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Dang! I thought this only was a local problem.....

G

Greg1959

Well-known Member
from my farming/selling produce back in Kentucky!

When I started selling produce that I raised on my farm at the local Farmers Market, I notice a lot of other vendors selling produce that wasn't even in season yet. I'd ask them if they grew it on their farm and they would say Yes, they grew it. (Even though I could see sealed produce boxes in the bed of their truck.

I thought this problem was just a local thing and I quit selling a the Farmers Market because of this SCAM.

Come to find out it is a bigger fraud than I thought.

The link is a investigative report about this abuse and fraud....


Do ant of y'all encounter this?
Poke Here
 
If there is a buck to be made.......

It?s disappointing, and I don?t do farmers market sales, but dang.

I know the early sweet corn gets the best sales, so here in Minnesota you see sweet corn stands way before it?s possible to have corn ready - it is brought up from Iowa.

Paul
 
Its still sweet corn, and it is home grown, at someone's home in Iowa.lol I don't do farmers markets. gobble
 
I live not too far from Peterborough, and I am aware of the controversy around reselling at their farmers market. As a farmer, and former maker gardener, I can?t understand how people could be so foolish as to believe much of the produce sold at that market could be grown locally. Plain truth is people are suckers. In Ontario where I live you get very little out of the garden in June, and not much in July either. August is the first month local tomatoes and peppers become available. For example, it isn?t really safe to transplant tomatoes much before May 15th. So how could anyone dream of getting a ripe tomato before the middle of July? Farmers markets are agricultural entertainment. And I feel sorry far the folks that try to grow a self their own products. I had a road side stand beside my four acres of garden, and people could see the vegetable plants growing. And I often let folks go and look around.
 
svcummins- "The whole thing is a scam ! It?s all grown on a farm so who cares not me."

What are you talking about? Would you please clarify?
- "
 
Apparently "country folks" are not above a little slight of hand, just like the "city folks" they like to distrust.
 
We are all PT Barnum when it comes to selling ourselves or what we are offering.

Home grown, fresh.

It is what it is, but I feel sorry for the real locals trying to do it their way.

Paul
 
paul- "We are all PT Barnum when it comes to selling ourselves or what we are offering."

So, are you and svcummins saying it is okay with you to lie and exaggerate the truth just so you can sell your product?
 
I've been reading your posts for many years. I did not realize you were from Peterborough Aye! I have spent many a fun weekend in your
there-a-bouts with good chums, running dog field trials. Alas we are all getting old and too creaky to do that now. Plus I now live 500 miles south. Yours is a beautiful landscape. I love that part of Canada. Spent many a wonderful evening at Stratford. Cheers!
 
If you are in business with a product to sell you put your best foot forward.

Don?t you?

Somebody is going to go two feet forward.

Another is going to take three steps forward.

Whomever makes the most sales wins.

At some point buyers get tired of the claims, and it all goes back to the beginning.

And starts over, with someone taking one more step forward......

It is what business is.

Where I or SV or you stop or go doesn?t so much matter.

In general, human nature, the people you and I buy from are the people that step an extra step or two. That?s how they got where they are.

Then.

The people buying are too busy, and too uninterested, and too trusting, and so on that they don?t check into it themselves. Are you trying to give them a free pass? They buy ?feel good? story without bothering to see if it?s remotely right.....

I?m not commenting on me or you or SV.

I?m commenting on human nature at large. The ?all of us.?

Paul
 
paul- - You equate it to 'Human Nature' that it is okay to lie and take advantage of others?

That is where I i differ from you and SV. I can't lie or obfuscate the truth. I never sold anything that I claimed to grow but obtained from another wholesaler.

That's just me. I won't lie.
 
So a bunch of spoiled yuppie dummies have no idea what may be in season in their area where they probably lived all of their lives? What is unique about that? They don't have a clue but they follow whatever current fad their equally vacuous friends and associates are following and then stare down their noses at the rest of us. They are easy marks because they are not only stupid but also too arrogant to learn anything, instead they want the government to pick out their tomatoes and carrots, lord help us.
 
Absolutely not, or at least not represented as a breeding heifer but that is a little different, I would sell a good heifer to someone that I bought at the sale barn which is actually just re-selling which is what most of these people seem to be doing. The guy on the board of directors stated that the market board encouraged vendors to source produce when out of season to keep the market open and viable, he also correctly stated that the demand would make the market. True practicioners of sustainability or whatever they call eating only what is in season and local settle for just that, others wanting more selection and variety in their produce should educate themselves as to their options and not cry foul because some entrepreneur gives them what they want, unless of course they are selling some markedly inferior product and labeling it otherwise but that did not seem to be the accusation at all in this case.
 
