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Plowing questions

grandpa Love

grandpa Love

Well-known Member
After seeing Loren's pictures I
almost hate to post this! But I
gotta learn. I plowed a garden
yesterday for a lady and the sod
didn't want to turn all the way
over. Tried 1,2,& 3rd gear. Plowed
deep and easy. Couple roots but
sandy loose soil. Any tips?
Thanks!
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src="https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cvphotos/cvphoto21592.jpg">

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src="https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cvphotos/cvphoto21593.jpg">

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Part of what you are seeing in yours versus Loren's pictures is the difference between Loren's 20" bottoms and yours which are likely only 14 or 16". When a big wide plow bottom like an 18" or 20" inch turns the sod it generally turns it all the way over and it stays turned over.
 
Hard to tell for sure from your pic but it looks like you did not have your plow level side to side, that may have helped some,, bottom size has nothing to do with turning the soil all the way over, I am sure Bro will chime in
cvphoto21601.jpg

a shot of my VA and Case plow with 12" bottoms has zero issues turning the soil over and I am plowing up hill here lol
 
We have a 2 bottom Ferguson that has some extra parts on the back of the moleboard, like fingers to force the sod to turn over. Its still is a mess when I'm done, takes a lot of disking to smooth it up.
 
first thing is sod is always harder (but not impossible) to roll over nicely.
next thing I noticed was plow depth. measure the center to center distance on the plow beams (not the length of the moldboard). yours is probably 12" or 14". general rule is plow depth is half the width of bottoms.
good coulters adjusted correctly (about an inch to the left of the shin) make a neater cut.
try tilting the plow (down) to the right, so it rolls the dirt a bit farther over (hope this makes sense).
tail pieces on the out end of the moldboard sometimes help, as do coverboards.
some plow bottoms are curved better for turning than others. I rate Allis the worst, but Fords are imho not so great either. I rank Oliver on top, with IH a close second.
your soil looks quite dry and sandy, so it would tend to crumple rather than turn over in a ribbon anyway.

hope this helps. plow day here is scheduled for the weekend. my ground is already wet, with a day or 2 of rain in the forecast. trees are just starting to leaf.
 
You say plowed deep, how deep? And what size bottoms? A 14" plow is designed to work at 7" deep, a 16" at 8" deep and a 12" at 6" deep. Going deeper reduces the ability of the moldboard to roll over the sod and will just want to stand it on edge. But then angle of moldboards is also a big factor that you cannot help. A longer moldboard with less angle will roll sod better than a short angle moldboard with more angle, Those are more for bare ground. Now the Ford plow is a multi purpose style moldboard in that it is neither the short or long moldboard and designed to hopefully work in all conditions. You might reduce the depth a bit and get better roll over. But the plow has to be set level in all directions to get a good job.
 
Good Job Larry you know how to get it rolled over! and Yes Bro Loren,, this was some fall plowing I did on some very tightly packed ground the cows had been grazing on,, 6-7" deep is all I dare to go in this field as its Full of rocks
cvphoto21606.jpg
 
The ground looks a bit dry to me. A little more moisture especially in sandy ground would help. Also I believe your tractor would be better matched with a 2 bottom plow. With sod I have run a disc over it a couple of times when a little wet and even a tillage tool to break it up. It makes plowing easier, but we have lots of heavy clay to deal with. Experience will be a good teacher.
 
Well, lots of good advice below. I want to emphasize adjusting the 3pt lift links. As was said get the plow level when in the ground. Then play with the lift link adjuster and see what helps. As was said it looks to me like you need to lower the right hand side of the plow a little.

Is the plow scouring? My plowing looks more like that until it is really shined up. I am not sure you plowed enough to get the bottoms cleaned up.

What is the issue with getting it to go deeper? Tractor or plow? Do you have a manual?

Good luck.

Paul
 
I need to set the hitch on the plow over a bit for the VA but it was close enough for the garden lol thanks for the kind words
 
On hard ground you have to drop the leading point of the share to get it in the ground that won?t make for the pretty job like Lauren does but it?ll go in the ground
 
I'm surprised no one mentioned the lack of coulters. Heavy sod in my area, we've always considered coulters a necessity to do a good job.
 
