Gas caddy...

Red1

Member
Getting tired of manhandling 5 gal gas containers to fill up the 8n or the mowers...Trying to find a gas caddy that doesn't need to sit up higher than the tank being filled..and preferably with a hand pump that works...Suckers are pricey...Probably too small for the larger operations, but for my small needs a decent one would be a back saver...Any suggestions?
 
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Local wal-mart or google Stark Gas Caddy. Yep, expensive but can't have it both ways.
 
Here we go again.
This should get interesting as people that think they know a solution respond.
We have hashed this out several times on this site if you want to search the past post.

Lets just make this simple.
It is against federal law to haul gasoline in any container larger than 8 gallons unless you are a registered hazmat hauler.
 
I bought an older FHC 30 gallon gas caddy at an auction, half full of gasoline even. It has a GasBoy pump, works well to set it in the back of the truck, fill it at the station, then lift it off with the loader tractor. I now only have the two antique JDs to use gasoline, everything else is diesel. Fill it to 25 gallons or it sloshes out the vent.
 
This is but one of the many laws I willfully violate. I will pay any appropriate fine if caught and ticketed.

Please don't come inspect my mattresses.
 
(quoted from post at 16:29:54 12/04/18) Here we go again.
This should get interesting as people that think they know a solution respond.
We have hashed this out several times on this site if you want to search the past post.

Lets just make this simple.
It is against federal law to haul gasoline in any container larger than 8 gallons unless you are a registered hazmat hauler.

I would use my 5 gallon containers to fill the caddy...nothing larger than 15 - 20 gallons...And the caddy stays at the house...

A wonder my Dad and about a hundred other farmers from my area don't get arrested with their 50 - 100 gallon bulk fuel tanks...?
 
Bought a 250 gallon on stand for diesel this summer. Don?t
know why? Won?t use enough to justify it. Would never try and
store that much gasoline. Just dangerous from what I have
heard.
 
I bought a battery operated transfer pump from Harbor Freight, uses two d cell batteries, only 10 bucks works great.
 
(quoted from post at 20:29:54 12/04/18) Here we go again.
This should get interesting as people that think they know a solution respond.
We have hashed this out several times on this site if you want to search the past post.

Lets just make this simple.
It is against federal law to haul gasoline in any container larger than 8 gallons unless you are a registered hazmat hauler.

Can you cite the rule/publication, etc. where it says what you say??
 
I buy oil and hydraulic fluid in 2.5 gallon plastic containers, and then save them for fuel. 5 gallons is too heavy, but I can still handle 2.5 gallons. Metal funnel, turn fuel container on its side and it won't leak when laid on the funnel. Line 'em up across the back of the pickup to go fill them.
 
John, yes you've provided a lot of direction on this subject in the last 6 months. Just wondering if you are restricted on "HOW MANY" 8 gallon containers you may haul. If the law makers decided on the magic number 8, wondered if there are any other magic numbers. I'll do a bit of searching concerning Fed. Law. Did'nt you haul mogas for a time in your career? thanks for sharing your knowledge. gobble
 
There is no one line in the regulations that states what I said.

What the regulation does say is "Anyone" that transports hazardous materials must follow haz mat rules.
Then a few pages back it gives a exemption for what is called "Materials of Trade"
In this Materials of Trades exemption it limits gasoline and other Packing Group II or III; (other than division 4.3) or is a consumer commodity to 8 gallons or 66 lbs if a solid.

https://hazmatonline.phmsa.dot.gov/services/publication_documents/MOTS05.pdf

Look in the bottom left corner of linked page.

The forest service also has a good publication on gasoline.
Look on page 4 and page 39.

https://www.fs.fed.us/t-d/fueltran/training/genawaretrng.pdf

Also in the past a X New York DOT officer that post on here question my comment of 8 gallons.
He went and asked a friend of his that is a current DOT officer and found my comment to be true.
 
Tom;
For all haz mat hauled at one time you are limited to 440 lbs.
This includes things like batteries; gasoline; and paint.

