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WILL1E

Member
Hey everyone! New here and new to tractors. I'm located in northeast Wisconsin and have a property about 2hrs north of me in WI. I'm looking to invest in a small tractor w/ a loader to push around some dirt and spread some gravel and in winter move some snow from the driveway once it's done. My budget is in the $3k-$4k range.

I have no personal experience with tractors in terms of operation, what they're worth, etc. so i'm hoping to get some guidance here. I am mechanically inclined and have no concerns with being able to work on and fix anything when it comes to the tractor as long as i have some guidance on what needs to be done.

When i look for tractors locally, i tend to look at the 8N's because i like their size and their price seems to be in the $1500-$2500 range without a loader. If they have a loader it seems like the price basically doubles. Finding a loader without the tractor seems to be far and few between. The issue i'm worried is that this tractor will be insufficient (power wise) for my needs. Is that a valid concern?

Another tractor i've talked w/ an owner about online is a 1950's Ford 800. He's asking $4200 for it with a loader, "quick attach" and a back blade. He said the power steering pump no longer works so i'm not sure what that would take/cost to fix.

So that basically sum's up where i've been and what i'm trying to do. Hopefully you all can provide me some guidance in purchasing my first tractor!!
 

Welcome. You don't want an 8n. You really don't want an 8N with a loader. Under powered, crude, cheaply made tractor, but they are cute and not at all intimidating. The 800 is many, many times the tractor the 8N is and many multitudes more refined. I'd start shopping around and looking to see what else is available. A loader REQUIRES (IMO) power steering. It will also REQUIRE either wheel weights, loaded tires, a counter weight on the 3pt or 4wd. The problem you face is you are looking for something when the market is relatively high. Yes, you can find some small, non-power steering equipped tractors for under $2K, but you will be very limited in what you can do. Look at other brands than Ford. Massey Ferguson, Case, Allis, Oliver, IHC. Steer shy of off brands like Belarus, TYM, McConnell. And when you do find something, remember these days tires represent a very major investment if the ones on the tractor are crap.
 
For your application an 8N is not enough tractor. Find something newer with power steering (You will appreciate that on a tractor with loader.), loader, and 3-
point hitch. Implements for the 3 point are readily available as your needs and budget dictate. Four wheel drive would be most advantageous but probably not
available within your budget unless it needs lots of work. 'Lots of work' translates into more time and money spent so one might just as well spend the money up
front on a higher quality purchase. Ford 3000 series, 4000 series, and newer 1910, 2120, TC series come to mind. Others can offer ideas on other brands and
models. Don;t purchase strictly on price; consider condition, options, etc. before writing the check.
 
Thanks for the info so far!

So the Ford 800 i mentioned. Does that price sound reasonable? What things should i ask or look for to better understand the condition, options, etc?
 
Take it from a guy who has a loader tractor with no power steering- don't do it! That's one reason I bought a different tractor this winter, among other things.
 
Stay away from those little fords. There not heavy enough for a loader and pushing dirt. I
am very biased on that so others will tell you different. For me that little tractor is
made for a market garden and mowing lawns and nothing but.

I am not sure what tractor price is like for you there,.. but I bought a 1070 on auction
for $3000 in working condition. The cab looked awful and no lights worked no heater fan
working but still a cheap but good tractor. The loader for it sat beside and sold for $400.
I know there are a lot of 970 1070 and even 30 series tractors that need a little repair
for that kind of money.

I really like my 1650 cocksutt with a loader(paid $2000 and sold it later for $2200, should
have never sold it so now I have bought 2 more like it) and that is what built my yard and
worked my 100 acres for the first 5 years before I bought a bigger field tractor.

Again prices may be very different in your area.
To me a tractor with a little more size won't just spin when you try to move dirt and snow.
If you are talking only a flat ground and 20 yards of dirt and gravel in a year you may
just be able to do it with the little fords. put some chains on it for winter and snow may
not be to deep there I don't know. I have always been in the rolling hills and 3-4 ft
drifts so I have a negative about small tractors.

around here you can buy allis and duetz and IH tractors cheap. 986, 966. go under $5000 all
the time.
Another one is massey 1100, 1135 and such go real cheap as well.

