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Electric vehicles what about tractors

U

used red MN

Well-known Member
Location
Coon Rapids, MN
Just seen on the local 10pm news, GM plans on all cars to be electric by 2035. So 14 years from now? Does not seem realistic to me. So roughly 125 years on Dino juice. I guess one thing is certain as time passes things change!
 
Nothing against GM, but years ago, one of their CEO's made the statement "We're not in business to make cars, we're in business to make money".

With the current turn of political garbage, it's all about going green. There will be big government incentives to develop electric cars, which will mean research grants to get them on the market, and bailouts waiting if it fails.

Win-win for the car manufacturers, loose-loose for the consumers.
 
mvphoto69081.jpg
 
A prototype electric utility tractor ( Solectrac )was created in 2012 . Believe it is 40 hp and on the market today. The company founder said they would ramp up production to 10 units in 2013, 100 units in 2014 & 1000 units by 2015. Never have seen one at a tractor show (like the N F M S) or heard of anyone buying or using one outside of seeing them on the internet. Think diesel fuel became very reasonable in price starting in about 2016. This may have stymied this company's production and sales projections. Or else the US farmer doesn't see a need for electric utility tractors at this time. If the major tractor companies think the farmers want an electric utility tractor they would try and produce them. Not convinced farmers believe they need an electric tractor with fuel prices where they are today.
 
I think an electric car would be great for short commutes. I would like to have an electric utv also but I dont know about tractors or trucks. I was looking at mustang mach E specs. Its pretty impressive but with only a 200-300 range it wouldn't be much good for a cross country trip. Guess it doesn't really matter anyway because I will probably never be able to afford one. I might buy a new or close to new truck someday and it will probably be my last vehicle.
 
I will admit that I see this as ..contrived.. news. I thought I would see what kind of replies would come up. I
would tend to agree with the sentiment Lyndon has taken.
 
Actually, electric tractors may be feasable.
Think about the irrigation systems that go around in a circle.
Instead, put a power source in the middle and run the tractor off of that.
Make it computer controlled and sit back and watch Opra while your tillage gets done.
Dunno how the power grid could accomodate such a huge increase demand tho.
Maybe build more coal fired power plants.
Wink
 
Case has a electric backhoe 580 EV. It is powered by a 480 volt, 90 kilowatt-hour lithium-ion battery pack that can be charged by any 220 volt three phase connection and should run 8 hours on a charge.
 
> So will that also mean electric air planes etc.

Battery-powered airplanes have been flying for some time. Expect to see more of them as battery and motor technologies improve.
 
What you have to get your head around is the electric cars of the future will follow the pattern of the highly successful Diesel Electric locomotive. Each car will generate its own electricity, charging its own battery while you drive. It looks most likely a Hydrogen powered fuel cell will generate the power. And will only burn the Hydrogen when the charge in the battery requires. Hydrogen molecules can be stripped off of natural gas, and the residual pumped back into the ground, there by putting the carbon back were in came from. This will make the Oil and gas industry happy,as they can keep getting rich. The green weenies will be satisfied with this, and car exhaust will be water. And your car will have as much range as your Hydrogen tanks capacity, just like your gasoline car. Drive in and refill, minutes later, you are on the road and driving again. Sound far fetched?? I hope we live long enough to see. Most of us are about the same age group 55 and up. So if you were 55 in 1900 what would your opinion of the horsesless carriage have been?? And no one worried about electric planes in 1900 either.
 
EVs will be the death of gm (lower case in accordance with their new logo). They will never be able to compete with Tesla for technology superiority, or customer base. Tesla has a few things going for it. One, Elon Musk is a modern day PT Barnum for Millennials, he generates public enthusiasm for his product and its abilities. Ask a millenial who Mary Barra is and note the blank stare. Second, Tesla has investors willing to put building a company above dividends. gm does not have this luxury, 100 years of dividend checks sets a precedent, and investors want their money. Third, their logo. Tesla uses an authoritative "T" on their cars and TESLA on other things. gm has their new whisper logo.