So if you had nothing but 5 gallon containers of gasoline you could haul about 12 five gallon cans.
440 lbs divided by 6.5 lbs per gallon (depending on temperature of gasoline) equals 67 gallons. Take off some for can weight.

Gasoline is a packing group III flammable material so it is limited to 8 gallon containers.

Diesel fuel on the other hand is not flammable. It is a combustible.
Diesel fuel is not regulated by DOT in packages less than 119 gallons. (bulk containers)
Since it is not regulated you can pretty much do as you please (within reason) as long as you keep the container size below 119 gallons.
This is why you can have bulk pickup bed fuel tanks for diesel fuel in sizes around 100 gallons.

Yes I have hauled hazardous materials in one form or another my entire career.
This includes about 15 years of pulling a 9200 gallon gasoline tanker.
I was also a haz mat instructor for DOT compliance training for 1 of the gasoline companies I worked for.
 

Seems quite odd that you can google up hundreds of 30 gallon capacity GASOLINE caddys.
Walmart and Amazon selling them and none say anything about hazmat permits, etc. to actually use them. Nor do they say they can't be used to haul more than eight gallons at a time.

But I do find verb-age on quantity limits without hazmat training if an employee and hauling it as a business endeavor.

Perhaps private use is also exempt ?
 
The only gasoline I store is about 5 gallons for the lawn mower. Be advised a storage tank of gasoline has to be at least 50 feet
away from a building. Your insurance company may not cover a loss if there is an incident.
 
John , This is not intended as disrespectful. Rather I thought you might appreciate it. Was reading your post and thought - this guy knows about fuel. Then I thought , OMG , It's " The Gas Daddy" informing us about the fuel caddy. Maybe you should change your user name. Thanks for your efforts to keep us all from going up in flames. Fire scares me.
 
"Nor do they say they can't be used to haul more than eight gallons at a time."

There you go trying to read between the lines again.
Because the rules state that a empty 30 gallon caddy that last contained gasoline; or one with 8 gallons in it; or one that is full with 30 gallons of gasoline in it now; are all treated the same. A 30 gallon gasoline container.
This is why you see a empty gasoline tanker that last had gasoline in it with the placards still on the side of the tank.
Even the empty tank is regulated.

Also perhaps people are selling things that are legal to own but have limited use on the road.
Window tinting and blue off road headlights come to mind.

But like I say every time we get into this discussion.
Do as you please but just accept that you have been told the rules.
 
And rather than looking at a seller like Amazon or Walmart that their main interest is selling a product lets look at the manufactures website for literature on the caddy.

Dang there it is in black and white and I even colored it in yellow to make it easy for you to see.



cvphoto4761.png
 
I use jeep cans to buy fuel. I fit 6 or so in the back of my pickup. I got tired of doing a balancing act standing on my tractor front axle, trying to hit the funnel, plus I am getting too old. I bought a stainless steel air operated drum pump from my work, when they closed the plant. I just stick the pump in the cans, and fill my tank. Works great. I'm still looking for a tank I can put in my pickup bed. Stan
 
That's because they are perfectly legal to use around the farm or shop where they are most handy.

Simply buy the gasoline in 5 gallon cans to refill the caddy once home.

The empty caddy is too heavy to load/unload easily in any event.

Dean
 
DOT and hazmat regulations do not have the same authority or jurisdiction for private, personal and agricultural use as they do for commercial and/or any other commerce use.

I'm not going to cite regulations but would suggest anyone to read (carefully) what the regulations are and more importantly if those regulations apply to them. Not just federal regs but its just as important to research state and local regulations as they are usually more restrictive.
 
Beer ads don't mention not to drive drunk or beat your wife while using their product as many users do either.The companies sell the product its up to the end user to use it legally.Rifle bullets and shot gun shells also come to mind as products the end user has the responsibility to figure out its legal use.
 
I transport my gas in 5 gallon can.
There is a government conspiracy.
Government is secretly increasing the
value of gravity. Gravity determines how
much things weigh. Proof gravity is
increasing is my weight is increasing.
My 5 gallon can weigh more.

I put a 5 gallon can on top of tractor
and use a siphon hose called a jiggler
to transfer the gas. HF and Menards
sells them for around $10.