Look at bigger and drive a few and see if you would like them for occasional use.

I like diesel but if you are only going there when it is cold out and have to walk the
driveway to the yard to fire up and plow you may want a gas, I don't know.
 
The 800 is a far more capable tractor than the 8N, especially as a loader tractor. You should be able to get a replacement steering pump
through YT or Steiners, or adapt an automobile pump to it. Price wise, it depends on the condition, the area you are in, and what you are
willing to pay.
 
When looking for a tractor don't pigeon-hole yourself into an "A, B, or C" choice. ALWAYS keep, "D - none of the above" as an option. Keep looking, and in the meantime work to increase your tractor budget by socking away a little from each paycheck for example.

You have to take "It just needs *blah*" with a huge grain of salt. If it just needed something simple, then why didn't the owner fix it? Sometimes they are telling the truth, and were just too lazy or inept to fix the problem, but you're rolling the dice generally speaking.
 
Also, if you are NOT mechanically inclined, save a few more bucks. Tractor mechanics are not cheap, and alot won't work on older stuff. At least that is true in my area.
 
Being you are in an area where they measure snow in feet and yards instead of inches You need to raise your budget some and find a front wheel assist model for loader work and pushing snow and dirt. Some of the 60-100 horse options are actually cheaper than those cute junk N series fords. Like said those N series fords make lawn mowers and garden tractors. Pushing dirt and snow take power and weight. Pulling logs of any size bigger than fire blocks take power if in deep snow also. I'de look for something in the 730-930 Case 460-756 IH 2030 and up Deere D series and newer larger Allis 60 or bigger and newer Massey and these are most of them to old for the front axle to drive on them.
 
You may want to consider a tractor with a good heavy blade on it for the uses you listed.

The bigger the better, might seem clumsy and intimidating at first but by the time you get through your first season you will swear it shrunk.

Also consider longevity, a little tractor that just gets by you will be working it to it's limit.

A bigger machine even when half worn out will walk through the same job like there was nothing to it.

Load the tires and get some chains for it.

When the snow is blowing a cab and heater is a wonderful thing to have.

Something in the size range of a Case 970 if you look long enough can be found for close to your budget, even if you have to spend a little more up front you will be glad you did.
 
(quoted from post at 07:59:05 04/21/21)
I like diesel but if you are only going there when it is cold out and have to walk the
driveway to the yard to fire up and plow you may want a gas, I don't know.
Click to expand...

I would add to that. After you walk in then you plug the diesel block heater in and wait a few hours. Then hope the diesel fuel hasn't jelled on you or else you are changing filters and getting cold diesel fuel all over you and then bleeding down the system. Then plug in the battery charger and wait a few hours. Then find out the battery has aged and doesn't produce the cold cranking amps needed for a diesel so you go buy a new battery. Then check and find out the glow plugs aren't working. Then find out you need to take out a second mortgage if the fuel injection pump and injectors need an overall. Then when it is so cold that it won't run, you have to go buy a gas tractor to do the job. Then find you are low on diesel fuel and you need a pickup to haul the cans to a station or else have a vehicle that reeks of diesel smell on the inside. Then find out that diesel doesn't wash off your hands very well and takes a number of washings to get the smell out of your clothes. Even if you store it in a barn, by the time you get it warmed up enough to drive out, you will be covered with smelly diesel exhaust.

I could go on about diesel but I wouldn't want to drive 2 hours and depend upon it starting in the winter. On the other hand you could have some of the same problems with a gas tractor.