EVs make sense for a small portion of the motoring public. One would make sense for me and the driving I do, but the price does not. We should be letting market demand drive innovation. Building the product the masses weren't asking for is, well, what gm is good at I suppose. There are people who could use an EV, and would purchase one if the price were right and that should be driving the market, not the government. Elon Musk himself has said going all electric is not feasible. We do not have the electric infrastructure to charge millions of electric cars. We should be listening to the expert in his field, not politicians.

As to the pollution, EVs just move the pollution. The fuel pollution moves to a power plant (I realize in a smaller proportion). The real problem is end of life. A modern gas vehicle is mostly all recyclable, an EV is not. Mainly due to the large battery. The batteries are toxic waste from the second they are made, once they reach end of life, they are useless and non-recyclable. Our grandkids will have mountains of batteries to deal with. EV pollution is like this, you walk through a yard with your friend and he steps in cat poop. You still have to smell it, but feel good it's not on you directly. That's the EV pollution argument in a nutshell.
 
Hey Rich, I have to agree. While a smaller lighter weight battery powered (some with solar charging) aircraft is feasible, I don't envision any heavy huge passenger or commercial battery powered airplanes in the near future. Thays NOT to say battery technology isn't improving, but like you I don't see battery powered heavy aircraft for a while at least lol.

Indeed the power capacity and grid out west is having problems. So, what's the solution ?? More Hydroelectric,,,,,,,,More Solar,,,,,,,,More Nuclear,,,,,,,, More Fossil Fueled plants ??? The tree huggers aren't fans of many of those lol

Take care and be safe Rich, as always fun chatting with you

John T
 
They're going to have to make some major advances to bring current electric vehicles up to compete with today's gas & diesel vehicles. Particularly in areas of range between recharges, and recharge times. Todays electrics are not competitive in this economy.
 
Yes, when C. Columbus left his Spanish port in 1492 the locals said he was crazy, and if he wasn't careful he'd sail off the edge of the planet. What a silly sailor he was .......
 
I am all for an electric tractor as soon as I find my 5,000 ft extension cord. Seriously I would imagine that an electric farm tractor would be some sort of hybrid with an engine driven generator, a large battery pack and electric motor powered drive train. Possibly combining on site solar system for recharging the battery. As mentioned we are not there yet as far as technology to make it feasible.
 
Mark, Battery planes ? I've only seen a few, maybe used for training, but wouldn't want to take one on a cross country, do see them becoming mainstream in my lifetime !
 
Any one remember the GE elec-trac? It was a battery powered garden tractor with electric motor for the tractor and smaller motors driving the blades on the mower deck. I believe that they were a well built machine, but too expensive to be competitive.
 
if a move to electric vehicles, tractors, and the like made business and economic sense wouldn't the governing authorities let it happen on its own merits?
 
Electric tractors are here. There are a few DOT autonomous tractors working around here now. Search youtube for DOT autonomous seeder and take a look. Originally developed by Seedmaster and now Raven own it. They are diesel electric and self driving. I think what kills electric vehicles is running the ac in summer and heat in winter. An autonomous tractor doesn't need climate control.
 
Agree and wait until they get millions of EVs plugged into the power grid and all they want is wind and solar.
 
In my opinion the technology is a long ways off from being able to produce an electric powered tractor that will ever be able to fit the needs of much more than a few textbook perfect scenarios.

With that said I can still remember having to bring along 3 batteries for my cell phone to get through the day.

That has obviously changed so all the power to the manufacturers if they think they can make it work on a tractor.

One problem they won't be able to overcome anytime soon is the prohibitive cost.

A lot of farm tractors get used for a very short number of hours per year so even if the price of fossil fuel went up to $20 a gallon it would still be the economical choice when compared to spending $100 000+ on an electric powered tractor that will still come with an hourly operating cost.

Most farmland does not have a 200 amp 3 phase service sitting on the edge of the field so if you have to drag around a huge generator to recharge your equipment at remote locations has anything been gained?
 

