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Electric Cars Have Been Around For A Few Centuries

8

8NChris

Member
For a book report subject I chose Henry Ford. This article reminded me of some of the things I learned about electric cars. energy.gov/articles/history-electric-car

Set aside all the man made problems from greed, many here have hit on the problem of an electric vehicle, the battery. Think on how far advanced electric cars would be now if he had not helped accidentally kill them. I do not remember a lot of the particulars but I do not remember Ford being against electric cars. He actually had an investment in there success.

In my opinion I see the true success of electric cars when universal quick change batteries are available like petroleum fuel is now.
 
Yes! and the spare battery could be charged by solar panels. Here in Arizona we are seeing more and more covered parking with solar panels on top, now if you could pug in the car while parked what a win-win situation. It's probably happening in some places. I just read in the paper this morning about shutting down some of the coal fired plants in N AZ, good deal!
 
I had heard that before, the sales targeted wealthy women.

Look at the interior in the slide show, that was a top of the line car!
 
And meanwhile Russ, natural gas will keep the lights on in Arizona while the folks out there wait on solar to take over. My point is gas is replacing coal, not solar.
cvphoto1721.jpg
 
I don't see quick change batteries as a viable solution for electric cars.

First thing to consider is that batteries have a finite lifetime. Say you go and buy a new electric car with a new battery in it. When it runs down out on the road, you pull into a place that has quick change batteries. They take your shiny new battery out and replace it with one that is a few days away from the end of its useful life. Do you like that idea? Neither do I.

Unless and until some means of tracking a battery's usage and condition comes along, that scenario could happen. Until then, quick change batteries will remain as a utopian pipe dream.
 
Both Navajo Generating Station in Page, AZ. and Black Mesa Coal Mine shut down weeks ago. Black Mesa Mine used to slurry coal 273 miles from Kayenta, AZ. to Laughlin, NV. That power plant shut down years ago when it was too expense to do upgrades and restart. Big underground slurry tube abandoned. Lots of people out of work.
 
Yes they have been and even today they can?t
make one that you can drive and run the heater at
the same time . John Deere had a gas turbine
tractor and so did ih and who else I don?t know that
was supposed to change the world but here we are
40 - 50 years later and still can?t beat a Diesel
engine .
cvphoto1727.jpg


cvphoto1728.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 13:51:53 01/08/20) I don't see quick change batteries as a viable solution for electric cars.

First thing to consider is that batteries have a finite lifetime. Say you go and buy a new electric car with a new battery in it. When it runs down out on the road, you pull into a place that has quick change batteries. They take your shiny new battery out and replace it with one that is a few days away from the end of its useful life. Do you like that idea? Neither do I.

Unless and until some means of tracking a battery's usage and condition comes along, that scenario could happen. Until then, quick change batteries will remain as a utopian pipe dream.
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o you really think that old batteries are going to be mindlessly installed or do you suppose there may be some sort of thought put into the process?
 
In those "centuries of being around", they sure did not make much headway. Probably a reason. :roll:
 
Where do you get a "few centuries?"

To the best of my knowledge, there were no cars without an animal pulling them for much more than 130 years. I have heard of electric cars dating back to the 1880s but even then they were not heard of. Since electricity to the homes and businesses was not widely available until the time of Edison and Westinghouse, there was no way to recharge a battery.

By definition, a century is 100 years. A couple means two according to Webster. Few refers to three or more according to common definition. So, you are saying in essence that electric cars have been around for over 300 years? Since before electricity was discovered and harnessed?

Sorry, I call baloney on that one.
 
the late 19th, entire 20th, and early 21st century. Three separate centuries spanning 130-140 years of electric automobiles.
 
(quoted from post at 18:54:54 01/08/20) Where do you get a "few centuries?"

To the best of my knowledge, there were no cars without an animal pulling them for much more than 130 years. I have heard of electric cars dating back to the 1880s but even then they were not heard of. Since electricity to the homes and businesses was not widely available until the time of Edison and Westinghouse, there was no way to recharge a battery.

By definition, a century is 100 years. A couple means two according to Webster. Few refers to three or more according to common definition. So, you are saying in essence that electric cars have been around for over 300 years? Since before electricity was discovered and harnessed?

Sorry, I call baloney on that one.
Click to expand...
t is evident that a couple of you simply glanced at the title and drew conclusions. Seems normal on the internet. If either of you had read the post itself and the website I pasted both of your negative comments are answered.
 
