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Choke?????????

B

Bob Bancroft

Well-known Member
Location
Aurora NY
I was at the local heavy truck shop yesterday, talking with the owner. He has an old gas powered tractor/backhoe/loader he uses around his place. He told me something I hadn't considered- he's finding more and more helpers who only know to turn a key to start something! He's having to teach them the concept of a choke! While I was there, his son got it started, but stalled it once (easy enough to do) but it proved his fathers' point.
 
Remember when car's and trucks had a choke? The thing I remember the most is no two tractors ever choked the same . Instructions on how to start your tractor included how much choke.
But this goes to prove us old guys may not be able to start a computer but we know how to choke a vehicle.
 
Even some old guys never really understood just what the coke did , how it worked , and how to use it. Both of my old trucks have Manuel cokes,. My boys think I am doing some kind of witchcraft or something when I get the truck to start, just try to find a mechanic that knows how to make one work. Bruce
 
Yes, chokes are foreign to some kids, like computers are foreign to their fathers.

I have a 2012 Kawasaki mule. I had to trick my computer by placing a 10k thermister in parallel with the air temp sensor to make computer it think the air temp is warmer so the computer would send less fuel to injectors, less electronic choke.

I'm 67 and grew up with manual chokes.
geo
 
Today a manual choke is about as common as the old steering mounted spark control was back when we were learning to drive.

Dad's 1959 Plymouth had an automatic choke. Fuel injection has been almost universal in vehicles since the mid 1980's, that's thirty years ago. Gasoline tractor sales faded out in the early 1970's. Some small engines still use a manual choke. Some older motorcycles and snowmobiles with carburetors also have a manual choke.
 
Funny you would post this because I was going to ask same question. My sons are now 25 and 26 and both are heavy equipment machanics by trade.They were always by my side in the shop growing up BUT neither one of them can run a choke right. The sound of the engine needing more or less just escapes them.

Can you even imagine the current generations of citiots operating a pre 1980s car on a daily basis??? Setting the choke, kicking it off, pumping the accelerator pump on cold mornings,, points and plugs,, heck the roads would be lined with broke down vehicles.
 
Let's remember that nearly all passenger vehicles made over the past thirty years have fuel injection. Even motorcycles and ATVs these days are fuel injected. Outdoor power equipment may have a primer bulb with or without a choke.

If you'll recall back to the Golden Age of carbureted vehicles, half of the drivers back in the seventies didn't understand how to operate an AUTOMATIC choke. Pump it once or twice, then take your foot off the gas and the car should fire right up. But that was too simple; how many times do you remember watching someone pump the gas like crazy while cranking the engine? J. C. Whitney sold thousands of manual choke conversion kits to folks too stupid to operate an automatic choke.
 
I guess the situation is reversed when I have to ask something simple about my smart phone and my kids can whip out an answer without thinking about it.
About a year ago, I had purchased four new tires for my '98 Ford Ranger. It has a manual transmission and my vehicle was in line at a local tire shop that employed 4-5 younger guys. I asked the of the young employees if anybody there knew how to drive a vehicle with a manual transmission. He told me that they have a designated driver for any vehicle with a manual transmission and that this designated driver would be driving my vehicle into the shop. He pointed out their designated driver, a guy who was well past retirement age, probably 75 or so.
 
No argument from me, but I think a lot of the "pumping" you reference was because of an automatic choke not working properly. My first car was a 1967 Malibu (convertible) with a 283. I recall installing new choke springs(the part that sat in the manifold and responded to heat)- lubricating linkage to keep it working- bending links to get the right amount of choke-setting high idle, etc. I recall playing with the choke pull-off trying to get it just right. Etc. In short, I don't miss automotive carburetors at all. Even when maintained, they were so crude. I am still amazed with my fuel injected automotive engines. My pickup is also a farm service truck, and as such gets a lot of idle time. It can set there and idle for as long as I want, and it never loads up. Get in, and take off. No black smoke, no hesitation from being too rich. So the same carb. which hesitated from being lean (cold) could get you with the other extreme!

Now I'm remembering, on a cold morning, I could hear the choke snap shut when I touched the gas pedal on my old 283.
 
