I have a stuck piston in a Ford Model T, it leaked coolant into the cylinder and i put diesel and brake fluid in and soaking it and honed the upper part of the cylinder not perfect but cleaned up pretty good. Was thinking possibly use a puller against top of piston with a strong piece on top of the piston but just not sure.
- Thread starter 8850dave
- Start date
showcrop
Well-known Member
I wouldn't. Think slow and gentle. Jack up one rear wheel, put it in high gear and rock that rear wheel back and forth. This will give the piston solid bumps up and down. Keep yourself involved with some of the other things on it that need attention, and just rock it now and then.
Determined
Well-known Member
Part of the problem is you are using oil based products on what is basically water based corrosion.
A mixture of citric acid and water or even some CLR will get down to where the corrosion is and soften up the crud.
Personally I would give it a soak with the above before resorting to using force. I have seen it work many times.
it is supersizing how much better force thru the crank shaft works than linear force directly on the piston.
i would try putting some torque, gently into the crank shaft either as noted above or nudge it with the hand crank (presuming it has one)
I had a tractor that was stuck so bad from rain in the exhaust it wouldn't break free until i had the piston busted out clear down to the skirt but i didn't try CLR as mentioned. hopefully yours isn't that bad.
i would try putting some torque, gently into the crank shaft either as noted above or nudge it with the hand crank (presuming it has one)
I had a tractor that was stuck so bad from rain in the exhaust it wouldn't break free until i had the piston busted out clear down to the skirt but i didn't try CLR as mentioned. hopefully yours isn't that bad.
560Dennis
Well-known Member
- Location
- Madison,Ohio
Are the valves closed?
Put head and gasket back on and put 100 psi on that cylinder thru the spark plug hole .
Should force the oil down cylinder wall
Put head and gasket back on and put 100 psi on that cylinder thru the spark plug hole .
Should force the oil down cylinder wall
wilson ind
Well-known Member
vibration has worked well call for details 812 699 0011
Steve@Advance
Well-known Member
The safest way would be to disconnect the rod from the crank, turn the crank out of the way.
Then make a wood or aluminum plug that fit the top of the piston. Try hammering it loose.
Once it breaks loose, take it out, clean it up, inspect the ring lands and rings. Then finish honing the cylinder.
Simply breaking it loose without freeing up the rings runs a real danger of damaging the cylinder and piston when the rings fail and burn through.
Then make a wood or aluminum plug that fit the top of the piston. Try hammering it loose.
Once it breaks loose, take it out, clean it up, inspect the ring lands and rings. Then finish honing the cylinder.
Simply breaking it loose without freeing up the rings runs a real danger of damaging the cylinder and piston when the rings fail and burn through.
Oregon Tractor Jack
Member
Try a little Coke or most any carbonated soft drink. The carbolic acid in the soda will help dissolve the rust. I have used this method on several tractors when oil based penetrants don't cut it. You will have to be patient, it could take several days to work. Now that I think about it, try a little vinegar it dissolve rust also.
Good Luck
OTJ
Good Luck
OTJ
redforlife
Well-known Member
Another vote for ATF as a soaking agent here. It's what I have used and have had some luck with. I have used about everything out there. But really not anything else that I can attribute to saying I had some luck with as a soaking agent.
Forget some sort of puller idea. Just a bad idea.
Patience is key. Piston didn't freeze up instantly, even if coolant was the cause. It's gonna take some time to free up. Getting in a hurry, or trying to force things along to fast will only steer you in the direction of breaking things in the process.
Let soak, and rock a jacked up rear wheel back and forth every 2 or 3 days. Or a few wackes with a wood block and large hammer. Walking away and returning later is a way better key, than constant battling expecting immediate results.
Forget some sort of puller idea. Just a bad idea.
Patience is key. Piston didn't freeze up instantly, even if coolant was the cause. It's gonna take some time to free up. Getting in a hurry, or trying to force things along to fast will only steer you in the direction of breaking things in the process.
Let soak, and rock a jacked up rear wheel back and forth every 2 or 3 days. Or a few wackes with a wood block and large hammer. Walking away and returning later is a way better key, than constant battling expecting immediate results.
