plowing down grass

jude116057 · Aug 3, 2017

I would like to sow some alfalfa this month in an area that use to be a tobacco base and is now in grass. after reading my grandfathers soil book it says to disk prior to plowing, harrow after plowing, fertilize and lime according to soil samples, disk and cultipack before sowing. I will be using a brillion seeder to apply the seed. any suggestions to improve this procedure? I want to get this right the first time as it will be a bit pricey.

thanks in advance,
jude

2underage · Aug 3, 2017

You should first spray it to kill the existing grass and weeds. It will save you from a lot of weed problems later.

Paul from MI · Aug 3, 2017

I'm not familiar with a brillion seeder, but I've had good success broadcasting seed, then cultipacking. alfalfa is a small seed and not planted deep so good soil/seed contact is important. Also some extra time spent getting a good level field pays off when you bale later.

Leroy · Aug 3, 2017

Spray to kill the grass, then plow, no need to disk before plowing. But get it about as fine as you can and as level as possible. Disking after plowing good but then you need an implement with teeth to do the finnish tillage as the disk will not level out a plow job but the teeth will, Field cultivator or spring tooth harrow or cultimulcher followed by a spike tooth harrow or even a section of chain link fence several times over in all directions to get level and as smooth as your table top. The seeded will automaticaly control seed depth if ground is in correct condition.

gene bender · Aug 3, 2017

You need to kill everything first with roundup. After plowing let ground dry some fresh plowed sod is hard to break up. then with a disc and harrow it should smooth out good.

coonie minnie · Aug 3, 2017

Have you done the soil testing???

If I were you, I'd burn down the grass and weeds with roundup, and then no till seed the alfalfa. No plowing, disking, harrowing, etc. You will end up with a better, cleaner stand and if you are seeding now, odds of success are greater, because with no-till you will lose a lot less moisture to evaporation. Those small alfalfa seeds and seedlings need moisture, and in my climate, that can be lacking in August.

Done this since 1990, and never looked back. It works better than the till and pack method... plus no stones to pick!

jude116057 · Aug 3, 2017

haven't done the soil test yet will do that first of the week. unfortunately the ground wasn't left in very good shape after the tobacco so it is like driving across plowed ground now.

4520BW · Aug 3, 2017

Plant round up ready alfalfa and you will never have a weed problem. The quality of hay will offset the high seed price.

Texasmark1 · Aug 3, 2017

I'd add shredding as the first step. Here in hard clay, that makes moldboarding impossible, rolling tillage is the requirement and long stems don't roll in very easily.

However, this year I bought a 3 pt PTO driven roto tiller. I now have a bunch of useless implements sitting around. Current procedure:

1. Mow if ground cover is of sufficient height, if not skip this step.
2. Incorporate the Hay King Pasture Renovator for sub soil (plow pan removal) aeration.
3. Broadcast fertilizer per soil test recommendations for crop to be produced and quantity.
3. Incorporate the rototiller with a flexible spike toothed harrow hooked up behind....one pass plowing operation/seed bed preparation.
4. Drill seed.
5. Go sit in the shade with your beverage of choice and wait for it to rain.

jeffcat · Aug 3, 2017

As another said, there is nothing like a rototiller. If you could borrow a golf course tractor with those huge turf tires that would be even better. The smooter the better. Those Brillion Cultipacker machines make the most perfect fields you could ever want. We had one till my old man gave it away. Ten years latter I am still ticked off. These will seed a bed that is super duper smooth. The one with wheels is the newer version.

Fordfarmer · Aug 3, 2017

Reading the comments really reinforces that it depends on your location/soil type. The first time I heard of disking before plowing, I thought WHY??? Unheard of here.
Here, at this time of year, spraying would be a waste, as the grass is too mature for the spray to be effective. So I'd plow, then disk, then use a field cultivator or spike tooth drag, if needed. (I sold my spike tooth several years ago, as I have a field cultivator with a coil tine harrow mounted on the rear now) While you want a nice smooth field, you don't want extra trips across it... extra time, fuel, and compaction. The Brillion seeder is the way to go for a good stand. You'll get a better stand with less seed than you can from a broadcast seeder or the small seed box on a grain drill.

jude116057 · Aug 3, 2017

I too hadn't heard of disking prior to plowing but according to the soil book I read, which was copy right 1927, it is to prevent the turned over sod from being hard on the bottom since the disk will not go as deep as the plow.

James Howell · Aug 3, 2017

"<font color="#6699ff">[b:654c4848f0][i:654c4848f0]any suggestions to improve this procedure?[/i:654c4848f0][/b:654c4848f0]</font>"

This is one method we have successfully used to prepare seed beds on our farm.

Start by spraying your favorite weed killing herbicide to kill the grass.

Once the grass is dead, <a href="https://youtu.be/GPZqbgI8C2M?list=PLCUEeGboEbi_ghiwDfbp7y3dHoya0w7gf">use a spring tooth harrow</a> to break the ground and destroy roots.

You might consider <a href="https://youtu.be/RKC3WnygBz0">using a blade</a> to smooth out any high and low spots.

<a href="https://youtu.be/wEgYGdY4lWo?list=PLCUEeGboEbi_ghiwDfbp7y3dHoya0w7gf">Use a disc harrow</a> to break up the large "clods" made with the spring tooth harrow.

<a href="https://youtu.be/tJ7yLfTallw">Use a rotary hoe</a> to break up the "clods" made with the disc harrow.

<a href="https://youtu.be/GrgtH66JLFc">Use a cultipacker</a>, like our Brillion Sure Stand Seeder shown in [b:654c4848f0]jeffcat[/b:654c4848f0]'s reply below, to pack the loose soil made with the rotary hoe.

<a href="https://youtu.be/C-ZHy0tgmBc">Use a spreader</a> to broadcast the seed.

<a href="https://youtu.be/BtgDsCngdlQ">Use the cultipacker again</a> to make a good "seed-to-soil" contact.

Then pray for rain.

Hope this helps.

charlie n · Aug 3, 2017

The disking before the plow was old school farming.It helped chop the sod to make it easier to work down. I still do that process except I subsoil 18-24" deep instead of disking. The results speak for themselves

[img]https://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc228/charlien218/09 Harvesting/DSCF0315.jpg[/img]

K Effective · Aug 3, 2017

You will regret limiting passes over the field if it is as rough as you indicate- I bale a neighbor's field that was broadcast seeded right after moldboard plowing, it is so rough we cannot stack the wagons to five wide or even six high, as the trailer gets rocking enough to dislodge bales before it is full. He does not want it worked just yet until all that expensive seed is valued...

Soil sample, reduce existing grass to small size as best you can (chop/shred, bale it off, or burn it), disc it to cut the sod, plow it under (pay attention to previous dead furrows to eliminate high/low spots), disc again, then use a drag/harrow extensively to level the field as much as you can. Culti-pack cross-direction then seed it and pray for rain. When available, I like to use a deep ripper in a couple of passes on old grass fields, and chisel plowing works but does not bury as much as moldboard. I have used the rototiller successfully on a level soybean stubble field, but regret not working one end of that field that was chiseled to eliminate combine ruts.

For my cows, I like to seed a pasture mix with alfalfa, clover and grasses- it certainly dries quicker than straight alfalfa, and my beef calves do not need pure protein.

charlie n · Aug 3, 2017

plowing down grass

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