Old men driving people away from things!!!

JD Seller

Well-known Member
Grandpa Love's post below got me thinking about something that is going on this site. It is the same thing that goes on at a lot of the Antique tractor shows and clubs. In my opinion this is one thing that is causing fewer people to be involved in both.

Old men are often opinionated and cantankerous to a great degree. I will readily admit that I can be both at times too. I try really hard to not offend people intentionally. Many on here do not extend that curtsy to people, especially "new" posters.

There was a post a few weeks ago about how it seemed that there are fewer posts. Many of us posted about how a lot of it is just the season. That is only partially true. I think a lot of us just did not want to talk about the elephant in the room. Many older members and a good few new posted have quit coming to this site. Many still lurk but just do not post. People are getting tired of the general negative attitude of many posters that reply to people. Also the in fighting that goes on between some posters. If those doing this, keep it up, this site will continue to grow smaller.

I am not posting near as much as I used to. There are many days I do not even read the posts anymore. I have talked to many of the people that used to be regular posters that are rarely seen here anymore. A really common thing they all are saying privately, is the BS and negativity has made it not enjoyable to be involved in this site.

This happening really saddens me. I have made some life long friends because of this site. In general 90% of the people on here are the best in the world. It is the few that are ruining it for everyone. This is not unique, it seems that any activity that draws people, and especially older retired people, has this happen over time. The negative and grumpy take root an will not leave unless throw out. Most people in charge of these things are too nice to do anything until it is too late.

So guys we need to police ourselves. We are all adults here. If your having a bad day just think twice before posting something that is negative or even mildly abusive. If there are personalities that are incompatible PLEASE just do not post on each others posts. This type of back and fort is the number one thing that seems to be turning people off on this site.

Then the number one reason new posters do not come back, posting snide remarks to a new poster is too common of a practice. Yes I understand the frustration that some of these posts can cause. Answering the same question ten times gets old. Having your advice ignored and the same question reposted again can make you want to scream too. The old sage that would be better to follow at these time would be " If you can not say something good do not comment at all". I am finding that I do this more and more.

In general this site is a great service to its members. Lets try and keep it a place we can all enjoy whether we are an old member or a new one!!!!!
 
Well Texas beat me to it, WELL SAID. I have got where I just sit back and read rather than post and have someone down the fact that I sell KUBOTAS . There are several on here that are as far from me in beliefs and actions that is unbelievable, but over the years I have learned if I were to sit down at the table over a cup of coffee we would find a lot of common ground. Great site and I sure hope it continues.
 
I go to Facebook, Redpower and here several times daily. They all have good and bad. People also have to be careful when communicating in text as there is no personality to read. Thanks for posting this . Hopefully will help keep the snide remarks down.
 
this is a great site,, and thanks for the great advice ,sometimes a bad day does makes for bad responses or posts,,Im guilty of that at times
 
As to the waning interest in shows I think expense is the largest factor. Most people in these parts are pulling in 12-13 dollars per hour in wages and if you have kids the money is not there to buy a project tractor for 1,500 dollars and then spend another 2,500 dollars or more to make it show ready. Prices on a fair number of restored tractors are going to have to come down if guys want them to wind up with people who will care about them.
 
Mornin JD, Wellllllllllllll I've been on this site nearly thirty years so I guess that means I'm an "old man" ya think. For the most part there are a fine group of gents here all willing to try n help. However, as would be expected, sure there are a few who seem argumentative (or have a chip on their shoulder) and must always be right (take the its my way or the highway attitude) and take exception with anyone who dares take a different approach to a problem or have a different opinion. You best not disagree with them or you're in trouble lol

I try to be polite professional and respectful and stay away from feuds, but will stand up for my traditional Christian conservative values and upbringing if challenged.

Just as us "old men" are fading away and there becomes less and less gents whose Dad or Grandad or themselves owned a certain old tractor I see the hobby as aging and dying but I still enjoy the hobby and attend and exhibit around six tractor shows each year in different states.

Speaking of "old men" would you say any of the "dudes" in this picture qualify hmmmmmmmmmmmm lol

Take care my friend

John T
cvphoto38861.jpg
 
I believe something, I don't know what, has changed people. Not just on this site but even IRL. I've tried to convince one on my sons who has a masters in Sociology to write a paper on what has caused these changes. The change seems to be world wide.
 
So thinking of folks long gone, anyone heard from ALAN in Nebraska the guy who had a house fire, then Lou from Wisconsin, and lately the Oliver lover Rrlund?
 