(quoted from post at 20:34:47 01/08/20) the late 19th, entire 20th, and early 21st century. Three separate centuries spanning 130-140 years of electric automobiles.
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ooks like you read the posted website. I thought it was interesting that the idea was around in the 1700's and in operation very early on.
 
The title of your post was rather
misleading. I knew there was some
experimenting with electric cars in the
late 19th century but that is only about
about 1.4 centuries ago. It is
definitely not a "few" centuries as jimg
has explained.
When they build an electric 3/4 ton
pickup that will let me hook up my
trailer and run down to Des Moines to
fetch a 2 ton tractor and haul it home
the same day I might show some interest
in electric vehicles. In the meantime
I'll continue to think of EVs as for the
croissant and latte crowd who live in
high rise condos and think a long trip
is running from Minneapolis to St Paul
to attend a book signing by Elon Musk.
 
Electric cars will never be more than a
niche market. Sure they are making
progress with them all the time BUT the
main problem I see is no different than
the nuclear power plants. What are you
going to do with all the hazardous waste?
 
Electric cars will never become mainstream until the range matches that of a similar sized gas car in a 1 tank to one charge ratio and a full 100% charge takes no more time than gassing a car up.

They sold about 300,000 EV's in the US last year. They sold over 17 million new cars last year in the US including EV's.

Seems funny to me that of renewable energy sources wind and solar can produce about 7.5% of US electricity needs total if and only IF every wind tower and and every solar panel is working at 100% capacity every minute of every day and every night nation wide. But over 60% of US electricity is produced by fossil fuels. And you want to charge cars on an already over taxed electric grid?

Seems to me that if the environment is such a concern that one would not be on a site that promotes the preservation and use of pollution belching antique tractors. Why wouldn't a true environmentalist have no equipment like that or only have new tier IV diesel tractors to protect the environment?????

Rick
 
If electric vehicles did become a lot more popular how long before some gov't agency requires a meter on the rechargers and puts on a road tax?Not long I'd think.
 
The one thing that can make electric vehicles cost effective is the gov't puts an extremely high tax on gasoline and diesel to make electric the most cost effective.Which
if the right/wrong crowd gets in charge could very well happen.
 
When I was a kid back in the 30's in Akron Ohio Mrs. Harvey Firestone had and drove around in her electric car. We would be all gaga to see it on the streets. And, I believe that they will be popular again when charging is faster and easier to access.
 
I think electric cars are wewll suited for small towns, medium size towns and suburbs. If you think about it, that covers well over 50 percent of the US population. Isolated rural areas is probably their worst application.
 
Yeah baby! According to Ripleys, a few is as many as 8. A couple is 2 and 1.4 doesn't quite even make a couple.
Add a self driving mode to the mix.
 
For a few isolated times electric would work OK but when they are talking total distance they can travel they are thinking warm weather as a battery looses power in the cold, then they are forgeting about night driving or in winter having to run a heater that will use more battery power than moving the car will. So cut their distance to a quarter and you will have a realistic milage figure. So if in city and city driving takes more fuel but for a 20 mile daytime warm weather comute they might be OK, But if you need to make a unexpected hundred mile trip expect to be towed. That electric car mentioned dod not get more than 5 mile from here home and only in good datime weather. An electric car would take way more battery power than the electric golf cart.
 
A nice electric car would weigh about 3,000 to 4,000 pounds, have a 400-500 mile range, re-fuel for another 400-500 miles in less than 10 minutes and cost around $32,500. i.e., be competitive with currently available fossil fuel automobiles.
 
Multi-vehicle families. 100 mile range would cover 98% of our day trips. Then use the gasoline powered vehicle for the long trips and vacations. Come to think of it, that is exactly how it works in our house right now, except all vehicles are gasoline.
 
(quoted from post at 12:34:44 01/08/20) Yes! and the spare battery could be charged by solar panels. Here in Arizona we are seeing more and more covered parking with solar panels on top, now if you could pug in the car while parked what a win-win situation. It's probably happening in some places. I just read in the paper this morning about shutting down some of the coal fired plants in N AZ, good deal!
Click to expand...

Large scale solar is a joke. A very expensive, so ultimately sad joke, but a joke nonetheless. It is outlawed in our county now that we have adults in charge.
 
(quoted from post at 11:37:58 01/09/20) I think electric cars are wewll suited for small towns, medium size towns and suburbs. If you think about it, that covers well over 50 percent of the US population. Isolated rural areas is probably their worst application.
Click to expand...