There is what sounds good to 98% of the public who have no idea . And what obtains billions in subsidies and grants for the EV builder .
Then there is the laws of physics , chemistry and electricity . That no amount of research and grant money can change .
No use trying to tell most people . Most believe that with enough laboratory research that Star Trek energy cells are possible .
Most people are so unaware of the numbers and over sure
of their importance . They actually believe that their and other EVs are reducing CO2 . Never mind telling them that CO2 is one of the most minor green house gasses in the atmosphere .

mvphoto69088.jpg
 

What does have to do with energy state density ?
Why use a totally unrelated argument in attempt to support something else ?
Columbus knew the earth was curved as he observed ships approaching the shore . The top of the mast appeared first , then the sails and finally the deck .
 

Further significant improvements in energy storage and motor efficiency so not exist .
Kids hobby aircraft fly for minutes on a lithium battery
. Unmanned Solar powered spy planes are in the works by the military . However they store energy to keep flying at night by gaining altitude through the day on rising thermals and solar power . Then glide over night to lower altitude .
The solar powered manned flight around the world pushed tech to the limits and barely worked .
There is no way to build a battery powered 737 .
 
While I think battery powered cars, trucks, etc. have their place in this world, and wind/solar does too, how come California has rolling blackouts in summer? If wind/solar doesn't supply all the need now, how does adding more load of battery charging help? May have to use the cave man renewable energy, burn wood...
 
Tractors too! Cut a round of hay, charge the tractor for four hours, cut another round of hay..........

When will people actually stop and think about the job that needs to be done.
 
I can see electric vehicles working well for the majority of families and commuters. That is probably 75 to 90 percent of the U.S. market.
 
Whars funny is that the same groups that push for electric vehicles, and nenewable electric are the same ones that vandalize equipment causing oil spills, etc, and will be the first to block a wind farm that kills birds, a solar farm that takes hundreds of acres of cleared ground, and offshore farms that block their views......on top of lobbying against the mines needed to get the material to build all the new electrical generating equipment they will eventually protest against being used.

Ultimate this issue, and whethet it succeeds or fails, has little to do with anything but seeing just how ignorant and uneducated, or just plain stupid the ones pushing for and against it at the same time ultimately turn out to be.
 
(quoted from post at 07:39:42 01/29/21) Tractors too! Cut a round of hay, charge the tractor for four hours, cut another round of hay..........

When will people actually stop and think about the job that needs to be done.
Click to expand...

If people didn't dream and invent, you'd still be swinging a hand sickle at your hay to knock it down. Maybe they'll figure it out. Maybe they won't. The first step is setting a goal.

Someone at some point in history sat in a chair and said horses would never work for farming. Even more recently, someone sat in a chair and said tractors would never work.
 
(quoted from post at 23:29:06 01/28/21) So will that also mean electric air planes etc. I cannot see it with all the problem they have out west and shutting off power all the time
Click to expand...

Excellent point. The deadheads out west can't keep their electric lights on but people believe there is some magic that will keep millions of vehicles moving.

I have no trouble believing that advances in technology will eventually make it work but that will not happen in the lifetime of any of us.
 
As I have often said, GM is the best salesman that Toyota ever had.
Best of luck to them in going all electric.

As far as electric goes, the last big breakthrough in battery technology was the development of Lithium Ion technology. But, it did not come cheap. It is very expensive environmentally. Lithium mining is a huge generator of toxic waste. Lithium itself is a toxic metal. What comes next? Even more toxic materials?

Then there is the whole electric supply debacle. While coal fired generating plants are being legislated out of existence, and there is limited replacement technology coming along, we increase our demand for electricity. Does this make sense? Not to me. Wind and solar only have limited ability to fill in for decommissioned coal fired power plants.

Then, how about the cost? I certainly would not spend in excess of $100,000 for a car to bop around town in that has limited range and long down time for charging. Maybe some of you "poor" farmers that are driving Mercedes-Benzes, BMWs, and Cadillacs would pay out that kind of money, but I will stick with something that is not as hard on the budget.
 