Thank you for posting this Ron! I think it?s mostly just life in general. Way too many people are unfulfilled in life and survive for the chance to tramp any thoughts that don?t align perfectly with their own into complete annihilation to make themselves feel better than the next person.
 
NY 986 was right about this being a timely thread. Don't know how many times this past 2 months I've clicked on reply, thought about it, then clicked on return to forum. Various reasons for that, but mostly because I'm not gonna make an uninformed response to something someone else has probably already said. I will give a shoutout to Sweetfeet for at least being a good example of what friendliness and being positive is supposed to be. DP
 
I think the old guys being rude. To the new guys. Has killed more clubs and sites than anything. They seem to forget. There was a time when they knew nothing but had to look to the old guys to help them. I know generators and trandfer equipment. But I come here to learn about farming.
 
Thanks for posting. Even us old guys forget that with age comes diminutive mental capacity which is the reason for my post the other day about the alternator wiring. JDseller, you have always been very helpful to me and like you, I don't think I've been negative most times. But I guess the way we type can sound that way sometimes (speaking for myself, not you). Keith
 
Ronnie, I agree with the general theme of your post but I don't think "old men" have cornered the market on poor behavior. There's plenty of it displayed by youngsters and middle age folks on this site. Your call for nicer behavior will hopefully be heeded by all.
 
The biggest problem I see with clubs is they are very clannish. A few guys that know each other get together then they think they want additional members for dues but the reality is they want nothing to do with the newbies beyond collecting dues. Pretty soon nobody is happy then the club breaks up so everybody can go their separate ways. There are clubs I would like to join in the area but "outsiders" really are not welcome. I would join a club if I could have a positive experience but I don't want to sit in a corner getting cold stares for an hour and a half.
 
Hi, I was a Ronnie as a younger person. Now it's just Ron. I sure wish I could help more people in person with their electrical questions. "old men" generally have more trouble seeing, hearing, etc so maybe that adds to their frustration and causes the "lash outs". I too appreciate the Christian conservative approach to life. I hope that doesn't cause frustration to other posters.

Just recently I was thinking about Allan in NE. He played awesome music and I always listened since I play a little music myself but not nearly as good as Allan.

Thanks to JD for this original post.

One thing does amaze me as to how many of you are friends in places other than on this site, at least according to what you have said here. I only know one person here in other segments of life.
 
We as a society have forgotten the golden rule it seems to have changed to " Do unto others before they do it to you".
 
JD, Thank you for the post, and all of the others as well.
I don't think rudeness has an age limit, seems like you don't have to look too much to find it.
I see a lot of it as the big city creeps in on us. (we used to be a small farm town, south of Dallas)
Getting younger guys interested in this hobby is a challenge. I've been working on a young farmer with that, (35)
but he seems not ready. He has a 37 B apart to paint, but lost interest for now.
Didn't mean to go on this much, hope some good comes from all our comments Thanks , Jim
 
I had to think about it for a while before posting a reply, but your opening post JD was thoughtful and well written, and deserves to be recognized as such. Thank you.

I would also like to add, that there seems to be an intolerance of late of opinions that do not jive with one's own. Instead of a respectful discussion, a number of people resort to ridicule and personal attacks on the person with a differing view or idea. As someone else has mentioned, it's not limited to this forum, but is global in its scope. We may not be able to fix the discourse globally, but as you pointed out JD, we certainly can be more civil to one another here.

As to Grandpa Love's recent post, I would be one of those "grumps" he referred to. As such, I saw no reason to add my 2 cents in, as it would just open me up for the invariable personal attacks that seem to happen. I posted on that subject back in June, and while most of the discussion was civil, there were those that insisted that I was the problem, and the attacks were personal enough that I pulled the plug on the post. Since then, I saw no point to engage in the community any more than asking or answering the odd technical question.

Perhaps the old adage of "grow a thicker skin" comes into play here, but I think a measure of respect is equally, if not more, important. After all, we're all guests here at Yesterday's Tractors.
 
I haven't heard from Alan or Lou, but RRLund is doing well.
He came over and visited last weekend.
He's an active farmer and this is a busy time of year. It will be
even busier for him if things dry up so he can get all his crops out.
 
Very true. I tried to join the C A F years ago. Thought I could help with the ground equipment. Members made it plain I was not wanted. So I never went back.
 