On days when government increases
gravity, I may only put 3 gallons in 5
gallon cans.

They do make gas cans with a pump like
handle that primes the hose. Still uses
gravity to siphon gas.

If you put a gas tank outside, better
have a pitbull to guard it.

My sister has a tank in the ground and a
gas pump inside pole barn. They have a
HVAC business. Someone fills their tank.
 
Yea its amazing how much heavier a 100lb sack of feed is now than it was 30 years ago.And its not fair a pack of Reece's cups doesn't weigh hardly anything any more(LOL)
 
I usually just fill a group of 5 gal gas cans and go around to the gas tractors,back up to the tractors and stand on the tailgate of the truck to put in the gas.
 
I still use 5 gallon cans (old ones that pour) and a tractor funnel but am shopping for a gasoline caddy with a pump. I like the Stark can referenced below, and the Wal Mart price with free shipping sounds good.

That said, for some tractors that are easily over filled, I pour 2 or 3 gallons of diesel fuel from a 5 gallon can into a plastic radiator fill can and pour from the can. Such cans, with long spouts, were once ubiquitous at full service gasoline stations (remember those?). The spout has a handy turn down on the end for filling radiators so no funnel is needed, making it much easier to view the tank level to avoid over filling.

I bought mine from NAPA about 10 years ago and they needed to order it then. They are getting hard to find.

Works well for moderate amounts of fuel but time consuming for larger amounts.

Dean
 
(quoted from post at 17:15:22 12/04/18) I bought a battery operated transfer pump from Harbor Freight, uses two d cell batteries, only 10 bucks works great.

Yeah I see that...But will it pump when the fill tank is a couple of feet higher than it?
 
(quoted from post at 20:37:20 12/04/18) I use jeep cans to buy fuel. I fit 6 or so in the back of my pickup. I got tired of doing a balancing act standing on my tractor front axle, trying to hit the funnel, plus I am getting too old. I bought a stainless steel air operated drum pump from my work, when they closed the plant. I just stick the pump in the cans, and fill my tank. Works great. I'm still looking for a tank I can put in my pickup bed. Stan

Aren't those used on grease buckets?
 
(quoted from post at 00:46:57 12/05/18) That's because they are perfectly legal to use around the farm or shop where they are most handy.

Simply buy the gasoline in 5 gallon cans to refill the caddy once home.

The empty caddy is too heavy to load/unload easily in any event.

Dean

Bingo!!!
 
(quoted from post at 03:33:50 12/05/18) DOT and hazmat regulations do not have the same authority or jurisdiction for private, personal and agricultural use as they do for commercial and/or any other commerce use.

I'm not going to cite regulations but would suggest anyone to read (carefully) what the regulations are and more importantly if those regulations apply to them. Not just federal regs but its just as important to research state and local regulations as they are usually more restrictive.

WHOA! FMCSR CMV regs are one thing, HazMat is another. Do not for a single solitary second think HazMat regs do not apply to private, personal or ag situations. Anything to do with HazMat for private or personal use will fall under MOT or Limited Quantity exceptions. Ag exemptions are spelled out in several ways, but in the end you have no exemption that isn't covered in the HazMat regs. I don't care who you are, you can't haul certain amounts of many things without following the rules even if you're a farmer or Joe Average. The "DOT Regs" (FMCSR) apply to vehicle in commerce. HazMat applies across the board, commercial or not once you pass a quantity point that varies from ounces to tons. There are NO state or local laws that supersede HazMat regs.
 
(quoted from post at 22:40:17 12/04/18)

Also in the past a X New York DOT officer that post on here question my comment of 8 gallons.
He went and asked a friend of his that is a current DOT officer and found my comment to be true.

IIRC it was the way things were worded John. "Can't haul more than 8 gallons of gasoline" vs. "Can't haul gasoline in containers holding more than 8 gallons" type of thing.

10 years out of the DOT biz and the same bad info is being peddled by those that think the rules don't apply to them. Gotta be at least 15 years that you and I have been trying to steer people away from big fine territory! :lol:
 
Yes Bret.
The average Joe can haul a little over 60 gallons of gasoline at one time.
He just can not use containers bigger than 8 gallons.