Columbus wasn't a genius, or lucky. He
knew the world was round, as did most
intelligent people of the era. He also
knew exactly where he was going based on
charts and writings of the Knights
Templar. The Templars knew where North
America was because the Vikings had been
here long prior to 1000 AD.
 

Problem with hydrogen is that it can not be practically stored and can not be practically transported . Plus the molecules are so small hydrogen creeps through pressure vessel wall materials.
The cost , time and energy to fill pressure vessels to 3000, 4500 or 6000psi makes H2 prohibitive . That energy used to compress is lost as heat .
The pressure vessels are also large , heavy and awkward to fit into a vehicle chassis .
Producing H2 from any source is expensive . The best source of H2 is to build enough nuclear power plants to operate the nation during daytime peak . Then the surplus capacity
during off peak to produce H2 from water .
Plan B would be to use off peak steam mixed with natural gas in the presence of a catalyst to produce clean burning alcohol.
Alcohol is relatively cheap and simple to store and use at atmospheric pressure and at ambient temperature .
 
I think parts stores are going to get busier selling parts keeping our old vehicles running,in the future Stan
 

AC and heat is what drops the range on an electric car . As the AC or heat is a significant percent of total demand at 1-5Kw . As the tractor motor is drawing 15-30Kw .
The farm tractor however producing 100,200 or 300Kw of shaft power to drive the wheels and/or PTO. Not going to even notice the demand that AC or heat uses .
 

The lead acid battery has been around since 1859 and not a whole lot has changed then.
Unless the Almighty adds some new elements to the existing periodic table . We are stuck with the existing battery
Tech as all combos of plate material and electrolyte have been tried countless times .
 
An electric vehicle would work for most of my travel needs right now. But what happpens when we get up at
7 AM in Charleston South Carolina and take off for HOME, and HOME is 1100 miles and 15 hours driving time away. Typical gas stop took 15 minutes. 15 gallons of gas, two bottles of something cold to drink, pit stop and back on the Interstate. Made 4 pit stops that day. Am I going to be expected to sit 3-4 hours and recharge my electric car? THAT will never happen. Couple years ago we went to "The OTHER coastline", Hated downtown Los Angeles so never even got out of the car, headed out of town and north to the National Parks. You get on the right roads and gas stations are few and far between. I bet electric car charging stations are even farther apart!
Last GM car I owned was far from a quality vehicle, it DID get surprisingly good mpg on one trip, but when I went to trade it the Kelley Blue Book value told me what I already knew, Nobody wants a GM car over 5 years old. It would have been cheaper to rent a car week to week. GM will limit their customer base even more than it alreadycis with this dim witted move. It very likely will be the last nail in GM's coffin.
 

Norway and other politically correct Scandinavia green weenies are that way now .
New ICE vehicle price is taxed at over 100% . Tax payers money and ironically the revenue from selling oil and gas subsidizes EVs .
Used ICE vehicles are being rebuilt and restored decades past the normal operational lifetime.
Finding serial number plates from wrecks and swapping them into out of country vehicles. Of the same make, model , year and colour is popular .
 
Biggest question I have is, how much longer will the
common man be able to afford a personal vehicle?
Will we just turn the clocks back to a time when
most folks used public transit of some kind. Trains,
and trams and lived closer to were they work
because a car is just too expensive for the average
Joe to have. Only a rich man’s toy once again
 
I would be interested in a "plug-in hybrid" like the Chev Volt- Plug in electric motor with 70 mile range, perfectly adequate for most commutes or trips to town- but a gasoline engine once the batteries are discharged, so you can go on trips.

Never work for true farming tractors- because BTO's figure on running tillage and harvest machines pretty much around the clock during busy times, which of course eliminates electric tractors.
 
yeah. the technology (high capacity, long lasting batteries) is way off and like others have said where are they going to get the power?

even switching all trains to electric which is very feasible and is done in cities and for freight in europe but to implement here 100% will take 20+ years.

the ding-a-lings want to go 0 carbon which means NO burning anything... yes. no wood stoves either.

we'd be lucky to generate enough power to go 100% electric, let alone generate (harness) enough.

so your non-carbon farming may be horses... oh wait,... we cannot make enough food with just manual labor and horse (animal) power... so not enough food... not as many people can survive... but wait, the rest of the world will NOT go along with that idea (the politicians won't either) so... . not looking good long term if things progress that way very far very fast with the goooberment driving things. we will definitely be behind everyone else,.. food, defense, technology.. economy.
 

