Learned something today I never noticed before

Philip d

Well-known Member
In wiring methods today I was putting the cover on a gfci receptical I finished installing and the instructor came by. He said it?s your own preference but what sets a super fussy electrician apart from the others is how they choose to or not choose to line up the cover screws. He said there are people out there fussy enough to notice that if every cover in an install has every screw lined up either perfectly vertical or horizontal or just random lined up every which way. He said the ones that do notice will think ?wow,they really care about their work and I?m calling them every time from now on?. Just thought it was interesting and would share the story.
 
I line mine up vertical. Looks nice and looks do count for lots. Just think of a nice shiny tractor versus a greasy one on the sales market.
 
I'm not an electrician, but have always been fussy by nature (and learning tight tolerances at an early age). I've always lined up my screws. I even center every screw in the oval slots of switches/receptacles when attaching to the boxes.
 
And I though that was a symptom of my OCDC! LOL

First time I saw that was in a 1946 ELCO cabin cruiser I had years ago. It was assembled with slot screws, thousands of them! Everyone was turned with the slot straight up or in line front to back.
 
Hmmm.... always thought correct screw or bolt application was correct tightness or torque. Seems lining up screw slots gets in the way of that. Same as the screws that hold the wire in place.
Neat concept, I'll just keep with correct tightness instead of where lines line up.
 
I'm like you guys but I'm not. Mine are horizontal. I really like the newer flexible face plates that won't crack like the old ones. I've cracked a few giving it that last little bit to have the screw slot end up being horizontal when I knew I should back it off 1/2 a turn.
 
Most everyone says vertical and that is correct. NOW. ...if you know any Military vehicle collectors, trucks, tanks, etc. the preferred motor pool and assembly line alingment is straight up and down. Here is the reason. Rain will not lay in the screw head. It will just pass through. For real gang.
 
I would be happy if the electrician put all the wires on the receptacles. All too often I've had to come back and put the ground wires on before calling for an inspection.
 
OK if the screws are supposed to be vertical, is the ground receptacle supposed to be on top or underneath the blade receptacles?

Rich
 
When my daughter worked for me when she was a kid, I informed her of the same thing, line up the screws on the covers (all vertical, and don't crack the covers - go backwards if you have to) - mostly for S& G's. She now has a largist electrical co. and in fact employs her brother. They just got a couple of LARGE contracts in northern Alberta. I am proud.
 
Old way was under for the ground. Don't know when the code changed but it's on top now. Electrical safety at my job said the idea is that if it's partially pulled out anything falling on to it would hit the ground prong first.
 
Well I guess I never really looked at the position of the screw slot. I worry more about them being the correct tightness not OCD straight screws. LOL I will have to look and see if there are any like that down here in the states.
 
They?re doing that in NewBrunswick now but it hasn?t been adopted in PEI yet. Each province can make their own amendments to Canadian code so long as it doesn?t make anything less safe, it looks funny when your not used to it though.
 
Yes I like the concept too ,it?s no extra work or time ,just gives an added touch to professional appearance.
 
Our instructor back in the 70's had us line up screws vertical then just because it looks better, now the NSPC
inspectors today are thinking the same way...whats old is new????
gonna give you a call this evening after the chickens say its bedtime..:)
cheers
 
(quoted from post at 18:38:11 10/11/19) Hmmm.... always thought correct screw or bolt application was correct tightness or torque. Seems lining up screw slots gets in the way of that. Same as the screws that hold the wire in place.
Neat concept, I'll just keep with correct tightness instead of where lines line up.

I agree. TIGHT screws are much more important.
 
Sort of like a perfect and shiny paint job on a tractor restoration but underneath a guy might not have a clue of the quality of the job. Screw alignment might make some feel good but I'd be more concerned that the job before the cover plate was put on is done correctly.
 
I hope you guys that have to have it visually perfect never assemble an engine...
"Let's see now....those head bolts aren't all aligned together. Let me tighten this one another eighth of a turn and loosen this one the same...
Those connecting rod nuts all have to be aligned together to look the same...let me tighten this one by sight and loosen this one so they are all the same..."
All kidding aside, my sister died about a year ago and the mortician lined up the wheels underneath the casket so that two of them were parallel to each other and the other two were parallel to each other, except they were 90? from the other two. He said the casket would have less chance of moving "if something happened."
 
The electrician that wired our house said that most people won't notice the screw heads all the same way but if he gets called back for a problem, he can tell if someone has had the covers off. Most don't notice and therefore won't align the screws.
 
I?d want the screws tight, more so than looking lined up.

Neat tho as long as you can do both.

Paul
 
Your last sentence is correct but there is no code on ground placement, just common practice and it varies in different parts of the country. Here in St. Louis the standard is ground down for residential and ground up for commercial. I'm an IBEW Local 1 member and we pride ourselves on our finish work and always line screw up as philip d stated. A small few choose to do theirs horizontal but the norm is to do them vertical. This is for two reasons, the first is back in the day faceplates were painted and this would keep the paint from pooling in the screws. The other reason is so that women will not catch their nails in the screw slot when they go to flip a switch. And for the guys worried about the plates being tight, I wonder if you've messed with the newer unbreakable plates. If you tighten until completely tight your plate will be bowed and warped in the middle. You only need to snug them up, I've installed thousands and never had an issue with tightness yet.
 
