Overhearing engine

Question for the brain trust out there. My
combine (Claas 106) always has cooling
issues when the temperature gets up there,
85degrees plus. These combines have always
had cooling issues, I personally think they
need a bigger radiator.
Anyway, I was wondering about adding a
radiator from a car (have a Buick Century
parked in the bush) and adding it into the
system with the heater hoses. I know heater
hoses do not flow a massive amount of
coolant, but is it worth doing or am I
wasting my time?

It could help. I have had auto overheat before, turn heater on with fan blower on high, be surprised how it will lower temp. so, if no other faults are in play, your aux radiator with electric fan might help.

They make an additve Purple ice, super cool etc that make your cooling system run cooler. Also flush it out might help.

(quoted from post at 10:30:03 07/10/16) They make an additve Purple ice, super cool etc that make your cooling system run cooler. Also flush it out might help.

Click to expand...

I would try this before adding the second rad.

Sort of in the same vein...

Back in 1975-76 I built a snowblower that uses a 6 cyl Chevy engine to move it and an 8 cyl IH engine to run the snowblower, cooled with one radiator.

It cools perfectly for it's intended purpose, obviously in cold weather, but one time I ran it in a parade in a nearby town on a HOTTT day, and it started to overheat.

There's two heaters in the cab, and by switching them on, the temp came down and I continued without further issue.

But MY temp went UP 'cause there's no windows that open, just the door.

So, I'd say YES, you will get a noticeable amount of cooling by what you propose.

<img src = "http://www.gondtc.com/~blweltin/Bob/SnoBlo.JPG">

Heater hoses probably would not alow enough flow to be much help. Any way you could piggy-back second radiator and run coolant in series through the two radiators? Might mean some creative plumbing with tubes and universal radiator hoses. Might have to find an old NAPA store where they still stock a selection of hoses. Keeping radiator clean might be another issue. Can you put a new radiator with a bigger capacity in existing hole? Is existing radiator clean inside and out? Several flushes of cooling system may help. If you can inspect radiator internals with a borescope or even a dental mirror, you may decide whether a rodding out might be helpful. Are you satisfied that thermostat is operating properly? I'm fighting same issue on a MF 180, and have concluded that cooling system is inadequately designed.

When I was racing stock cars, I ran a big GM four core radiator in front and a second three core radiator against the main hoop of the roll cage to the right of the driver and connected to the cooling system via heater hoses. (With proper shrouding to protect the driver, obviously). Ram air was ducted to it from under the firewall on the right side.

Running a 180 degree thermostat, and on a 90 degree day or evening after a feature race when everyone else's engines were overheated we'd pull into the pits with the temp gauge on about 185. With that setup we simply never worried about, or had a problem, with overheating. I'm sure just carrying that much extra coolant was a factor. Plus I'm sure it extended engine life by not overheating.

I never advertised my system 'cause it worked to our advantage regularly.

Might be something that would work on a combine.

Didn't some of the exotic sports cars have a couple of radiators tucked away separately somewhere to enable a lowered more streamlined hood?

I once had a IH 345 V8 in a Scout that overheated a lot, turns out
The impeller was completely rusted away , a new water pump fixed
That problem

I believe it would help a lot.It has always been good advice to turn your heater on high if you overheat.Use an electric radiator fan and some shrouding,and the using heater hoses to it should help a lot.Make sure that you get all the air out of the system when you refill it.Mark

I see a lot of comments about the thermostats whether you should keep them or not but if it were mine I would check and make sure the belt that turns the fan blade was set properly and remove the thermostat first and see what happens.

I have NO idea how that cooling system is set up, but if it uses a thermostat that has an extra plate that closes off a bypass passage as it opens (as many ag and industrial engines do) removing it will DEFINITELY make things worse.

I've ended up having to have the radiators re cored in my 2-105 White and 4040 Deere because they were running too hot. Just had the White done a few weeks ago. When he showed me the old core,it was solid white from lime scale or something. You couldn't have stuck a pencil lead in the tubes that were still open at all. On the Deere,it was a black carbon stuck in them.
It made all the difference in the world on both of them.
I would have had to have had the one in my 1550 Oliver re cored too,but I bought a parts tractor and took the rad off that and put on it. Again,solved all its problems. I'm pretty sure I plugged that one myself with Aluma Seal for leaks that kept popping up in it.

Wouldn't hurt to put some reducers in and run a larger heater hose, like 1-1/4" to the auxiliary radiator. Even with the small heater hose ports, larger hoses will let you get more flow.

Putting a CPVC sweep Y in the hoses, and reducing it to an inch and a quarter then placing the new radiator at near the same height as the original will work fine. Putting a coolant fan switch in the hose assembly will allow an electric cooling fan to be attached to give it air flow. It will do what you want. Jim

You say these combines have a history of over heating. Are you saying other combines like yours have incurable over heating problems? If so, then you are probably right, there is a design problem.