3 years ago that garden looked like this picture. Was cleared and grass planted. Never been plowed. I was plowing about 8-9 inches deep. Had roll over issues on all 3 bottoms equally.
cvphoto21614.jpg
 
guess that depends on the brand of plow,, mine will do just as good if I have to drop the points like here, I was pulling up 8-10" chunks all the time, never have had a issue making the ground like a table top in all my years plowing,, I hate to be able to see any sign of each bottom working when I am done, but then I used to set up the plows when new for demo's and for customers so maybe thats why I am so picky lol
cvphoto21613.jpg


cvphoto21615.jpg

Here I am plowing a old alfalfa field model SR Case plow from the 60's
 
Hey Grampa, you said you were looking for a tip as how to achieve a better job of ploughing, so here is a tip. If you have a 3 point hitch cultivater , with nice new points on it, running it up and down, back and forth over the area to be ploughed will help a lot. Tough old sod can be a challenge to get rolled over, but if you spend a bit of time ripping it up, the sod looses its strength, and your plough will cut , roll , and cover all the trash under. You will be left with a smoother job, and it will take less time to work down, to get a seed bed. I have turned hundreds of acres of alfalfa hay ground over the years, and I like to drag a chisel plough over the sod, and condition the field before I try to plough my heavy clay. Bruce
 
I like it when it crumbles enough to get it so that you cannot tell furrow slab from an other. But on plowing contersts if that slab is not easily seen it takes points off your score. That is why they craul as slow as they can and still get done in aloted time. Other plowing contestants tried to talk me into becoming a contestant but just not interested and I had no way to haul tractor and plow. Those were friends but I would have been a different plow clas than they were. One friend made it all the way to second place in Afraca and plowed in other countrys as well. And we are from Ohio.
 
Hi, I think plowing without a colter will always make a mess espEciallY in sod. Also a tail on the mold board will help complete the turn over. Ed Will Oliver BC
 

By the looks of it, I think there are several possibilities...

The signs of wheel slippage may indicate you have too much plow for the tractor (but maybe more weight can help..if you have enough HP)..

2nd, Adjustments could be your problem, but I suspect worn-out Shares are not sucking the plow down like they should..

Moldboard Extensions A

Always help Roll the slice over better and Cover-Boards always make for a cleaner job of covering residue...

A 4" or 4 1/2" Angle Grinder ( Wear a dust mask and safety glasses) and Thin "Cut-Off" Discs will clean the rust rather easily.

Just hold the thin disc at a shallow angle to the Moldboards ( etc) and move it as if it were a Putty knife scraper..

It will NOT mark the surface, but WILL remove the rust, leaving a smooth Black oxide coating that WILL Scour right away...

Now...NEVER EVER allow your plow to rust again..!!

I prefer to smear grease over the wearing surfaces, but have good results with a coat of used engine oil and a good coat of Cheap Enamel paint over the oil to hold the oil in place..
Either way, it scours right off and you are in Business right away..!!

New Shares are sometimes a Necessity and the eventually do wear out.. Ron..

If that plow is rusty, CLEAN it up...!!
 
You were trying to plow TOO DEEP even for a 16" bottom and I don't know if they even made a 16" in that model plow. If I remember corectly when you got it you said it was a 14" plow so cut your plowing depth to 7" and put coulters on and get those moldmoards shiney enough for you to be able to shave in them. Too deep and it will not let the curve of the moldboard to work. For the depth you were trying you need an 18" bottom and they did not make a plow of that size then.
 


The "Heel" (or Tail Wheel) should be leaving a light mark at the furrow floor and yes, Coulters are mandatory in sod..!

Turning Sod was always a pleasure with our AC WD-45's..could plow a 1/2 mile long furrow and seldom (if ever) see a break in the slice..!!

Really made working the plowed ground so much easier and smoother..!!
 
I have a Case friend on fb from Holland, he competes in plow days over there and like you say you can count every furrow with ease I hate that lol
 
Second picture appears to show a 3 inch plowing depth from the looks of the furrow. Too shallow. Should be at least 6-7 inches. You may have an old "plow pan" or compacted area that will be hard to penetrate with old plow shares.
 
The one picture was a farm road through a field and the other was plowing out ground that hadn?t been worked in 40 years with 3 foot tall grass
cvphoto21623.jpg


cvphoto21624.jpg
 
Exactly , the plow when set correctly must be level , then it will turn the sod completely over. We always used "skimmers" with the coulters when plowing sod.
 