From what I see and hear from these activists . They are willing to do anything to tear down and destroy the US and any other place with capitalism and a middle class .
 
Personally I believe the US is being played for chumps.. Europe does not have gas and oil so they have
a vested interest to discredit oil and gas as a power system and speed the development of “alternative
energy “, whatever that is...

Germany’s coal to oil conversion system that was developed in the 1920s became uneconomic when
cheap oil was discovered in Texas and the Middle East. Germany invaded Russia for living space and
the oil they had been buying from Russia.

Global warming has been going on since the Great Lakes started melting. Has global warming speeded
up in the last 100 years? I am old enough to remember a “Time” cover lamenting the coming “global
cooling”.


It could be argued that global warming, man made or just part of a long cycle, is a good thing.

The military is heavily involved in alternative energy for a very good reason. They would like to reduce
the logistics tail that is swollen by the need for oil. Nuclear power reduces that problem for Navy.

The US is full of “useful idiots”. Many of them highly placed elected officials.

For those of you unwilling to debate any of my points.. just retreat to your safe space. No need for this
thread to continue to exist.
 
Indeed, Barnyard, but it was not mandated under penalty of law. Rather the free market efficiently worked things out as it always does if goobernment allows it to do so.

Dean
 
where would all these charging stations be,they would have to many of them, in a average city, the size of a airport!
 
Diesel electric and electric are entirely different things in this context.

Diesel electric is simply a diesel prime mover with an electric transmission.

Dean
 
Not necessarily.

Case in point: There is a certain pipeline project that makes overwhelming business and economic sense that has recently been cancelled by goobernment.

Dean
 
OK, you brought up nuclear. This is what I think.

Nuclear has one BIG problem to solve before I will ever think of it as a viable replacement for other forms of energy. That problem is what to do with the waste.

Spent fuel rods stay radioactive for thousands of years. There needs to be some way found to recycle, re-use, or re-refine those into some usable form. Burying them in salt mines or encasing them in concrete is not acceptable in my opinion, and presents only a partial and temporary solution to the problem.

The scientists, developers, and operators of nuclear power plants have had about 80 years to work on this problem. So, why is it still a problem? It seems odd to me that after all of that time there is no way to deal more effectively with that problem.
 
I have parts and piece of one of those out in my iron pile. It worked but was pretty much a joke. Mow with it then push it back to the shop to charge the batteries.
 
I heard John Kerry say something to the efffect of
90% of emissions from fossil fuels comes from
other countries,not theU.S.so why do we have to
switch to e.v. and spend trillions,yes trillions to
convert AND help pay for other countries to do the
same?while China will do nothing but continue as
they are doing and be a major polluter and laugh all
the way to the bank
 

Used fuel from PWR and PHWR is not a problem . The fuel is placed in 70 ton steel and concrete flasks . Nothing is getting out and nobody is going to carry one away .
All the used fuel from eight reactors at the Bruce Site since 1977. Will fit into eight hockey arena sized sheds .
As for radioactive for millions of years . Sounds like you dont know what you are taking about .
Everything is radioactive , it is just a matter of how much . Are you panicked regarding the natural TH232, U235 and U238 being radioactive on the ground for millions of years ? Thousands of counts on the natural ore . Are you upset it will take millions of years to decay ?
The used fuel after 300 years has decayed enough that you can sit on a bundle for half an hour without exceeding your annual dose limit .
btw that used fuel can all be used in molten salt or liquid metal reactors . To date PWR instead of
Alternates have been built in the US because the retired navy staff operating them were
originally trained on military PWR
You should hear the complete and utter lies being told regarding the proposed underground storage near Teeswater .
The antis painted some dented 45 gallon barrels yellow and added the radioactive trefoil symbol in black . They heaped the barrels up for display on the beach , took pictures and told everyone it was a nuclear dump .They also photoshopped some municipal landfill images . To make people think that radioactive waste was being buried a few feet from the surface in the water table .
The proposed storage is so far below ground in a stable non porous rock formation . There is no way radio could reach the lake . Even if a fuel flask ever rusted through .
If you want something to worry about . How about toxic heavy metal that will never go away . Mercury ,lead , arsenic do no decay away ever . Where is your outrage and how well is that waste stored ? Ever heard of dioxins ? Now there is something really nasty that you should be upset about .
 