Just like he can haul a unlimited amount of diesel.
He just can not use containers larger than 119 gallons.

Why people think they are exempt from safety rules is beyond my comprehension.
I do not have to follow hazmat; tie down; and other rules because I am personal use.
Isn't that like saying I do not have to stop at a stop sign because I am in a personal car.
Rules are for everyone including DOT laws.
The law just gives a exemption to a lot of the rules if you fall into specific categories like under 10,000 lbs or a farmer/RV.
Without a specific exemption any DOT law applies to everyone.
Even with a exemption from federal laws state laws usually kick in.

If they really wanted to get down to it the 8 gallon container size by federal law is mute in some states like your state of New York.
They only allow four 5 gallon containers.
But it gets to complicated checking each state law.





cvphoto4819.png
 
(quoted from post at 19:59:58 12/04/18) I bet five gallons will start a fire as efficiently as 100 gallons in case of an accident.
Hey no problem at all. When your lawyer tells that to the prosecutor they will say” you know that is right , let’s just drop all those charges and lawsuits “.
 
(quoted from post at 20:49:42 12/04/18) I buy oil and hydraulic fluid in 2.5 gallon plastic containers, and then save them for fuel. 5 gallons is too heavy, but I can still handle 2.5 gallons. Metal funnel, turn fuel container on its side and it won't leak when laid on the funnel. Line 'em up across the back of the pickup to go fill them.

Filling containers not approved for gasoline will make you liable if anything happens . Or even a fine if some official happens to notice . Is it worth the risk? There are 2 or 2-1/2 gallon gas cans for sale .
 
(quoted from post at 22:01:45 12/04/18)
Seems quite odd that you can google up hundreds of 30 gallon capacity GASOLINE caddys.
Walmart and Amazon selling them and none say anything about hazmat permits, etc. to actually use them. Nor do they say they can't be used to haul more than eight gallons at a time.

But I do find verb-age on quantity limits without hazmat training if an employee and hauling it as a business endeavor.

Perhaps private use is also exempt ?
Walmart and Amazon also sell electrical equipment and parts that a “Bubba” has no business trying to install or use.
 
And gravity is making print smaller, harder to see.
Not to mention gravity is somehow stretching distance. The distance from the house to pole barn is getting longer and longer.
Someone needs to blow the whistle on this government conspiracy. Or is it the Russians messing with our gravity?
 
I've considered a gas caddy on multiple occasions, but legalities aside, they seem like more of a hassle than a convenience.

Who's lifting 15+ gallons of gas out of the back of the truck after you've taken it to the gas station and filled it? You gotta go get the loader tractor, not bash your tailgate with the bucket, maneuver the caddy into the bucket, and lower it to the ground. Hassle and inconvenience.

If you're going to be hauling the gas home in 5 gallon cans, then why bother with the caddy at all? It's just another operation, and it doesn't get you away from pouring 5 gallon cans of gas. Just more hassle and inconvenience.

The cheap ones are gravity feed, so you're back to getting the loader out to use it on anything but a push mower. Sure you can put the caddy up on a shelf and fill it with 5 gallon cans, but now you're up on a ladder pouring 5 gallon cans, and your original beef was with standing on the ground pouring 5 gallon cans... How's this any better? Hint: It's not.
 
I've thought about various "bulk" solutions and they all seem to complicated. I found that just buying a couple of those really big funnels helps a lot.

I can take the whole spout off the 5-gallon gas can and then I can pour the whole can in the tractor through the funnel in about a minute instead of standing there straining my arms for 5 minutes while the gas dribbles out of a spout.

Obviously, it should be stated the funnels are illegal in 59 states and it is also illegal to transport a funnel without chaining it down with real chains. Not straps. Obviously.

Hey guys, there's this tag on my sofa that's been bugging me. Can I take it off?