LAA- "...because some entrepreneur gives them what they want, unless of course they are selling some markedly inferior product and labeling it otherwise...".

I don't see it as selling "markedly inferior product". The sellers are offering produce for sale that they specifically say that they grew it on their farm. Therefore, implying that it was locally grown, thus they are trying to take advantage of the Locally Grown concept.

So, to take the last part of your statement..."labeling it otherwise." That is exactly what they did. It is a pure lie.
 
No one has mentioned the bigger half of the scam. It's the folks who own/control the markets and in some cases, those who regulate them. They use/need the resellers to generate revenue for them. Did anyone catch the comment from the two farmers who mentioned what happens to a real farmer who complains about what's going on. This is a good example of what happens when customers take no responsibility for the food they eat.
 
LAA- I failed to add your last statement in your reply....."but that did not seem to be the accusation at all in this case."


WHAT? That was the premise of this whole report....Sellers were filmed removing growers labels so they could represent their wares as that they had grown them on their own farms.
 
Greg, when it comes to peddling lies I don't think what those people are doing is on scale with people selling ''good sam'' policies for travel trailers or ''extended warranties'' that kick in for a few months after your vehicle manufacturers warranty expires. Look at corporate America, probably 95% of products labeled ''made in USA'' would not stand up under scrutiny, or even what is written in their own fine print, trying not to use the excuse ''everybody does it'', but the fact is many do a lot worse. In the example of this produce, at least the people are getting what they want whether it was picked by Dick and Jane out of Mr. Mcgregors garden or not.
 
vCheck Break- "This is a good example of what happens when
customers take no responsibility for the food they eat."

So, when I go to the local butcher and order 10 pounds of ground
beef.....it's up to me (the customer) to qualify this is ground
beef and not ground horse meat?
"
 
LAA- it was picked by Dick and Jane out of Mr. Mcgregors garden". LOLOLOL, I like it. LOL

I'm not talking about the 'other' stuff you posted about. My post was about sellers misrepresenting their wares as locally grown on THEIR farms. They are lying and you seem to be OK with that falsehood.

Am I correct?

Yes or No?
 
My statement "but that did not seem to be the accusation at all in this case." was in reference to inferior products, no on seemed to be whining about ther quality of the produce.
 
I guess if only yes or no will suffice then I am OK with them lying about their produce, only the dumb will be fooled. The reason I am OK is because there would seem to be little recourse to stop it other than some sort of governmental regulation or action and I am 100,000% percent opposed to further governmental interference in peoples every day lives, whether in Canada or the USA, people need to learn to look out for themselves.
 
Maybe some people are suckers but hey Don't Blame the Victim! If the seller is a liar and a thief makes no difference who the customer is,the seller is still a liar and
a thief.And you can bet your last Buck$ if they are a liar and a thief in the produce business they are the same in everything else they do.
 
Some of the local farmers markets in my area have expelled sellers for reselling produce as its against their rules and regulations.A roadside stand was put out of business
not far from me that resold produce and claimed they were selling only what them and their neighbors raised.Postings were all over Facebook and Craigslist about them.Local grown,organic etc is big business in my and people take violations and lying by sellers seriously.
 
I used to laugh about the vendor who was selling pineapples and bananas at the local farmers market. Now we have a rule that it has to be grown by the seller, or labeled otherwise. But it actually helps most farmer markets to allow some re-selling, because local things are not always available. Especially when the first market is in late May, I struggle to have much produce ready by then, at least not the popular stuff. So I sell green onions, bunches of Swiss chard, heads of cabbage, green tomatoes, etc until ripe tomatoes and green beans and corn are ready. The only thing I sell that I don't grow is small red potatoes to go with green beans. It is much more efficient to buy potatoes on the wholesale market that were produced on a large scale with a mechanical digger and washer, than it is for me to try and dig, clean, sort, and store all those potatoes. But hey, I have 6 grandsons now, so if I can get them motivated to grow potatoes, there is some money to be made there for sure.
 
I was in Key Largo a few years ago in February. Stopped off at a produce stand to buy some large sweet imported onions.
One batch of onion had the green tops and roots were still attached. I Asked the young girl, where were these onions grown? She said in the dirt.
That's when I decided to have a little fun.
I pointed to onions without tops and roots and asked if these were grown in the dirt?
She didn't know. A co-worker had to tell they too were grown in the dirt.
Some kids aren't as smart as they may think.
Geo
 
I remember years ago when we lived in Bay City, MI, the next town west of us, Auburn, had a "sweet corn festival" in June. All the corn came from Florida in semis!
 
Didn't watch all the way through but I have a few observations. The documentary folks weren't exactly honest either. Over and over the question was " is it yours" NOT did you grow it. My guess is 99.9 percent were honest. They owned it and they were selling it. I did hear the one guy lie and say yes it was grown on his farm. There was no point in that. Any idiot should know better.

