Fatality this morning.

We woke up to sirens this morning, a SUV went off the road at the edge of my farm, hit the neighbors driveway and rolled several times.

The vehicle looked like it held together pretty good, but driver was not wearing seat belt, ejected and killed them.

They have not released any names.

David, surely you know the prevailing wisdom here is that seat belts do not save lives, and are yet another encroachment on our freedom by big gubmint.

As the driver departed this vale of tears (by way of the driver's side window), at least he had the satisfaction of knowing he stood up for his rights to the very end.

Invictus.

Darwin was right!

The phrase dead right comes to mind.

Your statement seat belts do not save lives. How true. My 18 year old cousin was killed because of a seat belt. Dark rainy night on newely paved road not yet bermed. Hit edge of pavement and rolled her future to be husband (had already bought her wedding dress) pickup.seet belt fastened and pronounced in perfectly working when she was thrown out of the truck ( how can they help when they leave you be thrown out of a fastened intact belt). Here 17 year old sister not belted in thrown out and only a cracked pelvis. Anyway the investigating offcifer when he did the field repord that my other cousin that she was going to mary had to sign the report it was in it that the oficer witnessed the cut on her neck that broke her neck that she died instantly was in that han written report. When it came time to sign the final report all mention of the seat belt marks on her neck were removed and nothing put in report what caused her death or that the belt was fastened and supposedly working. When questioned about it was told we ARE NOT ALLOWED TO PUT IN ANYTHING LIKE THAT as they do not want the actuall figures of what belts do out there because it would make people not want to use them. Not the first instance of seat belts causing death that the seat belt use was covered up. 76 Caddy convert with 5 belts and 6 boys rolled, only the unbelted survived. Had him on the local TV news talking about it, Later the station had to denigh that he ever was on and telling how the belts killed his buddys. If you had not seen the progran as it aired you would never find it existed anyplace for his interview. Burnes me when they say not having belt on is what killed him.

This seatbelt debate will go on until the end of time. Yes they can save you life. But they can also kill you. I know that for a fact.

listened to a lady screem to death in a burning car up side down because of a seat belt, couldent get her out, she sreeamed ontil she died....that haunted me for about 10 yrs, I NEVER put a seat belt on. gooberment can kiss my ------

US traffic deaths were at the highest around 1970 hitting about 53,000. Then even as the population climbed it started dropping. People claimed it was seat belts saving lives, other said it was the collapsing steering column and others still claimed crumple zones and getting rid to steel dashboard. You can argue all day about it. But there are a couple of things I think people forget to add in.

DUI: Been a real crackdown on drinking and driving. No, it's not 100% effective but it's helped by simply reducing the number of accidents.

Medical advancements. The big one is EMTs and Paramedics. Back in 1971 when I started driving most of America only had ambulance service. Cops didn't have OX and defib units in their cars either. Most people didn't know what CPR is. IMO thse advancements have saved more lives than the others combined.

While cell phones are being blamed on the increase of traffic deaths they too have saved lives. People who happen to survive an accident or witness one can call 911 right away. Precious minutes or more are saved because of this!

I really believe that more lives have been saved because of these 3 things than any other. The safety folks like to claim it's seatbelts and completely ignore any other thing except the crackdown on drinking and driving.

Was kinda funny but we had a big safety thing in the Army before I retired. They had a state trooper come in to give us a talk about both DUI and seatbelts. Guy said "50% of the people who died in traffic accidents he had responded to in his career had not been wearing seatbelts". When he ask for question I ask him if that meant that 50% of those who died had been wearing seatbelts. That mirrors hard to find safety studies that it seems they try to hide that say it's 50/50 weather a seat belt is going to save you life or not.

Yes, I wear my seat belt. Not because I'm convinced it's going to save my life, but because I don't want to pay a fine. I witnessed an accident a few years back. Father, 2 kids dead. Another kid lost his arm and mom was pretty banged up. None were wearing seatbelts. Would not have made a difference. A full sized SUV had gone through the medium, went airborne and hit their minivan head on. SUV was traveling at a high rate of speed in very icy conditions.

Right after I got my first cell phone in 95 (bag phone, remember those?) A car in front of me lost control and crashed. I called 911 and started to render first aid (was still on active duty so my skills were much higher than today). Took the nearest EMT's about 10 minutes to be on scene.

Not really funny but I tell people the only reason cops want you to wear a seatbelt is to keep them from walking an accident scene looking for bodies. IF they don't have to search they don't get their shoes dirty.

Rick

I m with you on this one stonerock. When we travel to ohio and back I never clicket. They will never tell how many people are killed because of seatbelts. IF your number was pulled that morning it won t matter what your doing. RB

> They had a state trooper come in to give us a talk about both DUI and seatbelts. Guy said "50% of the people who died in traffic accidents he had responded to in his career had not been wearing seatbelts". When he ask for question I ask him if that meant that 50% of those who died had been wearing seatbelts. That mirrors hard to find safety studies that it seems they try to hide that say it's 50/50 weather a seat belt is going to save you life or not.

Rick, you need to brush up on your math. If 50 percent of fatalities were wearing seat belts, that does NOT mean that the your odds of survival don't increase with seat belt use. You need to consider the percentage of all vehicle occupants who wear seat belts. For example, if 100 percent of occupants wear seat belts, 100 percent of fatal accident victims will be wearing seat belts. Currently, about 90 percent of occupants wear seat belts, and about 60 percent of fatality victims were wearing seat belts.
NHTSA 2016 seat belt report

i saw something interesting in a video clip in a wrecker companies yard, new ford vs chevy both trucks suffered high speed roll overs, numerous times over, both destroyed, but while the chevys steel bent and tore, the cab roof split at the b pillars upper welds and folded down onto the occupants the ford looked worse for wear, with many outright cracks in the aluminum body including missing the whole right bed panel, but the cab, while all the glass was gone of course the structure was intact! the a and b pillars on both sides were within about 4 inches of where they should have been

Quote: The phrase dead right comes to mind.