Have several older trucks in the yard we use for spares, yard help will grind the batteries dead trying to start them. Same seal with manual transmissions,constant clutch adjustments or replacements, we are now replacing all the medium duty trucks with manual trans to new models with automatics,as they are rotated out, On another note, try to find an equipment operator under 50 that can start an older cat with a pony motor.
 
I can attest to the automatic choke not working properly. We had a 1979 Chevy Blazer with a 305 and a 2-barrel carburetor. Rebuilt the carburetor numerous times, adjusted everything perfectly numerous times, replaced parts numerous times. The automatic choke would NEVER work right. Either it would stick and flood the engine, or it would not set. Regardless, you had to sit there and hold it just off idle to keep it running until it warmed up.

I generally got the dubious distinction of going out early to start it when we were going to church or wherever in the winter.
 
I'm asked "what's the Choke knob?" all the time when I'm out in my 47 WDX Power Wagon
Or the 52 M37.
And then when I push on the floor starter pedal, it really blows
Them away!
Tom
 
Then there are a few old timers that start pumping the gas pedal on their fuel injected engine as soon as they put the key in the switch. Then they wonder why it starts hard. I have one friend that does that. He puts it into "clear flood" mode by pumping the pedal, and that shuts off the injectors. Engine will not start without fuel.

Then there are the automatic chokes that never did work right. Some did, some didn't. Getting one adjusted "just right" was a royal pain in the seat of the pants. And, "just right" for 40 degrees may or may not work for 5 degrees or even for 70 degrees. The fact is that chokes were a compromise even at their best. There was no substitute for experience in operating that particular piece of equipment.
 
A few years back I had my 07 Dodge 2500 with 6 sp manual in the Dodge dealer for something, don't remember what, and when it was ready the service manager told the young girl who was there to go and get my truck. She came back in a few minutes and said "I don't know how to drive a manual transmission". I said to the SM I would go and get my truck, no problem. Amazed that they would have someone who was supposed to be moving vehicles around and could not manage a manual.
 
Except the little heat tube that went from the exh manifold to the auto choke frequently rotted out.
I had to install manual choke kits on both my 69 Rambler and 66 F250 for that reason. It would rust off and no way could you get the end out of the manifold.
 
I know exactly what you are talking about!

We have an early 70's Allis Chalmers forklift with an updraft carb. There are only 3 of us that know how to start it, and 2 of them can only get it started if all goes well!

I can always tell when someone else is trying to get it started... Crank and pump, crank and pump...

"Pull the choke"

"The whatttt?"

"The choke, right there, like that last time I showed you."

"Oh, OK".

Ten minutes later, shop full of smoke, poor lift truck blubbering...

"Push the choke in!"

"The whatttt?"

LOL
 
I recently saw part of a talk show where they asked Hellen Mirren about being in the new Fast and Furious movie (Furious 8). She replied "?I?m probably one of the few people on the set who know how to drive a gear shift car. I doubt The Rock knows.?
 
Remember the Model A Fords; it had a choke plus you could adjust the carburetor by turning the knob. As the engine warmed up, you could fine tune the amount of gas flowing to the engine. Dad knew a deaf man who could fine tune a Model A just by sensing the vibrations of the engine.
 
I've seen those posts on here. "Why do I have to use the choke every time I start my tractor?".
 
Something I do not understand, since a lot of modern equipment has a choke. My ZTR won't start even in warm weather without choke. Tiller, snow thrower...all have a choke. I would like to see one of these people start the 72 grain truck. Needs choke to start but you better be able to listen and feather that knob or you will smoke up the barn and stall it. Then there is my 76 PU, pedal all the way to the floor and back once before cranking. Engine roars until you repeat the process and then it drops RPM's and idles nice...but you need to know how and when.
 
Man I used to work with years ago bought an Eldorado, mid seventies I'm guessing. It was one of the first American attempts at electronic fuel injection.

A real oddity, had 2 fuel pumps, a low pressure in the tank, a high pressure in the line by the tank.

But it also had a series of contacts in the fuel control that would actually give small spurts of fuel into the throttle body when as the throttle plate opened, equivalent to an accelerator pump in a carb.

I'm not sure if that was just for cold starting or the same purpose as an accelerator pump, maybe both, but it did have to be pumped on a cold day.