My personal choice is a solar powered snow melter to clear driveways. Comes on automatically at dawn and shuts down automatically at the end of the day. Very economical as it doesn't cost anything. Also saves the strain on the back since no labor is involved. lol
 
3000 to 4000 wont buy much tractor.You need to raise it to 5 or 6000. An 8N with a loader is like a 'hog on ice'.Practily worthless.(and I like 8Ns).And you wond be able to steer it with a loaded
bucket,either.But better than a shovel.LOL An 800 series Ford,3000/4000 Ford;135/165Massey;JohnDeere 1020/2020 are far better choices. Even something like an IH 300 utility wuld work
for you.With a loader,you will need to have fluid in the tires for added (and necessary) weight. and you will want power steering.Keep looking,post back when you find a
good candidate.Good luck.
 
The Wolverines...gotcha. I agree on staying away from 8N's. I like my Ferguson TO-20 which is similar, but more nimble. You
can plow with a backblade. If you want a loader...spend a few more bucks and get a little bigger tractor.
 
The 8N was/is a durable little tractor. They're common, lug good for 30 HP, most parts are still abundant. Wouldn't pay more than $1500 - $1700 for
one fully restored, as unrestored good runners can still be had for $800 - $1000.... maybe less. The 800 to me is just a bigger, slightly more
modern 8N. Sure as heck wouldn't pay $4200 for one with the PS not working even if it was gold plated. Paint don't pull the plow or in your case,
push. You should definitely spend more time in your research to spend less in the long run.

My current small utility tractor is an IH 2444 diesel with loader & trencher. Paid $2000, bought it used from a dealership a couple years ago. The
worst I have to deal with is a little bit of blow by, the lights don't work & the diff lock is out. I don't travel down the road much, haven't
needed lights yet & would liked to have used the diff only a couple times. No big deal either way. Still a tuff little tractor & has paid for itself
tenfold just with loading manure.

Good luck!

Mike
 
For what you are doing you need a wide front (not tricycle) and low center of gravity (straddle the transmission when driving) and 3 point
hitch. Gasoline is best for cold weather starting in a remote location. Personally, I would look for a Massey Ferguson 35. But, regardless
of brand, you will need Power steering with a front loader. I am not a fan of front end loaders on little old tractors.
 
Folks here love to bash the Ford Ns.
But they are a simple, capable small
tractor that will do a lot of useful work
for you.
Just don't put a loader on one. A loader
will make that nimble little machine a
long, hard steering dreadnaught that
requires 40 acres to turn around.
The beauty of the Ns is that they have
Factory 3 point hitch. So you can attach
any of a couple dozen different implements
to one.
You don't need a loader. Buy a dirt scoop
for digging and moving dirt or use it for a
tool carrier. Buy a back blade for
smoothing driveways and moving snow and get
a boom pole for lifting heavy items.
Buy the implements as you need or can
afford them. You can put plows, discs,
harrows, a few types of mowers, rakes,
planters, seed and fertilizer spreaders,
wood chippers, sprayer pumps, and a host of
other things on a 3 point hitch plus you
still have a regular drawbar for dragging
logs and pulling trailers.
Now here one important truth about an N
Ford.
Do NOT restore the darned thing.
Buy one, use the heck out of it, fix what
needs fixing but do not get caught up in
the restoration craze.
I have seen too many guys buy a $1000 N and
then restore it. Next thing you know they
have $5 Grand in it and they Do Not have
the options and features a $5000 tractor
will have.
I was given an N when my father died. I
used it for a couple of years, learned a
lot about tractors, played with it, fixed
it as needed then sold it and moved up to a
newer Ford.
I would not go back to an N. But I would
not trade the lessons I learned from owning
one either.
 

here

cvphoto85851.jpg
 
Are you up where you get over ten feet of snow a year, often with five feet of snow and ice on the ground at one time, and the ground stays frozen seven months of the year? I don't believe an N series Ford is up to that kind of snow because it can't run a snow blower.

It is easiest and cheapest to buy a used tractor and loader combination, maybe get a snow bucket, tire chains and a HeatHouser in the deal too.
 