At our Farmers market if you took away the re sellers there wouldn't be over half a dozen left. The few that actually grow and sell only their own stuff are easy to spot.

I reckon my take from this is the yuppies are so used to having their thoughts spoon fed to them they don't bother to think for themselves. If they did there wouldn't be an issue. Just to be absolutely clear those that actually do lie when asked are dead wrong. At the same time those who go to a Farmers market expecting to find nothing but locally grown organic food need to take the blinders off and use their brains for a change.
 
In our community its hard to get enough actual farmers to have a large enough market to attract the big crowds. It is actually way more work to take produce to a farmers market than it is to sell at the farm. This is why the prices are higher. I can sell it for so much less at the farm and still make money. For example, a zucchini or cucumber that may be priced at $1 or $1.50 at the farmers market, I still sell for $.50 at my roadside stand. Watermelon at the market are $5-6 but off the wagon under the tree in my yard they are $3.00. Not only is it cheaper at the farm stand, it is also fresher and probably larger. I try to pick corn at daylight to take to the market, but usually have to pick some the night before. Most everyone selling there has it picked the day before or even longer. At the farm stand, I pick corn throughout the day, so it often is sold right out of the field. Its not uncommon to take smaller melons to the farm market, because I can haul more and they are easier to handle and for customers to carry. So what would be picked over and not even sold for $3 at the farm, I can take to the city farm market and sell for $5 and they are thrilled to get it! But in the summer my time is worth a premium, so if I have to personally load up, haul to town, and stand there most of the day waiting for someone to buy stuff, I have to charge a premium to make it worth it.

Bottom line is farmers markets may be neat and interesting, but not efficient or economical way to supply food.
 
I grew fresh market vegetables for quite a few years and marketed them at 3 different farmers markets. Different Markets have different rules. 2 that I went to allowed dealers (resellers) , one did not. One good thing about allowing dealers is that people can find out of season products as well as things that can?t be grown locally, which helps build up market clientele. The dealers usually pay higher market fees, but it was very common for a lot of the people who came in as a farmer selling their own products to buy in some/ most of what they sold. The people on the one side of me for years did this quite a bit but I never complained because they were nice people and we would help each other out when it was busy. I always figured that resellers have a lot more money in their bought in stuff compared to me with my own produce so they could never undercut me too much. I am sure anyone who was ever in this business has plenty of stories about this topic as I do. One more thing to consider , many of the larger roadside markets also buy in a lot of products to resell and I bet a lot of the customers don?t know the difference.
 
I always like to stop and buy produce at farmer owned stands,but for many people living in the city its not practical for them to have to travel a lot of miles around the countryside to buy from farmers.So they are willing to pay a premium at a local farmers market where its more handy for them,a place for both styles of selling for sure.
 
The greater issue really isn't where the produce comes from but for the sellers to be up front about what they are selling and where it comes from,how its grown etc.When the seller is reselling produce and says it was grown on their farm then that is fraud,on the other hand if they say they picked it up at the local produce wholesaler and brought it to the market to resell then its not a problem.Then the buyer can decide to buy or not with truthful information.
 
(quoted from post at 20:17:14 01/17/20) from my farming/selling produce back in Kentucky!

When I started selling produce that I raised on my farm at the local Farmers Market, I notice a lot of other vendors selling produce that wasn't even in season yet. I'd ask them if they grew it on their farm and they would say Yes, they grew it. (Even though I could see sealed produce boxes in the bed of their truck.

I thought this problem was just a local thing and I quit selling a the Farmers Market because of this SCAM.

Come to find out it is a bigger fraud than I thought.

The link is a investigative report about this abuse and fraud....


Do ant of y'all encounter this?
Poke Here
Click to expand...

Happens. But you have to look at state law too. Fella here ran a bunch of stands selling locally grown veggies. Now this is MN and I don't care who you are you ain't got corn ready in May. Yet every year. And completely legal. Fella owned farms between here and GA. The corn came from one of his farms. As far as the state was concerned because all the farms were under the same name it was grown by a local farmer.

Here the problem at the farmers market was/is price fixing. They told you what you had to get per item/pound as a minimum. My wife tried it to get rid of more veggies than we could consume. She wound up giving the extra to locals who needed a little extra help.

Rick
 
Yes I agree. Especially when the market rules say that every thing is supposed to be grown by the seller and you know some people are buying a lot of stuff in to resell.
 
(quoted from post at 00:52:23 01/18/20) vCheck Break- "This is a good example of what happens when customers take no responsibility for the food they eat."