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Bob...

Seat belt and shoulder harness are very useful for front impact restraint. Side loading, roll-over, and side impact see very little added value from a seat belt. There's really nothing short of a complete harness and molded seat that will protect from angular momentum of a roll over, or side impact.

However, I believe after seeing plenty of aftermath that the safest place to be is inside the vehicle, surrounded by steel(or Aluminum in some cases) and not outside with zero protection.

I drove a tow truck for about twenty years in addition to my other job. I saw my share of fatalities but I never saw anyone killed by wearing a seat belt. I did see one that would have been killed If he had been buckled in. He was a rural mail carrier and was driving his little Chrysler K car while sitting unbuckled In the passenger side. He got T-boned in the drivers door at a highway intersection by an old man in a Lincoln Town Car. The old man was way too blind to be driving and rich enough to get away with it.

I will say I am a firm believer in seat belts because I know the laws of physics. I do remember an accident two friends had where they came around a curve where a guy had washed his car . They were getting on it and hit the sudsy roadway car went sideways hard into a pole { Mustang} . Upon impact car tore in half . Two guys in front of car not hurt -- but no seat belts . The seat belts for the front seat where found to still be attached to the back half of the car. Had they been belted they would have been torn in half. Early Indy 500 drivers would start unbolting before they even hit the wall because they were so afraid of fire. But despite it may kill you I don't want to be ejected so I wear it .

Most Tbone accidents are caused by running yellow lites that turn red. The old man maybe had the right of way.
That said, in a wreck where you are hit in the door, a seat belt probably won't help.

Disregard my post! What was I thinking?

The rich old man had crossed way over the solid white line and would have run off the road if he hadn't hit the mailman first. From the skid marks it was evident that the mailman was not in the intersection yet. The old man later had his car repaired so he could still use it. Funny what you can get away with when you own much of the town.

Smoke detectors kill people! In 3 out of 256,789 instances where a smoke detector has activated, some one opened their bedroom door and were instantly killed by the heat. Why would any one own such a dangerous device?

I also think the death rate has decreased because of the accidents that never happen.

Look back at the cars of the 60's-80's, the "muscle car" era. The manufacturers were dropping huge engines in the bodies they already had in production. Vehicles that were never intended to handle the horse power or extra weight. Most were ill handling, top heavy, poor brakes, poor suspension and steering. Accidents waiting to happen!

Once foreign competition and government regulation of safety came along, the accident rate dropped due to vehicles being better equipped to handle the speed and power.

I got in a accident about 10 years ago, hit the retaining wall on I 96 doing about 40. Trashed the van, I walked away. It was winter, I had a heavy winter coat on, and a flannel shirt and undershirt. When I got undressed, I was surprised to find that I had a bruise from the belt, from my shoulder down to my stomach. I knew I hit hard, and if I hadn?t been wearing that belt, I would have been ejected into oncoming traffic...

Yeah, it saved my life.

Many people believe that smoking will kill you. Well the fact is that genetics can make the difference in whether or not you get lung cancer from smoking. Some 10 out of 500,000 people that smoke will never get lung cancer, so you may as well smoke while driving around without your seat belt on.

Boss Hogg?

I remember a time when a local store manager had an accident on his way to work early in the morning. Car caught on fire. He couldn't get out. He burnt alive. He begged the cop to shoot him, as he burnt alive. Cop couldn't do it. I could not imagine going that way.

Some live their lives trying to fill inside straits. Occasionally works, but most of the time you lose. Buckle up, the odds are with you

Test-if you are safer unbuckled, put your grandkids in the bed of the truck. Screw the government, you know what's best for those kids, so take the hit in the name of your grandchildrens lives.

(quoted from post at 07:26:44 10/13/17) > They had a state trooper come in to give us a talk about both DUI and seatbelts. Guy said "50% of the people who died in traffic accidents he had responded to in his career had not been wearing seatbelts". When he ask for question I ask him if that meant that 50% of those who died had been wearing seatbelts. That mirrors hard to find safety studies that it seems they try to hide that say it's 50/50 weather a seat belt is going to save you life or not.

Rick, you need to brush up on your math. If 50 percent of fatalities were wearing seat belts, that does NOT mean that the your odds of survival don't increase with seat belt use. You need to consider the percentage of all vehicle occupants who wear seat belts. For example, if 100 percent of occupants wear seat belts, 100 percent of fatal accident victims will be wearing seat belts. Currently, about 90 percent of occupants wear seat belts, and about 60 percent of fatality victims were wearing seat belts.
NHTSA 2016 seat belt report

Click to expand...

Mark I'm going by what the cop told us back around 94/95 before most states had made seat belts mandatory. I retired in 96 and was living in MN for a few years before MN made them mandatory.

Rick

This is what I'm getting from this conversation - "thirty years ago, I once saw a freak accident where no one could possibly have survived whether they are wearing their seatbelts or not, so I won't wear a gubmint controlled restraint device ever!"

That about right?

Yes, vehicles are much, much safer now for many reasons. Seatbelts and airbags are part of that reason. Some mistakes have been made (like making airbags too violent, and using only lap belts without shoulder belt), but I'd much rather be riding in my 2005 Ford F150 than my 1971 Ford F100 in an accident.