Adding a radiator is an extreme measure, but if you have room it would be a viable solution. But I would exhaust every other attempt first!

Have you checked for proper circulation? With the engine up to temperature, you should be able to see fairly turbulent circulation looking into the cap opening. One thing that has been done with some success is to drill a small hole, 3/32" or so, the the thermostat. That allows the thermostat to remain in place, but not create a total restriction when closed. It is a rare occurrence, but sometimes water pump impellers rust away, or spin on the shaft, or get fouled by some foreign object. A visual inspection would verify the condition.

The air coming through the radiator should be uncomfortably hot. If it is only warm, the heat is not being removed. The upper tank should also be hot, and the lower tank considerably cooler. When feeling the front of the radiator core, the temperature should be even from side to side, progressively getting cooler as you go down. If there are cold spots, the core is partially clogged.

How is the air flow through the radiator? Is there a well fitting fan shroud? Is hot air being recycled from the engine compartment? Would a performance fan help move more air?

There is a chemical test for combustion gasses in the cooling system. This is a reliable way to determine if there is a head gasket problem of cracked head. Has the head ever been off? Could there be clogged water passages between the block and head? Some engines use a coolant distribution tube to ensure even cooling, (not sure of your application). It could be clogged or rusted away.

If a second radiator is added, it would need to be carefully and properly designed and protected so as to not be a source of additional problems. It would need to be seriesed in, as in all the coolant would first go through one radiator, then to the other. That would mean all hoses would need to be the same size. Then there is the issue of 2 radiator caps. If at all possible, the lower mounted radiator should not have a radiator cap. The opening could be plugged with a rubber expandable freeze plug. Radiator caps are not 100% sealed. They have a check valve that allows the pressure to equalize when the engine cools. When that check valve is not under pressure, it is open to the overflow tube, which would result in a leak.

Let us know what you find!

.....and that's the case with Olivers.

Removing the thermostat will help if there is a restricted flow. But if the thermostat removal causes too much circulation it can also cause overheating. We were racing dirt cars and fighting overheating problems on a limited modified. We also removed the thermostat. Different fans, fan speeds and shroud mods were no help. An old racer told us to insert a large washer to restrict the flow. He explained too much circulation did not give enough residence time for the water to be cooled by the radiator.This cured our problem.

Just to add about the checking the fan belt. Check to see if the groove(s) on the fan pulley are not to worn. If they become to worn the v belt will bottom out in the groove (bottom of the groove will be shiny) and belts will slip. If the fan is solid drive you should not be able to turn it by hand. If it does the belts are probably not holding well enough. I applaud you on the extra radiator idea, it's worth a shot. Probably will need to carry a leaf blower with you to blow the chaff out every couple of bin fills.

Is there a shroud around the fan? Does hot air re-circulate around and back into the rad ? If you can feel any wear on the pulleys, replace them and use a new belt. What is the ignition timing ?

K guess I should update some, diesel engine, 200 odd HP, stuffed into a hole just wide enough to get it in, engine is a v6 Mercedes, fan has a shroud, thermostats appear to work on, took them out last year and checked them with water from a kettle. Water pump seemed to have no play or issues. Did change the fan belts year before last which helped some. Had the rad out 2 years ago and to the local rad shop who had it their cleaner tanks.
Just wondering if there is any way to increase cooling, that would be relatively easy. It would be nice to not have issues this year.

Well, from the original post title, I would try some really big ear muffs :wink:

After you have tried everything. I would try a new core. Your cores were rectangular when new. After years of pressure they turn into ovals. Which makes the fins just contact them just a little. Not their full with, like when new. They are not soldered. Also what you want to do will work. We did it with just a 5 gallon tank. Hooked up with 3/4 heater hose. Went into the top and bottom rad hoses. Worked unbelievably well. I have a pulling tractor with two radiators in series.

And to add yet one more idea - are you sure the fan clutch is working right? If it is running hot the clutch should be locked in and sound like a freight train. Although I have run across poor cooling designs/capacities, it seems like you are seeing it heat at a moderate temp. What would it do if the temp was 100+ like it is here during wheat harvest? Are you overworking it for its capacity? I assume not but I had to ask. If you stop at the end of the field and let it run will it cool down? When I pull the 8430 hard in 100+ degree weather it runs warm. I think it's a poor design for the ponies it puts out. The cooling system is essentially the same as the 4440 but cranking out 90 more horses and pulling a 40 foot cultivator.

Might be lees work to just have the radiator recored with an extra row of tubes this would in essence do the second rad with out all the building over. That is what they do for the heavy haul trucks with 10-20 axles on the road.

Here is something else to think about O.J. If yours is hydrostatic drive you could also move the hydraulic cooler from in front of the radiator to a remote location with a fan on it. Also try using Lucas oil stabilizer in with your oil.I had overheating issues with my 642's also and adding a gallon of Lucas in the oil dropped the temp on average 15 to 20 degrees.