(quoted from post at 13:54:00 01/29/21) OK, you brought up nuclear. This is what I think.

Nuclear has one BIG problem to solve before I will ever think of it as a viable replacement for other forms of energy. That problem is what to do with the waste.

Spent fuel rods stay radioactive for thousands of years. There needs to be some way found to recycle, re-use, or re-refine those into some usable form. Burying them in salt mines or encasing them in concrete is not acceptable in my opinion, and presents only a partial and temporary solution to the problem.

The scientists, developers, and operators of nuclear power plants have had about 80 years to work on this problem. So, why is it still a problem? It seems odd to me that after all of that time there is no way to deal more effectively with that problem.
Click to expand...

The problem is special interest groups who make a living scaring donations from middle aged , middle class women who have been scared by the propaganda .
Add in a few peace lovers , add a bunch of mad at the world and hate everything types. Along with some narcissist types who enjoy ranting and/or rioting to obtain some attention .
The solutions are there . However politicians who want to be elected or re-elected are scared of the antis . Thus they will not make a decision . Most of the storage was designed to be temporary several decades ago . Delays just
Makes things worse .
 
A Navy buddy of mine had a hybrid car a while ago. It cost him $2500 for new batteries and then another $300 to reprogram the computer. He doesn't have it any more. $2500 is a lot of gas. Plus when the light go out gas will still work but hard to charge something back up if you don't have power
 
Bingo, Two Dogs.

I'll consider my first all electric car after Air force one and Marine One are all electric.

Dean
 
My concern is the really hot stuff. Seems like the power plants keep generating waste in the form of spent fuel
rods and that they stay at dangerous levels for long periods of time. My objection is that the best solution so far
is to encapsulate and bury the waste? Seems to me that is wasteful. After nearly 3/4 of a century, the scientists
would have figured out a way to make use of the hot stuff that is left and to re-refine it into a usable product.

My statement was not about background radiation, heavy metal contamination or any other problems that you bring up.
Those are other problems for another discussion. It just seems to me that they could have done better given the
time they have had to work on it. My opinion.
 
Almost the same as buying storage batteries for your house when the power goes out. I doubt they will power much, and they will not last forever. You can buy a good generator that will cost a lot less. Stan
 
I will NEVER understand why people like you are so terrified of electric cars! Talk about a bunch of drama queens!
 
The thing is if some get there way there will not be any fuel to power a generator unless you maybe make some moonshine and even then you still need oil for lube and if they get there way there will be none of gas/diesel/oil
 
When it becomes possible to fly a jumbo jet from NYC to Paris on battery power alone or drive a full size electric car ( that sells for $20,000.00 OR LESS)from NYC to L.A. without having to stop to charge the batteries CHEAPLY, THEN talk to me about doing away with gas and oil.
 
(quoted from post at 21:00:18 01/29/21) My concern is the really hot stuff. Seems like the power plants keep generating waste in the form of spent fuel
rods and that they stay at dangerous levels for long periods of time. My objection is that the best solution so far
is to encapsulate and bury the waste? Seems to me that is wasteful. After nearly 3/4 of a century, the scientists
would have figured out a way to make use of the hot stuff that is left and to re-refine it into a usable product.

My statement was not about background radiation, heavy metal contamination or any other problems that you bring up.
Those are other problems for another discussion. It just seems to me that they could have done better given the
time they have had to work on it. My opinion.
Click to expand...