That was a high dollar car in it's day! It was a miserable piece of junk by the time he got it! LOL
 
Kind of the same but different. Years ago I worked for a trucking company that used the little diesel VW Rabbit pickups as parts chasers. Had to ride with the bosses son one day to pick up a tractor. He hops in the driver's seat of the VW and tells me he always has to choke it to get it to start. Choke a diesel. OK. It was the timing retarder.
 
Now before all you old pharts break your arms patting yourself on the back here is a little something to chew on.

Which one is going to earn a decent living today and is even applicable in todays world. Knowing how a choke works and how to use it or knowing how to turn on a computer and use it? And just what did you use to get on here? Darn sure wasn't a choke!

Yep, I remember when we had cokes and carburetors on cars and how at 15 below zero it was hit and miss as to weather it would start after it had been plugged in for hours. The computer controlled Suburban my wife drives will start reliably at -30F without being plugged in!

Rick
 
Mention breaker points to the younger crowd and see what kind of reaction you get. :lol: I have a young cousin that is a very good diesel mechanic, but has never had any training or experience on battery ignition. When the old Farmall H his Dad gave him quit (burned points) he was at a loss as to what to do so I went over to help him out, and explained how an ignition system worked, plus gave him a copy of an ignition system course I had taught at a couple of tractor get togethers. Being a smart aleck I asked him if I should put an injection pump on it so he would know how to work on it in the future. 8)
 
Had that happen on a 55 Plymouth v8. It sucked the moist exhaust into the automatic choke and froze it up solid. Had to disconnect the choke as I was on my way up north for deer hunting. Rest of trip was manual choking it from under the hood. The local Chrysler dealer had the choke stove in stock and told me how to get old one out.

Then I had this miserable choke that I could not get set to my satisfaction on a 68 with 383 v8. I put a manual choke on and my oldest son would not drive that car. I tried to show him how a choke worked on a spare carburetor but he would not even listen. Sooo, sold the car to second son and he had no problems.
 
One other manual thing is a truck without power steering I had a Mazda that way warned a guy he hopped in didn't listen he had a surprised look on his face and of course he gunned it headed for a wall
 
I've driven trucks with two sticks, also 13 speeds and other combinations, guess I'm getting old. They would really be confused with some of those.
 
(quoted from post at 08:44:54 12/29/16) Something I do not understand, since a lot of modern equipment has a choke. My ZTR won't start even in warm weather without choke. Tiller, snow thrower...all have a choke.
Click to expand...

Modern emissions requirements have these things running so lean under normal conditions that they won't start without choke. Of course the carburetors are non-adjustable so you can't richen them up a little so they'll run right.
 
Car dealer I worked for bought a Farmall H to push and drag dead ones into the shop, couldn't get anybody to use the choke, when it did start it was full throttle belching and backfiring. Years ago they had a little JD riding lawn mower for trimming around the building and had a young black kid running it. It wasn't long and it got shoved into my stall, wouldn't move, had a gear broken in two and a busted chain in transmission. I asked the kid if he ever used the clutch, his response was "clutch man, what the f??? you talking bout, nobody tol me nuthin bout no clutch". The kid did stop in to see me a few years ago after he got out of prison.
 
1946 Chevy 1/2 ton has three knobs on the dash. The choke knob, the throttle knob, and the heater knob for low and high speed fan. Was fun if you were on a fairley level road you could use the throttle knob as a cruise control.
 
Well My ability should be priceless. I know how to use a choke and adjust it as the engine warms up,drive a manual transmission including the 3 on a tree, 2 stick and even a 4/5spd with 2 spd rearend,all the way to the 18 spd in my Pete and not cause clutch problems, Also know about the arm strong steering. I can also start the cat engine with the little gas engine and we own 2 of them. Shucks I'm also over 50.
 
Gosh, anyone who can't run a choke around here is lost! All of the grain/dump trucks - the 35 Chevy truck has a choke, the 58 GMC truck has a choke, the 74 Ford truck has a choke, the three gas tractors have one, the old gator has one, and the Mitsubishi mini truck has one. Only the diesels and the good pickups don't have one. It's about 50/50 I think.
 
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