53 NAA CHARGING PROBLEMS

53jube · Jan 31, 2020

Been having troubles with the charging system on my tractor. I rebuilt the generator. It motors on the bench just fine, so I did a voltage regulator test and it showed I needed a new VR. Got a new one and put it on and polarized, and it started charging like a champ, for about an hour or so, the tractor spit and sputtered and died. Started right back up, but not charging once again. 0 on ammeter at idle. If you rev it up the needle jumps all over the place, and at a high rpm it will show -30 discharge, and as it comes back to idle, the needle goes back to zero on ammeter. I?ve replaced about everything I can think of, starter solenoid, coil, points and condenser, wiring harness, VR, plug wires, rebuilt Generator, battery shows 6volts when tested. Any ideas? I don?t know if I may have a short somewhere maybe, what electrical components would cause a short to not charge anymore? Dist. Coil. Ignition switch. Been messing with this for a long while now, and it seems when I get it fixed it shows its ugly face again!! Thanks

Janicholson · Jan 31, 2020

Finding a good voltage regulator is difficult. The OEM NOS are hard to find. (original Equipment manufacturer, New (but) Old Stock parts) There are solid state regulators that are put in original looking housings that work well but cost. Jim

J.Wondergem · Jan 31, 2020

Voltage regulator made in China?

Jim L WA · Jan 31, 2020

I went through exactly the same thing on my '54 NAA, not replacing all those parts, just the charging (V.R.)trouble. I finally gave up and converted to 12 volt. I'm not a bit sorry except that I have a perfectly good 6 volt battery that needs a good home.

rustred · Jan 31, 2020

its the regulator , with all these change overs to 12 volts on here you would think somebody has a good used regulator. I throw nothing out like that.

DeltaRed · Jan 31, 2020

That is exactly why I don't mess with those old 6 volt systems anymore. At the first sign of trouble I just cut and yank everything. I install a 12-volt 1 wire Delco alternator in its place and a hour of rewire time it is done. No more problems. Ever.

rustred · Jan 31, 2020

but I like everything original the way the tractor came. seeing an alternator don't interest me. I collect only nice original tractors. but yes the change over is easy. depends on what a person wants, as a daily tractor the alt. would be more practical but so is keeping things in the 6 volt system up to snuff. each to his own. as for true collector value the original is worth more.

jeffcat · Jan 31, 2020

There is a company that takes your generator and builds one of those small alternators into it. You can't even tell anything has been modified. Someone will chime in.

53jube · Jan 31, 2020

It says made in USA, got it from Napa. But who knows.

53jube · Jan 31, 2020

This is the 3rd VR I?ve put on it, minus the original one that lasted 65 years, lol. Are the new VR?s really that crappy, and that I?ve got 3 in a row that are junk? Im definitely not opposed to going 12 volt, i was just thinking It may be something simple I?m missing on my 6volt system.I use this tractor pretty regularly, so it?s starting to become a pain in the butt. If I were to go 12v, What all exactly would I need to do it. I?ve seen the kits online, but if I could go to Napa or something and get it all there I?d rather do that.

gene bender · Jan 31, 2020

so where did you get the regulator is it the model made for your generator they do need to match

53jube · Jan 31, 2020

I got the new one, well all of them actually from Napa. It is the correct one for the tractor. U think maybe I should try a different brand. I took the cap off one of the other VR?s a couple days ago and it was charred up inside and one of the contacts were almost welded closed.

Tgrasher · Jan 31, 2020

Had same problem and I found a wire strand the was grounding at a connection on the generator.

53jube · Jan 31, 2020

Did it fry your voltage regulator every time it grounded? Or
was it ok once you took care of that strand.

53jube · Jan 31, 2020

I was blading the driveway when it happened. And caught a
hard spot in the road, Gave the tractor a little jolt, nothing big,
and that?s when it happened, was thinking when it jolted
maybe something touched.

Steve@Advance · Jan 31, 2020

One thing that comes to mind is a vibration related short to ground. A chaffed, burned, pinched wire intermittently arcing to ground. That would explain the -30 amp reading and the engine dying, then restarting.

I would start with a close examination of the wiring, followed by a regulator bypass to check the generator.

Be sure the regulator base is well grounded.

53jube · Jan 31, 2020

Sounds good that what I?ll do, thanks a lot! Also do you think this could have burned up my VR?

Tgrasher · Jan 31, 2020

No I got lucky! i'm no expert and probably shouldn't be allowed to mess with a tractor but I have this sickness that won't let me pass an old one by without trying to fix what's wrong with it. Try checking each wire for continuity (tractor not running) and see if one stands out different.