I tried to tell you what is dangerous and what is perceived as dangerous .
Also tried to tell you that used PWR fuel is what Molten Salt and Liquid metal reactors use for fresh fuel .
I am trying to find the image of one of my kids standing in front of a used fuel dry flask . Standing Four feet away from the used fuel bundles and the gamma dose was less than 2.5 milli rem above background .
There is lots of stuff out there more dangerous , more plentiful and easier accessed than used fuel .
 
(quoted from post at 21:30:31 01/29/21) I will NEVER understand why people like you are so terrified of electric cars! Talk about a bunch of drama queens!
Click to expand...

There is nobody here terrified of EVs . That is a figment of your imagination . Some of your other imagined ideas are such as EVs are going to save the world from famine , war and disease .
 
WI have never said that I was terrified of electric cars.

I gave up trying to read the minds of others in my late teens/early 20s because I was never any good at doing so and routinely made false assumptions.

You should give up such adolescent practices as well because you are no good at it either.

Dean
 
There came an add over the radio about would use light rail if
we build one . Do you suppose they’ll build one that will carry
my saddle horse and a load of cows to and from the summer
range ?
 
I dont think that any of us are terrified about going to all electric cars...We just have lots of questions about them..Mileage range before a charge, cost of the battery, battery life,availability of charging stations on trips and the cost to quick charge, cost of the car,will lots of problems pop up-etc..

California has power black outs now...They are going to have to spend a fortune for new power sources..

Will the greenies eventually want the internal combustion engine totally banned from even being used..That means no motorsports of any kind, no antique tractors or cars-etc..Theres lots to think about..Lots of us are too old to have to worry about it..
 

The technology to make electric vehicles is very solid. However, for the first time in 100 years, the USA is energy independent on oil and gas. No dependence on rogue dictators in the middle east.

But instead of embracing this situation, we want to shift to electric vehicles and we will be just as dependent on China and West Africa for the rare earths needed for the batteries and other electronic parts. So a new group of rogue dictators.

The environmental footprint of an electric vehicle is enormous. For one car 5000 tones of earth has to be moved to mine the rare earths.

Makes no sense and is stupid Government Leadership.
 

Seems like GM should be able to do it if they get the batteries figured out. They have had their ElectroMotive Division for years. Back when I was an onshore and offshore driller in the middle east, we used thousand hp electric motors to power the drawworks which were powered from generators on 1000 and 2000 horse EMD engines. Had to have an EMD mechanic on board. They are the same motors, gearing, and engines that EMD supplies for railroad engines. A lot different from stepping on the pedal of a diesel engine powered drawworks and then step on the pedal of a big electric rig and there is no noise except when you hear the EMD rev up down below. Those EMD's are like Cummins engines in that they don't rev very high and they go from idle to full power quickly. Just the same when listening to a train engine. Best thing about the electric motor drawworks is when you are running in 25,000 feet of drill collars, weightpipe, and drillpipe you don't need to use the brake as use just hold the lever applying reverse power to lower the pipe down the hole.
 
Cross country not so worrisome. Over open water , think Atlantic and Pacific oceans, while different ball game. Next they will propose to make the top or the plane and wings out of solar cells.

Vito
 

I suppose the word solid means high priced and subsidized by the tax payer .
Do tell us what is going to power medium and HD
Mobile applications ?
 
Yes,China controls 90% of the earth metals to make batteries for electric vehicles..They did an embargo about 10 years ago that made the price of them skyrocket...
 
(quoted from post at 16:27:05 01/29/21) I heard John Kerry say something to the efffect of
90% of emissions from fossil fuels comes from
other countries,not theU.S.so why do we have to
switch to e.v. and spend trillions,yes trillions to
convert AND help pay for other countries to do the
same?while China will do nothing but continue as
they are doing and be a major polluter and laugh all
the way to the bank
Click to expand...
rman61 asks why? To help make America weak, poor, and its citizens dependent.
 
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