felt sorry for him. I worked a good union job for the next 38 years and retired with a big Teamsters check and social security and life is just great. So you see it works both ways.

Click to expand...

My Man!

I knew a man who only double cropped (wheat in the winter) was to keep the help employed.

He said he made next to nothing from it after overhead but giving his laborers work kept them around till summer/fall.

(quoted from post at 11:21:44 01/26/22) Its real easy to run a pattern in a field, make hydraulics move at set places.

The problem is, how do you handle problems?

Wind storm blew a tree branch down, or a kyack in the field.

Tire goes flat.

Hyd hose ruptures.

Opener blade jams a rock and stops turning.

Chisel plow plugged up.

Got stuck, or might get stuck ahead.

And 4523000 other oh what do I do now moments.

How does a tractor without a human deal with the unknown.

Driving around the field, no problem. Thats easy.

How do you deal with the odd stuff that happens 12 times a day?

Paul

Click to expand...

Every bit of that is manageable by clever sensors that trigger a phone call summons to the "operator" who may be elsewhere but can come to the field when called. Just fail safe the equipment in the event of a problem and "phone home."