I am a perfect example. I started to reply to this, then thought oh heck, why give some grouch something else to blast me about. I left the site for about 6 months, except for a very few posts to ask about repair help I needed, or to chime in on the implement section where my experience on some repair might be of value to someone. I find general posts about how to trap a groundhog, or kill wasps or ripen tomatoes very helpful practical advice. I can't imagine that if you were sitting across the table from the same guy in the local coffee shop he would say the same harsh and narrow things to your face that he is quick to say on-line. Is he like that in church or at the tractor club meetings or the cattleman's asso. meetings. It is too bad that this site which is such a great source of information is also such a source of harshness.
 
Lyndon AB, not everyone who won't
let kids climb on a tractor is an
old grump. Some have good reason.
I respect that. But some folks are
just grumpy and not worth talking
to . Fellow at the show was like
that. Why go if you don't want to
talk tractors with other owners?
 
Grandpa Love, yeah, I looked back at the way I wrote that, and I could've phrased it a bit better. I knew what you were getting at, and wasn't offended at all. When I wrote my reply, it was mostly just some residual bitterness at the way I got jumped on back in June that showed through. I didn't mean for any of that to be directed your way.
 
"People are getting tired of the general negative attitude of many posters that reply to people. Also the in fighting that goes on between some posters. "

JD
I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU.
geo
 
Guess I'm in the old guy bracket. Guess i'm also a bit dense, slow,insensitive? I don't read every post in this forum, just the one's that interest me. Don't remember reading anything grumpy, or insulting. Seems definitions of common words have changed in a short amount of time. With the desire to understand the topic of this post, could someone please refer me to a post that meets the criteria of people being driven away. Not being sarcastic, just sincerely wanting to experience an example so I can identify with what everyone is agreeing to.

Thanks
 
You have a good point. I've been the subject of demeaning posts when asking a question. People ask a question because they don't know the answer - that doesn't mean they deserve a caustic or condescending reply. So, I post less, but they will not drive me away.
 
You are better than I , to my knowledge I have never met that first YTer in person. I often wonder I I were to pass would anyone on here ever know it.
 
Farm Kid ..... you've never read anything grumpy or insulting? You gotta be kidding (I know you're not though). To direct you to a post
that ended up with someone leaving, well how would any of us know if a post drove someone away, pretty much impossible I'd say. There have
occasionally been some YT'ers who have informed the group that they're outa here for a variety of reasons. But your post is well taken and I
don't think anyone thinks you as dense, slow, or insensitive.
 
"[b:654c4848f0][i:654c4848f0]a good example of what friendliness and being positive is supposed to be[/i:654c4848f0][/b:654c4848f0]"

Larry Gafney (aka [b:654c4848f0]larry@stinescorner[/b:654c4848f0]) is the poster boy that should come to mind for a lot of us.

Also agree that Gina (aka [b:654c4848f0]sweetfeet[/b:654c4848f0]) is the poster girl and shares in this honor.
 
"I often wonder I I were to pass would anyone on here ever know it."

There are people here you care about/communicate with, they will know.
Most everyone here values a knowledgeable opinion.
Even if they disagree with it or learn something new from it.

There are people on this site that I am close friends with and some
others that are more of acquaintances, but none that are enemies.
We all matter. They'll know.
 
I know the big city is creeping in on you, and that is painful to the way of life we remember.. But is it as painful as watching your hometown, the place you love and remember, turn into a falling down collection of derelict buildings, closed schools, no stores, no jobs, just unemployed druggies? Be careful what you wish for.
 
Found this thread very interesting:

Ya, where did some of my favorite posters go?

Experienced some of what JD said at my local trap shooting club, obviously I am not the best shooter but some of the members are rude so I lost interest.

Thinking about my above comment, most people were great or neutral but it only took a few to make it a downer. Maybe I am to sensitive.

I have received a lot of help on here. I try to be appreciative and return what I believe to be a helpful comment when I can.

Thanks to all. Paul
 
I think part of the problem today is that we depend upon e-mail instead of the phone. What we put in writing can be very easily mistaken since there is usually more to the situation than is printed in that sentence. Sometimes what we put in writing is not an expression of our real intent.

It is amazing to me how the young generation communicates almost exclusively via text, they don't know who how to communicate on the phone or in person.
 
Great post, JD Seller!!

YT is a great "neighborhood"... and we should all try to keep it that way.
It's not that I think that people should never post an opposing view - that would make life boring... just do it with integrity.