Anyone with a lick of common sense should be able to see that.

But.............
 
(quoted from post at 14:36:19 01/09/20)

Large scale solar is a joke. A very expensive, so ultimately sad joke, but a joke nonetheless. [b:8c89760da3]It is outlawed in our county now that we have adults in charge.[/b:8c89760da3]
Click to expand...

What country is that?
 
(quoted from post at 14:12:25 01/09/20)
(quoted from post at 14:36:19 01/09/20)

Large scale solar is a joke. A very expensive, so ultimately sad joke, but a joke nonetheless. [b:f04c1a8b01]It is outlawed in our county now that we have adults in charge.[/b:f04c1a8b01]
Click to expand...

What country is that?
Click to expand...
he "r" present or absent is important.
 
(quoted from post at 15:59:13 01/09/20)
(quoted from post at 14:12:25 01/09/20)
(quoted from post at 14:36:19 01/09/20)

Large scale solar is a joke. A very expensive, so ultimately sad joke, but a joke nonetheless. [b:26888f19ca]It is outlawed in our county now that we have adults in charge.[/b:26888f19ca]
Click to expand...

What country is that?
Click to expand...
he "r" present or absent is important.
Click to expand...

??
 
Inquisition Judge: So Mr. Galileo, are you going to persist with this silly nonsense that the Earth orbits around the sun even though everyone in this forum says it can't be true?

Galileo: Yes, I'll stick with the theory. I pity those of you that can be so stubborn to think that changing the way you think is impossible.

Inquisition Judge: OK, have it your own way. We will banish you to seclusion under house arrest for the rest of your life, and in the meantime the sun will continue to circle the Earth.

Galileo: OK, if you insist. Eventually, history will prove you wrong. I realize how difficult it must be to be stuck in the present following dogmatic thinking and I pity you for being so stubborn and set in your ways.
 
(quoted from post at 09:14:03 01/09/20) A nice electric car would weigh about 3,000 to 4,000 pounds, have a 400-500 mile range, re-fuel for another 400-500 miles in less than 10 minutes and cost around $32,500. i.e., be competitive with currently available fossil fuel automobiles.
Click to expand...

Not 100% true. The "rapid recharge" doesn't fully charge them. Only about 80%. That's about 30 minutes too. And the claimed 400-500 miles range is bogus too. More 300-400 in weather that doesn't require the heater to run and only requires the AC to run at a minimum. Get into warm weather or cold it severely cuts performance and range.

EV's accounted for about 330,000 new cars in the US last year. The hangup is the batteries. Right now about the only new thing is battery technology is using sulfur in place of lithium. No performance difference. Just that sulfur is cheaper.

Last year they sold just over 17 million new cars in the US.

To really put it into perspective they claim that there are 265 million or so vehicles in the US with 1.3 million being electric.

Now as far as cost? The price Tesla claims is at the end of 6 years deducting what they claim will be a 10,000 dollar savings in gas. So add 10K to that 32,500. That's what it will cost bare bones to get it in your driveway. Oh, by the way. Tesla isn't allowed to make those claims in some countries with higher gas prices than the us cause the countries claim that a driver won't save 10 K in gas.

In other words don't believe the hype! IMO Musk is nothing more than a con artist.

Rick
 
We all know that the earth is flat. Just look. If the earth was round the people on the bottom would fall off!!! Any fool can see that!
 
Myself, I doubt that quick change batteries will be popular outside of a few fleet vehicles. Quick chargers available in most homes and locations are what will be required. In rural areas, hybrid cars with a small fossil fueled generator will fit the need for extended range.
 
As a charter member of the "Flat Earth Society", I must take vigorous exception to the notion that the earth is round and orbits the sun. Why, even the most simple minded among us can plainly see that the earth is flat and the sun goes around it. Up in the morning, over the top as it progresses through the heavens, down in the evening, underneath and then up again in the morning. What could be simpler than that" (;>))
 
Well Bill, I'm beginning to think you and your friends might be on to something. Sure looks flat outside my kitchen window, this globe I have sitting on my desk is definitely FAKE NEWS .....
 
90% of the advancement in electric vehicle technology has been in the last 20 years. I'm pretty confident the next 20 years wont be so kind to the naysayers. Lets
see where we are in 2030!
 
What county has "outlawed" solar power? Talk about a government over reach! That is theoretically the kind of "Big Brotha" stuff that conservatives claim to be
against.......
 
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