(quoted from post at 13:47:17 12/05/18) And gravity is making print smaller, harder to see.
Not to mention gravity is somehow stretching distance. The distance from the house to pole barn is getting longer and longer.
Someone needs to blow the whistle on this government conspiracy. Or is it the Russians messing with our gravity?

We need El Presidente to build a wall against gravity and make Mexico pay of it. Maybe they can add that to the check they'll be sending for that other wall? That'll save them the cost of writing two checks.

Grouse
 
If I still had my AC 190XT gas with its about 50 gal.tank I could run over to the local Sheetz about 3 miles away and fill the tank and bring it home and fill a couple of those gas buddies
up.Of course the down side I'd burn about 4 gals making the trip and back(LOL)
 
Cans being filled should be set on the ground to avoid static electricity buildup, not left in the pickup bed.
 
You gotta go get the loader tractor, not bash your tailgate with the bucket, maneuver the caddy into the bucket, and lower it to the ground. Hassle and inconvenience.

I guess I have gotten pretty good at it. You [i:ff0b5871e6]could[/i:ff0b5871e6] say it's not my first rodeo... To each his own.

Cans being filled should be set on the ground to avoid static electricity buildup, not left in the pickup bed.

My caddy has a ground strap I attach to the pump nozzle while filling, and when filling tractors. That way I can turn the crank on my caddy pump with my left hand holding my lit cigarette and still surf the web on my phone in my right hand.:wink:


[u:ff0b5871e6]Not[/u:ff0b5871e6] a snarky question, but wondering, many of the portable boat gas tanks are greater than 8 gallons. Is pulling a trailer with a boat to the station and filling the tank any different than filling the tank in the back of a truck? Almost nobody wants to pay the marina prices for a small boat.
 
(quoted from post at 17:19:05 12/05/18)


[u:76fa203e91]Not[/u:76fa203e91] a snarky question, but wondering, many of the portable boat gas tanks are greater than 8 gallons. Is pulling a trailer with a boat to the station and filling the tank any different than filling the tank in the back of a truck? Almost nobody wants to pay the marina prices for a small boat.

YEP it is illegal no matter how many people do it everyday for decades!!!
 

During the 50s and 60s there just weren't that many diesel tractors around the area I lived...And because gas tractors were the norm lots of farmers, like Dad, had what we called a trap wagon...6' x 10' mostly wood, flat trailer with a 100 gallon or bigger gas tank set in the middle. Around the periphery were grease guns and odds and ends you might need in the field.
Set on 4 wheels and pulled with the pickup...
 
(quoted from post at 12:21:37 12/05/18) Yes Bret.
The average Joe can haul a little over 60 gallons of gasoline at one time.
He just can not use containers bigger than 8 gallons.

Just like he can haul a unlimited amount of diesel.
He just can not use containers larger than 119 gallons.

Why people think they are exempt from safety rules is beyond my comprehension.
I do not have to follow hazmat; tie down; and other rules because I am personal use.
Isn't that like saying I do not have to stop at a stop sign because I am in a personal car.
Rules are for everyone including DOT laws.
The law just gives a exemption to a lot of the rules if you fall into specific categories like under 10,000 lbs or a farmer/RV.
Without a specific exemption any DOT law applies to everyone.
Even with a exemption from federal laws state laws usually kick in.

If they really wanted to get down to it the 8 gallon container size by federal law is mute in some states like your state of New York.
They only allow four 5 gallon containers.
But it gets to complicated checking each state law.





<img src="https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cvphotos/cvphoto4819.png">

That looks to be a NYS DOT rules for DOT vehicles. Sounds about right though.
 
(quoted from post at 17:19:05 12/05/18)
You gotta go get the loader tractor, not bash your tailgate with the bucket, maneuver the caddy into the bucket, and lower it to the ground. Hassle and inconvenience.

I guess I have gotten pretty good at it. You [i:3741522d92]could[/i:3741522d92] say it's not my first rodeo... To each his own.

Cans being filled should be set on the ground to avoid static electricity buildup, not left in the pickup bed.