Billy Shafer
Well-known Member
I saw a man use the Coke & vinegar. Trick I thought it was a waste of time. Came back two days later. With parts for his generator. Watched him remove the piston.
UncleTom
Well-known Member
My wife's Grandpa was a well known mechanic in the Oakland Neb. area. He has restored many antique stationary engines. Has dug them up that were buried in dirt,some were in a fire. He got everyone of them running with a lot of work and made parts for them as well. His rule of getting them on stuck is, water stuck them,water will unstick them. He would put water down the plug hole and put compressed air on it for who knows how long. He claims hes never had one he couldn't get unstuck.
Keith True
Well-known Member
It depends on how badly it is stuck.The problem with a T,is the pistons were cast iron,same as the block.When they stick,they tend to weld themselves together.I have some U-shaped frames made up for the Model A,that bolt down to the head stud holes.I bolt that down to the deck and jack down on the piston.Before I had a porta-power I just used a hydrauic jack.Don't be too surprised if you jack a hole through the top of the piston..060 over pistons for a Ford 312 will fit in the T block.
Fritz Maurer
Well-known Member
Avoid force. Do not hesitate to sacrifice the piston. There are more Model T pistons out there than you can shake a stick at. The crankshaft will bend if you get brutal with it. Depending on the year, the trans and flywheel are supported only by the oil pan. If you start jerking or prying, you can bend the crank behind no. 3 main, then the magneto will never work right. Why take chances on damage and wait weeks for a cure that nobody is sure will work? Dissect that one piston , get it apart and move forward.
Uncle murph
Member
In total agreement with the ATF thinned,never understood the brake fluid thing but Im sure it must have worked for someone.No way to overstate the value of patience either,it didnt get stuck in 5 minutes,it could easily take a week or more to free up,good luck and let us know how it goes.
Crazy Horse
Well-known Member
So MSD, you are using water instead of something like say penetrating oil?
Crazy Horse
Well-known Member
Wilson ..... does a guy need to have a vibrator to get that done?
Copperhead don't play
Member
After weeks and I mean weeks of trying everything, including bolting a plate of steel with a grease fitting in it and trying to pump the piston down with a grease gun like a jack.
I turned the engine upside down and placed chipped dry ice in the underside of the piston (replacing the dry ice as it evaporated). After about five minutes the piston had shrunk enough that I could drive it out with a wooden block and a hammer.
I turned the engine upside down and placed chipped dry ice in the underside of the piston (replacing the dry ice as it evaporated). After about five minutes the piston had shrunk enough that I could drive it out with a wooden block and a hammer.
wilson ind
Well-known Member
yes that is best i got a very old fashion one on e bay also in past i jacked up hand crank purring pressure on crankshaft. Hit with hammer seversl stroks as wlked past in shop on about fourth day crank turned letting pressure off. however as post said CALL for details.
wilson ind
Well-known Member
yes that is best . I got a very old fashion one on e bay . also in past i jacked up hand crank purring pressure on crankshaft. Hit with hammer seversl stroks as walked past in shop . On about fourth day crank turned letting pressure off. however as post said CALL for details.
showcrop
Well-known Member
This is a common topic. It probably comes up at least once a month, but I don't think that I have ever seen acid recommended. I use plenty of acid to clean rust off from parts and to convert the rust to iron phosphate protective coating, but it has to be followed with very good rinsing. There is no way that I would put acid into an engine.
Determined
Well-known Member
The topic is about a seized piston in a 100 year old engine, the purpose of the citric acid AKA lemon juice is to break down the corrosion on the rings of a piston that wont budge.
Nobody is suggesting you dump acid into your engine oil or any other place, though many use citric acid to clean corrosion out of cooling systems.
Amongst other things I use it to make Mozzarella and cottage cheese, it's not harmed any of our pots nor has it melted any of our utensils.
I had a wrecker boom extension rusted stuck. I had used thinned oil, diesel and hammered on it over months with no luck. A year or so later it had been raining for a couple days I gave it a few taps and it slid right out. I have not used water in an engine. Have used aft thinned with mineral spirits,block of wood and hammer every few days took 2 weeks on cat d4. Water, or coke or vinegar? Interesting.
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