Worn out shares will keep a plow from going in but that is not his problem, he is plowing way to deep already so going deeper will not help. And if you are not trying to plow deeper than the bottom is designed for then the dirt will not get up to the coverboard for it to do anything but plug. Found that out when bought a plow with them on and first year trying to plow with them on took them off and threw them away because they just created problems. Now in his case where he was plowing way too deep for the bottom and the soil was crumbling back over the top of the moldboard and falling back in furrow they would have helped take care of that problem. He should not be trying to plow 8-9" deep with that plow, just will never work at that depth.
 
That is from dirt falling back over top of the moldboard from going too deep. And refilling the furrow. He said he is already plowing 8-9" deep with a plow that is designed only for 7" deep.
 
Worn plow shares? As long as they are not wearing into the frog (support bracket) you could weld a piece of truck leaf spring to the lead of the share to see if it will suck in. Coulters would help but believe you have other problems.
 
The way we would like to see it then it is easier riding for smaller wheel tractors for working it down. Where you are you are used to larger wheel tractors but I have worked many an acre with 5:50x16 on front and 12.4x28 on rear or 5:00x15 on front and 10x38 (11.2 new size on rear) When I got up to 7:50x18 on front and 15.5x38 on rear lot easier riding. When we got duals made things a lot better riding.
 
As others said, you need coulters - at least one on the back bottom to make clean furrow. Also, trash or cover boards (just above the moldboard in the picture) helps. Plow needs to be level and needs to scour. Might be able to find a manual for the plow which would be real helpful.
Plow in picture is 16? plowing 8? deep.
cvphoto21626.jpg
 
I hate being able to see each pass of the plow to it drives me crazy but sometimes I still end up with it
 
I have never seen a plow with Coulter?s besides a picture book I would like to try some I bet they would help a lot In sod .
 
If you?re not rolling it all the war over you might try leveling the plow if it won?t go in you?ll have to drop the point . If you Are 9 inches deep your going to deep need to be about 6 . I love plowing stubble or even old alfalfa stands because you can really make a pretty job of plowing
cvphoto21653.jpg
 
Drive both left side tires up on 8 inch blocks. let the plow down and adjust it level front to back and side to side and try it again. Without coulters it will tear the sod or ground without cutting ahead of the mold board. The land edge will be ragged but will still turn the soil over in the spring. As stated 8 to 10 inches. Dad would have kicked my behind it he caught me plowing less than 10 inches. He always wanted to shoot for 11 inches deep as an average.
 





















Is that a 4620? Not very often you see a Deere w/that big a plow without another chained up to front.









is that a 4620?
 
Thanks to everyone who chimed in on this. Poor old plow had sat out for many years. I used a grinder with a flappy disk and knocked a lot of rust off. I guess I should have done more. I think I had it fairly level , seeing how all 3 bottoms had roll over issues. Maybe was too deep. Funny thing same tractor,plow and set up plowed my garden great! I was blaming the sod on this one! Video of my dad plowing my garden
Untitled URL Link
 
That is where I always started, Dick. Put it in the shop with the top tire on an 8 inch block and set the plow level. Once in the field shorten the third link to get it to suck down enough and done.
 
Too dry, no coulters and un-scoured moldboards.

cvphoto21703.jpg
This is 2nd gear (out of 4)and probably 6-7" deep. Notice where coulters have cut and how clean it keeps the rolled over edges. Helps , also, to have enough moisture to hold it all together.
 
Back in 1977 we took on some more farm ground and we ended up plowing 250 acres of virgin soil, meaning it had never been farmed or broken up before we did it,, when you dropped the plow in the ground you had 6 Solid and non ending rows of sod until you again lifted the plow,, I could have made real sod houses with it, Man that stuff was a chore to get plowed and worked down,, I had a whole new respect for the people who broke the ground originally after that, I couldn't even imagine doing it with horses and a light horse disc to work it down with lol
cnt
 
And your moldboard shins will last at least 3 times as long. That frome edge of bottom does not have to act as a couter to be able for the bottom to be able to turn the soil. And I believe your plow will pull easier using less fuel.
 
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