4020 starter water ?

My 1 year old rebuilt starter on my 4020 shorted out and destroyed itself. took it back to the shop for autopsy and was shocked to see that at one time it was nearly 1/3 full of water judging from a rustline .this tractor has endured a few pressure washes and rains,, but for th most part stays under roof. The warranty is VOID for water damage.i suspect the seal to be inadequete for not making good contact therefore allowing water in and also not allowing any to get back out. Never had this ever happen before and now I am spooked about any starter on the place .
 
I'll add if it was a 24 volt they are even more problematic because the field coils are live powered all the time !
The starter on our gas model died one time and it looked really bad inside I didn't know how it ever lasted as long as it had. Looked good on the outside and even had a rebuild sticker on it that looked good. I never took it apart for a look when we bought it for those reasons. After we owned it I think it was only washed off initially and only sat outside a few times and then I tarped at least the middle section.
 

Many, many, many starters live outdoors and never see the inside of a shed. If you deliberately TRIED to get water in that starter with a pressure washer, you MIGHT succeed, but you would have to be trying. My guess is that the "rebuilt" starter was never assembled properly, and that is how the water got in there. OR, the starter core already was damaged, and that rust line was already in there when they sold it to you.
 
I wouldn't give up on it. A few years ago a friend brought me a starter that had been under water for quite awhile. It cleaned up real nice and worked just fine after bearing and starter drive replacement. I don't remember if I replaced the brushes or not. It came out of the belly of a Deere A. Someone had sealed up the belly plate under the starter and the starter cavity filled up with water.
 
I was my tractors twice a year at the car wash spending about an hour each time and never ever had water get into anything and all my equipment lives outside. I think you got a starter that wasn?t sealed right to begin with
 
Is it a powershift, by chance?

Powershift 4020's don't have a removable cover at the bottom of the flywheel housing, or a drain hole, and a torn boot on the flywheel disconnect clutch makes a nice way for water to get in.
 


Yeh….I pressure washed my 4010 good when I first got it. Had the hood up and the instrument panel cover off....washed all the crud from the steering valve and underneath it.


Started the tractor after it's bath and it was squirting water out the timing mark cover on the bell housing!....Hmmm...there is/was a foam seal on the PTO engage linkage under the dash. Much of the water and much of the crud from under the instrument panel went straight into the bell housing....
 


Yeh….I pressure washed my 4010 good when I first got it. Had the hood up and the instrument panel cover off....washed all the crud from the steering valve and underneath it.


Started the tractor after it's bath and it was squirting water out the timing mark cover on the bell housing!....Hmmm...there is/was a foam seal on the PTO engage linkage under the dash. Much of the water and much of the crud from under the instrument panel went straight into the bell housing....
 
Bet I haven't washed my Super H in 25 years! I learned a very painful lesson years ago that machinery and extremely high pressure water don't mix. You get water past seals into bearings, flush grease out of places a little grease should lubricate. Won't even start explaining what it can do to ignition systems. Or if you blow hot soapy water into a hydraulic system or engine. Most pressure washers can bend the fins right over on radiators, greatly reducing air flow thru them, and their cooling capacity.

I don't use my pressure washer for years at a time.
 
(quoted from post at 19:25:01 12/06/18) Bet I haven't washed my Super H in 25 years! I learned a very painful lesson years ago that machinery and extremely high pressure water don't mix. You get water past seals into bearings, flush grease out of places a little grease should lubricate. Won't even start explaining what it can do to ignition systems. Or if you blow hot soapy water into a hydraulic system or engine. Most pressure washers can bend the fins right over on radiators, greatly reducing air flow thru them, and their cooling capacity.

I don't use my pressure washer for years at a time.

Dr. Evil, then why did you stop and pick it up from the roadside?
 
Sounds to me like the problem was more that the water could not get OUT. "Sealing" usually accomplishes that, especially when it involves gobbing silicone everywhere. You get all the water exits but inevitably miss an entry point or two. Water gets in but it can't get back out.
 

I am sure that olgent was washing carefully too, LOL. I have found that it is often a little tricky to get the back plate of a motor to seat properly into the barrel. So it isn't hard for a shop to make the error of getting it together so that the screws are tight yet it will let water run in but unable to run out as fast.
 
Thank You to All of You Who Agree with me that the starter had a inadequate poor fitted seal , that is my argument from the beginning , 1st of all the seal is very small and the bottom side of the starter seemed compressed , while the upper portion had no sign of even making contact , the starter rebuilder refused to agree. as to you jerks that claim i did it with a pressure washer , you guys dont know sh-t from shinola and you ought to look up common sense on your squireely telephones .
 
(quoted from post at 21:23:41 12/07/18) Thank You to All of You Who Agree with me that the starter had a inadequate poor fitted seal , that is my argument from the beginning , 1st of all the seal is very small and the bottom side of the starter seemed compressed , while the upper portion had no sign of even making contact , the starter rebuilder refused to agree. as to you jerks that claim i did it with a pressure washer , you guys dont know sh-t from shinola and you ought to look up common sense on your squireely telephones .

I never thought for a minute that pressure washing was a bad thing. Like I said, a person would HAVE to be trying really hard to make the water go into the starter, and like you said, it was a very poor rebuild job and the rebuilder SHOULD stand behind it.
 
Interesting, as to the entry port to allow water to enter the starter?

In 2010 I purchased property that had a Tractor on it,(not JD). The owner had purchased the Tractor new in 1979, and said Tractor had never been parked inside a building.

I was informed the Starter was not functioning. When I removed the Starter, water pored from the opening at the point were the Starter attached.

Over the years, water had entered the transmission from any and all openings (gear shift boots), then passed the input shaft seal, filled the bell housing, clutch assembly, and finely the Starter.

Bob...Owner Operator several different colored tractors...
 
(quoted from post at 07:11:03 12/07/18) Sounds to me like the problem was more that the water could not get OUT. "Sealing" usually accomplishes that, especially when it involves gobbing silicone everywhere. You get all the water exits but inevitably miss an entry point or two. Water gets in but it can't get back out.

B.E., I agree with you 100%.

Since I use my 4020 powershift on a snowblower and melting snow gets everywhere, I drilled a drain hole in the flywheel housing AND the lowest point of the starter "belly" and any water that sneaks in can get OUT.

Many years ago, in the consumer "big satellite dish era" I was a sort of "field rep for one of the major companies.

The industry was having trouble with water getting into the lowest part of the "power arm", the electric "jackscrew" that moved the dish from satellite to satellite.

That "lowest point" was the motor and directional feedback sensor area, and every possible seal and boot that was affordable at the consumer level was tried by various manufacturers, with little lasting success and lots of warranty issues and angry owners after the warranty period.

Then, someone got the idea to simply drill a drain hole at the lowest point of the motor unit which nearly 100% ended the issue.

Turned out it was more successful to let a little water pass on through than it was to try to seal ALL water out!
 

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