Thank you Dpittman and James Howell...
BUT I really don't deserve special mention. God just wired me to be a happy-go-lucky person for the most part. This dippy ol' hippy just enjoys people and likes to have fun.
Plus, I always knew growing up - that God and Mama wuz watchin'... and they still are. :)

Truth be told: I have lost my temper here a few times over the years... A saint, I am not. But when I have lost my temper, it has usually been because somebody is repeatedly harassing another poster; and I just have to speak up. I'm like my Daddy: It takes A LOT to push me to orneriness... but when ya do push me over that edge - I'll come back atchya with fire in my eyes. LOL

ANNNDDDD if you are a person who has never
met another YT'er - you've simply got to do it.

I've made friends in several states... whom I'd never have known, if not for YT. Some I have met in person already - some are on my list to hopefully visit someday.
Never heard of any YT'er reporting about a bad meet-n-greet on this site... Always a good experience.

So get out there and connect with each other at a tractor show or a swap meet, plan a get-together for lunch, OR travel half-way across this great ol' land and connect with a few YT families (like I did this summer). You won't regret it. :) :) :)

Life is short... and ya only get one go-round... make the most of it.
And seek out the beauty in every day - 'cuz there IS some.
 
Thanks for bringing that up, JD. One of my "pet peeves" on here is people belittling others for their poor spelling, punctuation and grammar. Just recently, someone repeatedly misspelled Super A as Supper A. I wondered how long it would take for someone to make a smart-aleck comment about it, and sure enough, it was not long in coming.

Folks have varying degrees of expertise in different areas. Just because someone can't spell or use proper grammar doesn't mean he's stupid- he may have forgotten more about machining or tractor repair than we'll ever know. I write for a living, and I guess I would be in as good a position as anyone to correct others- but I don't. I just read their posts as best I can, and respond to the gist of it, not the presentation. Yes, sometimes posts are virtually unreadable- in that case, just move on to the next without comment. As our mothers used to tell us, "If you can't say something nice, just don't say anything."

I must qualify the above, to a small extent. I used to correct people on the spelling of a word that they might want to Google- "Kabota" comes to mind. In the early days of Google, you had to have the word spelled correctly to get any results. But then one day I Googled "Kabota", and it said "Did you mean Kubota" and gave a zillion hits. So I've even quit doing that.
 
(quoted from post at 10:09:40 10/13/19) Well Texas beat me to it, WELL SAID. I have got where I just sit back and read rather than post and have someone down the fact that I sell KUBOTAS . There are several on here that are as far from me in beliefs and actions that is unbelievable, but over the years I have learned if I were to sit down at the table over a cup of coffee we would find a lot of common ground. Great site and I sure hope it continues.

You sell Kabota's!! :shock:
Just kidding! I actually like them and considered buying one, but found another Ford that needed rescued.

Well said JD Seller! I'm fairly new to this site for a couple of reasons.
1st is affordable high speed internet wasn't available here until 2012.
2nd even though my newest tractor was over 25 years old when I first visited this site, I didn't consider it old so why would I want to join a tractor forum about old tractors.
I know there's a lot of died in the wool classic users on here, but as a fairly new internet user had I not clicked on modern view one day I probably would have dumped this site and moved on. But after lurking for a while I realized some folk were talking about tractors I owned or grew up on and were asking questions I could answer.
Yes a couple times I gave a bad answer and was straightened out about it real quick, didn't like the way it was worded sometimes but would rather shake it off and move on than blow up a good forum in a heated argument.
I haven't meet any taler's in person but have had phone conversions with a few and enjoyed every one.
A couple times the negativity got so bad (not at me) I thought about leaving, but each day I look forward to jon f mn's Funnies, Larry's pics and SweetFeet's adventure's, let us not forget photo's of Bruce's wife's pies, their to LIVE for.
 

Very well said, Mr. JD Seller. Very good post and I thank you for it. I read several eclectic forums and the Ridgid tool forum, for one, has all but disappeared because of arrogant comments. I like this forum and would hate to see it go away or drift into disuse.
 

Well coshoo spelling isn't my best quality and many times spell check will change pto to pro on me and I have to correct it.
BUT this time when I needed it to correct Kabota to Kubota it failed me.
Thanks for being understanding.
 
I loved going to airshows and the old WW2 planes and still do.

However, when I was a young kid I remember the CAF guys being very rude to me and for no reason whatsoever. That still sticks in my mind 40 years later. Some of them still come across as arrogant and rude.

The independent groups with the vintage aircraft have been exceedingly nice. The Collins Foundation people are very nice. I don't know what it is about the CAF.
 