Either, see my post above. There is no code on ground placement at this time (in the U.S), it's strictly personal preference.
 
Those are either crummy electricians OR they are using self grounding receptacles that do not require a ground. This type relies on the mounting screw to accomplish the ground. We use lots of those on the job and they are up to code but most guys aren't fully on board with them because you lose the ground as soon as you pull the receptacle out.
 

how many of you park with the valve stems at the top... on your tires.... and the letters on the rim/hub cap correct. Now that shows a good electrician.
 
I'm one of those guys that like the screws lined up (usually horizontal). A 1/4 turn on a receptacle or switch cover wont make much difference unless you have already tightened it too far. Then it cracks. That is definitely a No-No. I am real fussey when wiring breaker boxes. I have also found that when the electrical inspector comes to visit, and sees a neat job he is less likely to scrutinize the rest of the job. Here is a question for you. How far from the service box do you put the staple over romex, and do you fold a short loop of extra wire between the box and staple for repairs down the road??? I am also rather fussey about running wires diagonal to save wire, especially in stud walls where the picture hanger may decide to use a long screw to hold up their favorite picture or nick nack shelf.
Loren
 
Most receptacles the ground is positioned below the blade slots. You almost never see it the other way. There is arguments both ways on it but when you use a flush mounted plug the prongs are on the side of the plug and if the ground were on top the cord would aim up instead of down where it's mostly needed.
 
(quoted from post at 05:26:59 10/12/19) I hope you guys that have to have it visually perfect never assemble an engine...

Oh, that's simple! Just cut the crooked heads off and weld them back on all nice and straight. *hehe*
 
We just covered it in code ,poor memory wants to say within a foot for the first staple and not more than 3? apart after but I?d have to look it up to be sure. We?re told to leave a 300 mm loop and 150 mm minimum skinned wire in each outlet box which is a little over a foot loop and about 7? skinned wire unless it?s armoured cable than you only have to remove 7? off the jacket and no loop.
 
I meant to say electrical safety "instructor". I asked because our new lab facility had the grounds above. And to be clear I never gave consideration to the screw slots but I will from now on.
 


The screws being lined up is a big thing in fine guns. There is a specific word that escapes me that describes the practice. In the guns the norm is to have the slots running parallel with the barrel.
 
On utility poles it?s common to use flat square washers. Ive had linemen that insist the washers in the diamond posistion are correct. However I?ve retired 60+ year old poles that didn?t follow that rule. To each there own.
 

I'm with old farmkid and rustyfarmal. Lined up means sloppy work. Lining up means too tight or too loose one or the other. covers loosen up after a few unpluggings or they crack.
 
Everyone is entitled to their opinion but the consensus among the professionals in the exact opposite in regards to your sloppy work comment.
A properly installed device (switch, receptacle, etc.) is mounted firmly and will not move, the faceplate adds no rigidity but simply covers
the device to prevent anyone from making contact. If the device is mounted like it should and the plate is snugged up, it will not loosen up.
If you tighten the screws to the point of no return with the newer faceplate material (unbreakable) it will cave in towards the middle and
the outside edges will lift off the drywall which can lead to a failed electrical inspection. Ask me how I know.
 
If I remember correctly you are in Canada but I'm going to assume you also follow the 2017 National Electric Code. If that's the case then you'd look to 334.30 which is securing and supporting of nonmetallic sheathed cable and it requires a support withing 12" of the box, and every 4 1/2' thereafter. I don't know why, but I've always enjoyed code class.
 
Hello Philip d,


I call that signing your work with excellence. It is Always noticed!

Guido.
 
Your correct that I?m in Canada but each country writes it?s own version of their own code book, don?t ask me why but they seem to want to. We call ours the CEC and it?s revised every 3 years with last year being the most current for here.
 
I can't say I'm too surprised by that, our profession is full of different rules. Here in St. Louis we are working under three different codes depending on the location of the job. It could be the 2011, 2014, or 2017 code so you need to know which year you are working under and have a copy of that book. Some states are smart enough to have the whole state adopt the new code once it comes out. Hopefully one day we'll have that here. Are you studying commercial or residential?
 
Never been anything in the NEC concerning the grounding terminal being on the top or bottom. I always put mine on top because it makes it easier to plug something into it. I have put thousands of cover screws in and never considered aligning them. My concern was always to make the cover straight.
 

My 70 years on this planet have included some years in the building trades, plus doing some wiring in my own houses and shop. In all that time I have never ONCE thought to look whether the screw slots on an electrical cover plate were lined up--not once! I would submit that anyone who has the time to obsess about such things has way too much time on his hands!
 
I take the time to align mine all the same, I prefer horizontally. The new flexible cover plates make it easier to do so without cracking, but look odd if over-torqued. What I don't like is the flimsy, plastic boxes that flex out of square when fastened to the stud, then end up out of plumb with the drywall. That leaves a crooked switch or receptacle, and cover plate that doesn't fit right.
 

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