My caddy has a ground strap I attach to the pump nozzle while filling, and when filling tractors. That way I can turn the crank on my caddy pump with my left hand holding my lit cigarette and still surf the web on my phone in my right hand.:wink:


[u:3741522d92]Not[/u:3741522d92] a snarky question, but wondering, many of the portable boat gas tanks are greater than 8 gallons.[b:3741522d92] Is pulling a trailer with a boat to the station and filling the tank any different than filling the tank in the back of a truck?[/b:3741522d92] Almost nobody wants to pay the marina prices for a small boat.

If you really want to know, yeah, it is different. One is a fuel tank on a vessel, the other is a tank for transporting fuel on a vehicle. It's like the discussion we had on this subject a few weeks back where someone said just get the saddle tanks off a road tractor/truck and use them since they are "approved" for fuel. There's a difference between a vehicles fuel tank and a tank for transporting fuel. Do whatever you want, but what the laws say and people do are often 2 different things.
 
So some of this is so stupid as everything is dangerous if not used with some common sense. Now I realize this is not gasoine but diesel fuel instead. As equipment holds more gallons and more equipment is in one field : IE tractro and grain cart or tractor and tillage at same time 119 gallon wouldn't prime a p--- ant, scooter in relation to the 120-300 gallon some of this equipment holds and uses in a day. I can burn over 40 gallon planting with one tractor while another will burn close to 150-200 working ground then the other will use about the same 150-200 in tillage on long days. The combine will use about 60-80 on a long day also.
So The reason I believe some of this to be so idiotic. Not saying it is not illegal to do. Just not practical rule making, by bureaucrats with less knowledge than the dead calf out back.
 
(quoted from post at 21:43:58 12/06/18) So some of this is so stupid as everything is dangerous if not used with some common sense. Now I realize this is not gasoine but diesel fuel instead. As equipment holds more gallons and more equipment is in one field : IE tractro and grain cart or tractor and tillage at same time 119 gallon wouldn't prime a p--- ant, scooter in relation to the 120-300 gallon some of this equipment holds and uses in a day. I can burn over 40 gallon planting with one tractor while another will burn close to 150-200 working ground then the other will use about the same 150-200 in tillage on long days. The combine will use about 60-80 on a long day also.
So The reason I believe some of this to be so idiotic. Not saying it is not illegal to do. Just not practical rule making, by bureaucrats with less knowledge than the dead calf out back.
A judge and prosecutor after hearing that rational would understand and dismiss any charges related to spills, fires , injury or death.
 
(quoted from post at 22:43:58 12/06/18) So some of this is so stupid as everything is dangerous if not used with some common sense. Now I realize this is not gasoine but diesel fuel instead. As equipment holds more gallons and more equipment is in one field : IE tractro and grain cart or tractor and tillage at same time 119 gallon wouldn't prime a p--- ant, scooter in relation to the 120-300 gallon some of this equipment holds and uses in a day. I can burn over 40 gallon planting with one tractor while another will burn close to 150-200 working ground then the other will use about the same 150-200 in tillage on long days. The combine will use about 60-80 on a long day also.
So The reason I believe some of this to be so idiotic. Not saying it is not illegal to do. Just not practical rule making, by bureaucrats with less knowledge than the dead calf out back.

I think you misunderstand. That 119 gals thing is related strictly to tanks used to transport fuel and the cut off for getting into placards, shipping papers, etc. No on is saying a tractor can't have a fuel tank over that capacity. Most farms with large equipment are going to have a 1K or larger tank on site that's filled by a fuel supplier. This is strictly related to portable tanks for fuel transport. And yeah, some is kinda stupid I suppose, but the discussion isn't about the merits of why they have these laws, but rather what the laws are and how to keep out of trouble.

If there's one thing I learned in 20+ years in LE, it's that it's wasted effort to ever try to apply common sense to a legal issue! :roll:
 
Laws are usually a compromise between different interests.Any way the law doesn't limit the amount of gas or fuel that can be transported it just names the amount that once over

that a amount then more precautions are required.Pretty common in agriculture where a different set of laws apply to a farmer with 50 cows as opposed to a feed lot with 5,000 cows.
Somewhere in there it has to be a threshold number that changes the application of the law.
 

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