If you need to use the cabin during the winter, can you use snowmobiles and not bother spending days and days clearing the drive and possibly the roads too?
 
There are typically older gas farm tractors, 1930s through 1950s. They lack features and safety features and take some work to keep running, but are simple.

There are newer farm tractors, 1950s to 1980s with better features. There often have much nicer features as live hydraulics, live pto, power steering, more gear
selection, and so forth came to be.

There are modern compact diesel tractors from 1980s through now. These tend to be light weight and Asian made, but many have good features and a dependable
Diesel engine.

Kinda depends what you really want. Sit on it and use it, go with the compact, your budget is low for a dependable one.

The middle age farm actors would probably suit you best, but agsin might need a little more money.

The oldest tractors need to be a labor of love, and are going to lack some features you will expect are common, but were not back then. A person could replace 2
horses with an 8N, but then horses r only power, thy didnt o my of the adjusting, sting, lifting, etc. that as still all on the operating..... o umrstand whst you are getting
with th real old machines.

There have to be several 100 models, probably thousands or models of tracks you can pick from, so w wont every be able to give you a top 10 list. It just depends your
level of need and your comfort level at working on them yourself, and on what you find.

A loader you really want live hydraulic and power string. And I grew up and still hav a load Tate that doesnt have either, so I know it can be done. But....

If you run a snow blower you really want live pto, and several reverse gears to pick from. Live pto is so much nicer for anything that uses the pto.....

And so forth. You can get by, or you can have nice to use. Those things are your choice, what are you happy with.

Paul
 
Wow. My iPad and the spell checker sure mess up over time. Its become difficult to pst messages. Hopefully you can understand most of that. I correct a lot, but it auto recorrects my corrections. Terrible.
 
When I started mowing I bought a Ferguson T0 20 which is just a step up from an 8N. It had enough power to pull my 6 ft woods mower and raise it
just fine. The power would be there with a T020 for what you want. Same with an 8N. Steering may be an issue with a bucket full of whatever with
out power steering. Someone mentioned a massy Ferguson 35 This would be my choice with the 3 cylinder Perkins diesel. There are lots of models with
the Perkins engines. My MF is a 231 model. Come out to California and I will make you a good deal on a MF T0 20. Never parked in the snow. Stan
 
Well, when my gramps sold his lime spreading operation, most of the loader tractors for the local satelite stockpiles went with it, except the 8N with the Wagner step-thru that had become a backup. 340 International, Fordson Major Diesel (manual steering and a beyotch to steer) and the Michigan 75A all went away. The 8N had been used where there were no scales, and before it was moved out there (Prattsburg NY) it was verified that a heaped bucket of lime was 900 lbs, so it was always full when loading. The front axle, by the time I started plowing snow with it, had a pretty good swayback in it, so was not fun to steer, but snow and coal was lighter. Worked pretty well for clearing snow with bucket extensions added, loaded tires with the big-bore Merc piston kit, weights, chains and a full 55 gal drum on the back. I know have a decent 850 with PS and the Wagner step-thru, and it is a LOT more tractor, bigger tires with big pie weights etc. My 50 8N mows, that's it. I also have a 340 with a big Farmhand loader that would be a good snow rig. A loader has a big advantage over a backblade in snow, as you can pile it up or move it around
 
So another rig i've found that's more than i ever wanted to spend but for some reason i'm considering. It's a 70 Massey 50A with loader and
backhoe. Everything is in good condition minus a bearing for the backhoe pivot (has new bearing, just not installed yet). He's firm @ $6k.
 
When I first read your post I wondered if you'd had a stroke or something.
I turned off the auto correct on my phone.
Means I have to proof read a lot more but if I want to call it Fecebook instead of Facebook it lets me.
 
(quoted from post at 11:52:24 04/21/21)

Never parked in the snow. Stan
Click to expand...