The Bible, Letter to the Philippians, Chapter 2, verse 3:
3 Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves.

And I could not have said it any better than the words above.
JD's original post and many of the replies tell us to look in the mirror before speaking up.
I must admit that I've been guilty too.
 
JD,, a Well written and explained post on a subject that I have seen way to often,, I used to post here dozens of times a day,, info to help, pics scans of correct info,, some appreciated it others not so much,, I have pretty much stopped posting here due to in large part from just what you speak of in this post. Do I know everything? Of course Not not even close,, I learn every day or try to. I like many others started repairing and running equipment at a very early age,, that said I have done many things decades ago others my senior have not done, I have always said no question is a dumb one if you do not know the answer,, sadly many of the times when I posted info for someone sometimes taking hours to find the correct info/scan it and post only to be told it was wrong,, so I just quit finally,, I still see dozens of posts here on the forums I visit,, this one, imp alley, combine crawlers and the Case one I do know the answers to but do not take the time to post.. sad for those asking questions but it is the way it is . sorry did not mean to ramble on,, just wanted to say Thank You for this,, even if you do not check back on your posts,, again Thank You for All you and those here who do take the time to respond
cnt
 
Farmkid

"With the desire to understand the topic of this
post, could someone please refer me to a post that
meets the criteria of people being driven away."

The posts you are asking for usually only last a day
or two before they go POOF.
 
When I joined this site, many years ago, I knew I was dealing with the most opinionated, cantankerous, independent, hard headed, know it alls on the universe. I haven't been disappointed and my feelings haven't been hurt. Snowflakes may have a problem with that and they can go to their Snowflake sites and do their whining!
 
Excellent post we all need to think before we type. When I went in the Military one of the very first things they taught was " there is no such thing as a stupid Question". Just because you have experience and think something should be common knowledge someone else shouldn't have to die because you made fun of them or withheld information.
 
Good post, thanks for taking the time to write it. Since we re all sharing here, I ve made some comments that I now regret. Stormed off in a huff awhile back. Got my underwear all in a knot, as they say. A brand new member posted a question about her dad s tractors, got many responses that had little or nothing to do with tractors. She d done the internet equivalent of turning down an unmarked dirt road, only to be met at the end by a bunch of angry guys waving pitchforks and yelling incoherently. Wisely, she slowly backed out, made a u-turn and never looked back. You can add something about spitting dirt and gravel out the rear tires as she sped away, but maybe that s pushing the analogy a bit. I just wanted to see some stinkin tractors, this being a tractor site and all. But she got scared off before she could post any. That was my main beef. And, no guarantee she was going to post photos anyway, the tractors probably not a top priority in her life. Anyway, I m in my happy place now, all good. I enjoy the comments and advice here, will try to be a better internet citizen in the future.
 
I have switched to :Bing" as my primary search engine. Don't like Googles politics or modus operendi.
 
JD Sellers you hit it right on the head in my opinion. I know I don't post like I used to, seems either I would get blasted or no response at all, don't need to come here to get that. I still look and read every day, some smart people here and am always willing to learn.
 
Been happening as long as Ive been here, and will continue as long as YT is around. Nothing new. Im guilty, and I admit it of being involved in arguments before. Like said below, typing something out on the computer isnt the same as saying it in person. Too much gets lost in the meaning.
 
(quoted from post at 09:20:33 10/14/19) Good post, thanks for taking the time to write it. Since we re all sharing here, I ve made some comments that I now regret. Stormed off in a huff awhile back. Got my underwear all in a knot, as they say. A brand new member posted a question about her dad s tractors, got many responses that had little or nothing to do with tractors. She d done the internet equivalent of turning down an unmarked dirt road, only to be met at the end by a bunch of angry guys waving pitchforks and yelling incoherently. Wisely, she slowly backed out, made a u-turn and never looked back. You can add something about spitting dirt and gravel out the rear tires as she sped away, but maybe that s pushing the analogy a bit. I just wanted to see some stinkin tractors, this being a tractor site and all. But she got scared off before she could post any. That was my main beef. And, no guarantee she was going to post photos anyway, the tractors probably not a top priority in her life. Anyway, I m in my happy place now, all good. I enjoy the comments and advice here, will try to be a better internet citizen in the future.

I remember the post you are referring to. I also felt there was no excuse for the way she was treated. Kudos to you for coming to her defense and helping her out at the time! Blessings to you for that!
 

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