So, when I go to the local butcher and order 10 pounds of ground
beef.....it's up to me (the customer) to qualify this is ground
beef and not ground horse meat?
"
Click to expand...

No, but it is your responsibility to take your money elsewhere, file a complaint with the regulating authority unless it's an act of futility, and let others know what's going on so they can decide for themselves whether they want to shop there.

This goes on all over. The only way to stop it is to know your farmer and know how s/he grows the food s/he sells.
 
do not come up with that WE crap unless you have a mouse in your pocket!!!!
it is amazing that you think lying should be first nature of the human species.....
 
I occasionally go to the local farmer's market, but never buy much because I grow a garden. One gal had carrots in bunches, and right beside had identical carrots but still dirty, with sign "Didn't have time to wash" and a lower price. I guess there's no question about who grew those! I kidded her a little bit about the sign, and she said "I guess people really like my carrots, and I always get complaints when I run out. So this time, I decided I wasn't going to run out! I've got more dirty ones in the truck, if I need them."
 

A little different twist on my story, we had a guy up the road that was growing sweetcorn. His fields looked terrible, weeds were taller than the corn. He sold out of his pickup at an intersection down the road from us as we were on a busy road and he wasn't. Our clean fields of tall corn were right along the road where we sold roadside on our property. I sent my wife down to see what he was selling his corn for. She went down and talked to him for awhile and asked him where he grew his corn. He gave directions to our farm! Had another customer that actually came and bragged about getting purple ribbons on our produce she took to the county fair....didn't know is I should be pizzed or proud LOL!
 
Eldon- I really liked your setup/farm. You grow wonderful
produce. I thought about using you as a good example of a
'roadside' stand but I didn't want your name confused with what
my post was intended.

You, Sir. grow great produce!

Please tell Ms. Eldon hello from Chris,Greg and Dog.
 
You seem intent on trying to judge other people. That?s not a virtue either......

I?m saying get a group of 100 people together, and some will be pretty good some will be pretty bad some will be in between.

I think that is human nature and something we have to expect as we go through life.

I don?t think anyone is perfect, I?m not. I also don?t want to judge you. Maybe you are the oerfect person in the world.

Frankly I?m a little lost on this conversation, you seem to want to accuse people of something, it doesn?t sound very nice? I?m trying to talk about people in general, not myself, not SV.

Not important, I don?t need to score any points here.

Have a good day.

Paul
 
(quoted from post at 11:44:26 01/18/20) Eldon- I really liked your setup/farm. You grow wonderful
produce. I thought about using you as a good example of a
'roadside' stand but I didn't want your name confused with what
my post was intended.

You, Sir. grow great produce!

Please tell Ms. Eldon hello from Chris,Greg and Dog.
Click to expand...

Thanks, we are planning to sell a little more corn and onions this summer just to give Ms. Eldon something to do :)
 
Ha! Retire, indeed. A "little more corn and onions this summer", pretty soon you'll be right back in it. As my grandma used to say, you can take the boy off of the farm, but you can't take the farm out of the boy!

Speaking of onions, the ones I grew from sets didn't get very big. I'd like to grow some bigger ones, but with full onion flavor (Walla Walla Sweet onions are for those who don't like onions). Any suggestions on growing soft-ball size onions- varieties, sources, etc. I'm pretty good on soil fertility- everything else did great. I'm in western Washington, by the way. Summers are getting hotter, so heat units no longer seems to be much of a problem.
 
(quoted from post at 14:12:23 01/18/20) Ha! Retire, indeed. A "little more corn and onions this summer", pretty soon you'll be right back in it. As my grandma used to say, you can take the boy off of the farm, but you can't take the farm out of the boy!

Speaking of onions, the ones I grew from sets didn't get very big. I'd like to grow some bigger ones, but with full onion flavor (Walla Walla Sweet onions are for those who don't like onions). Any suggestions on growing soft-ball size onions- varieties, sources, etc. I'm pretty good on soil fertility- everything else did great. I'm in western Washington, by the way. Summers are getting hotter, so heat units no longer seems to be much of a problem.
Click to expand...

My wife retired, not me :( . I need to have a cash crop just so I can still claim farmer status! Sold the place I was selling the hay off of the last 2 years. I till for a local church garden and got them hooked on candy onions, contacted them a bit too late last month and they had already ordered their plants (I usually buy a case and sell them some out of it). I guess they have enough other people interested that they bought their own case....so we will have 1800+ plants in order to get a case discount. They grow 1-3# in our soil, they are an intermediate day onion, but we fool them by planting in March, they are ready to harvest in July. We still have about 20# left to eat even though they are listed as two month storage. We order them from Dixondale out of Texas, you can get them at other places, but we have had the best luck direct from the grower. They are sold in bunches of 60 plants.
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