53jube · Jan 31, 2020

Cool. Will do, Thanks a lot!

Bob · Jan 31, 2020

(quoted from post at 19:00:07 01/31/20) Been having troubles with the charging system on my tractor. I rebuilt the generator. It motors on the bench just fine, so I did a voltage regulator test and it showed I needed a new VR. Got a new one and put it on and polarized, and it started charging like a champ, for about an hour or so, the tractor spit and sputtered and died. Started right back up, but not charging once again. 0 on ammeter at idle. If you rev it up the needle jumps all over the place, and at a high rpm it will show -30 discharge, and as it comes back to idle, the needle goes back to zero on ammeter. I?ve replaced about everything I can think of, starter solenoid, coil, points and condenser, wiring harness, VR, plug wires, rebuilt Generator, battery shows 6volts when tested. Any ideas? I don?t know if I may have a short somewhere maybe, what electrical components would cause a short to not charge anymore? Dist. Coil. Ignition switch. Been messing with this for a long while now, and it seems when I get it fixed it shows its ugly face again!! Thanks

Where is the chassis ground cable connected?

If to the dash pedestal structure, use a longer cable, if necessary and connect it to one of the starter bolts.

Run a 10 gauge or larger ground wire from there to the dash structure, making sure the attachment point is clean of paint and rust.

Note which voltage regulator bolt(s) grounds the regulator, and make sure that area is clean, as well.

Point is that, with paint, rust, and age sometimes the steel dash structure is no longer 100% grounded ti the cast iron chassis of the tractor, and that can affect the charging system.

John T · Feb 1, 2020

Jube a faulty/loose/corroded/resistive ground (or any wiring) connection can cause all sorts of failures. BOTH the Voltage Regulator as well as the Generator NEED GOOD GROUNDS.

My Charging Troubleshooting Procedure linked below can help find the problem, work through it step by step

https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cgi-bin/viewit.cgi?bd=ttalk&th=2060825

John T
John Ts Charging Troubleshooting

John-MI · Feb 1, 2020

I had the same problem on an 8n. Finally I was advised to find an AMERICAN made VR, not a China made one. I went thru 2 new ones before I got it working correctly. Try this if you don't find a bad wire or problem else where, before buying a new vr. Hths.

John-MI · Feb 1, 2020

PS to my above message . You can take the VRback to NAPA and ask them iftheycan check it out Possibly it is just a bad regulator. Even because it came from NAPA it still may have came from China and they just don't work! Find a USA made one which you may have to go to a newholland dealer to get an OE one.. It. Will be more expensive than other places.

David G · Feb 1, 2020

Personally, I think there is something simple, but would never put any dollars in 6V system, buy an alternator.

jimtrs · Feb 1, 2020

(quoted from post at 20:07:28 01/31/20) Finding a good voltage regulator is difficult.

Yup

(quoted from post at 21:22:18 01/31/20) This is the 3rd VR I?ve put on it, minus the original one that lasted 65 years, lol. Are the new VR?s really that crappy

Yup

and that I?ve got 3 in a row that are junk?

Yup BTDT

Realize that Ford NAA originally used a "B" circuit design in their generator. These "B" circuit charging systems require a matching voltage regulator. If you use the more common, off the shelf "A" circuit Voltage regulator, you will fry something.

"A" circuit generators, are controlled by the regulator varying the [b:b7afb33c28][i:b7afb33c28]ground [/i:b7afb33c28][/b:b7afb33c28]to the field.
"B" circuit generators, the regulator [b:b7afb33c28][i:b7afb33c28]applies current[/i:b7afb33c28][/b:b7afb33c28] to the field, which was internally grounded.

IMHO "B" circuit charging systems are not one of Ford's better idea's. There may be valid reasons for the design, but unfortunately the confusion they have caused over the years outweigh any benefit, again, IMHO

53jube · Feb 2, 2020

So I checked all the wiring today, went over all the grounds, and cleaned them all up nice, everything seems ok in that department. Charged the battery up, shows 6.0-6.2v. Start it up run it around half throttle, check the battery, and it bounces around 7.0-8.0v, run it full throttle, -30 discharge. 5.8-6.0v. Pretty sure that ain?t right, lol. But I could be wrong, have been plenty. The ?only? thing I haven?t messed with is the ammeter. It?s the loop through design, not studs. I didn?t really think that had much weight on anything, since it still seems like it?s reading. Discharge and charge. Anymore ideas????? 12v lookin more and more appealing HAH!!

53 NAA CHARGING PROBLEMS

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