Well Stan it looks like your tractor doesn't have an "snow experience". You'd have to give the guy a steep discount for no experience. lol
 
For loader work in that price range I agree with the others that the Ford N series or MF equivalents is the way to go. The MF 35 or 135 with a diesel engine were about as reliable as they come, and can be found at prices in your budget easily. I like farmalls but you don't need the clearance of a row-crop, so a standard (low-setting) tractor with wide-front will be better for what you describe, and much more stable.

I would strongly encourage you to set aside an extra few hundred for a ROPS. I have attached a link for a ROPS rebate program--get 70% of your money back. I do like the classic look of a tractor with no ROPS, but decided it was more important to my wife & kids to be safe. With the rebate your out-of-pocket will be less than $300. They allow self-installs if you take pictures before-and-after. I did this program and they were helpful and easy to work with as long as you are patient while they process your request, which may take a few weeks.

Good luck and have fun, Dave
ROPS rebate program
 
If your 8N looking it's NOT going be a pleasure to steer with a loader on it. And once the front end is down a very small slope your not going to have traction to backup. If you can find a used 25-35 horse 4 wheel drive compact tractor it will fit your conditions much better. I have older Kubota L225DT with 4' snow blower on 3pt hitch. Without the front wheel drive it would struggle in some places to move on an uphill grade.
 
(quoted from post at 13:39:47 04/21/21) So another rig i've found that's more than i ever wanted to spend but for some reason i'm considering. It's a 70 Massey 50A with loader and
backhoe. Everything is in good condition minus a bearing for the backhoe pivot (has new bearing, just not installed yet). He's firm @ $6k.
Click to expand...

-Now you are looking at an industrial duty machine, typically stronger loader and bucket than what you will find on most farm tractors.

-Perkins diesel 60 -70 HP hard to find someone who will say anything bad about the engine.

-Based off the description I would say it is well worth the asking price.

-With the hoe on back you will have decent traction and if you do screw up and get it stuck, which you will, with a little bit of practice you can use the hoe to walk yourself out of the mess.

-Even if it is an old and sloppy backhoe you will find 110 new uses and reasons to justify having it in the first few months.
 
(quoted from post at 09:34:13 04/21/21) Wow. My iPad and the spell checker sure mess up over time. Its become difficult to pst messages. Hopefully you can understand most of that. I correct a lot, but it auto recorrects my corrections. Terrible.
Click to expand...

Paul, I turned spell check off two years ago. I would rather decide for myself what word I want.
 
ha, thats all i will work on is the old stuff the older the better. and i dont tear the guy a new azz either . i prefer to help the person
out. i get more satisfaction out of that then getting paid.
 
Bear in mind that the Ford 8N is a seventy year old design based on an eighty year old design. They're popular because of their small size and simplicity, but they aren't very powerful and lack live hydraulics. The 800 series, although only a few years newer, is a much more modern design and quite a bit more powerful. There are several models in the 800 series: if it has a four speed transmission it is an 840. An 850 will have a five speed transmission and the most desirable model is the 860 which has a five speed transmission and live PTO.

Assuming your neighbor's tractor has a five speed transmission and is in good running condition with decent tires, $4200 sounds about right with the loader. The rear blade doesn't add much to the value unless it's a heavy-duty one. It's possible to repair the power steering, but it probably needs more than just a new pump. You'll find posts in the Ford forum on this topic.
 
Found a gas Massey 50 today on Craigslist (it won't let me post a link here). Looks in OK shape with a loader bucket.

3 point rear and power steering both don't work.

Are those easy fixes and is it worth the $2900?
 
(quoted from post at 08:12:25 04/22/21) Found a gas Massey 50 today on Craigslist (it won't let me post a link here). Looks in OK shape with a loader bucket.

3 point rear and power steering both don't work.

Are those easy fixes and is it worth the $2900?
Click to expand...

My opinion;

Too light (traction)
Not enough HP (30 HP?)
Easy fix? anybody's guess $$$ ??? (pump $600 gear $600) (3 point?)
Personally not the direction I would go.
 
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