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Where do you store your ammo?

Geo-TH,In

Geo-TH,In

Well-known Member

Recently a house a few miles away burned. I saw the smoke. Realizing it couldn't be Indians sending up smoke signals because Indians only use white smoke in the movies, this was black smoke, I concluded it was a house fire in the direction of where a friend lives. He tells me the neighbor lady was burning leafs. Couple go to town, come home only to find the cops had the road blocked of and the fire department, which is only a mile away, was there too watching their place burn. The guy was a gunsmith, had a lot of ammo in the house and the fire department didn't want to get shot. Back side of the house is gone. House is a total loss. So where do you store all your ammo?
a227575.jpg
 
Where I live, my house would be a total loss before the fire department got here anyway. I believe there was an episode on "Mythbusters" about what happens to ammo in a fire. The chances of getting shot is slim to none. There is a small explosion but since it's not contained in the firing chamber the pressure goes in all directions, The danger is more from shrapnel from the casing than from the bullet.
As for where I keep ammo? As far as anyone other than close friends an family, I have no weapons or ammo.
 

The fire dept was not "going to get shot". This is another TV myth that has saturated our mindset that just doesn't happen in the real world. I'd be embarrassed if I was a fireman and actually believed that.
 
Bret, keep in mind this is second hand info. I really wasn't there. This is what my
friend told me who lived very close to fire. This place burned really fast. The fire
department at some point did put the fire out after the south side of house was reduced
to studs. Perhaps at that time all the ammo was gone, we will never really know, we
weren't there.
 
If the ammo was in a gun barrel then someone might get shot. Ammo in boxes is just going to pop like firecrackers. Without anyone there to say where the ammo was loose or loaded in a gun I would hate to make the assumption.
 
Give the country boys a BREAK. They don't get paid,
Not professionals. No lives at stake. Most of them knew he was a gunsmith. May have a large quantities of gun powder. Could be fireman wanted to cool off a propane tank first. None of us knows. From friend's view. They were in no hurry to rush in, would you? Not me.

Look how well the roof and metal siding on front of house held up. Might be a little Smokey smelly. Might make a good smoke house. Recycle it.
 

Smokless gunpowder doesn't explode either George. It burns progressively....real fast. Black powder explodes. Primers explode. They were in far more danger from the propane than loaded ammo or gunpowder. Country boy firemen are probably more likely to know this than big city guys that don't encounter many reloaders or gunsmiths.
 
The firemen are bird brains if the ammo angle is the whole story, wonder what they would have done if someone had of been inside. People that stupid and or ill trained should not be on the fire department.
 
You mention cooling off a propane tank which reminds me of something that happen some time ago. There was this run down hunting cabin across the road that mysteriously caught fire at 3 a.m. (I think the owner burned it for the insurance). Well I go over to watch the fire fighters put it out and this one guy is rolling a twenty pound propane tank around on the ground. The thing has a blue flame 2-3 feet long shooting out of a vent hole in the valve. Simply amazing! So I'm thinking this might be a little dangerous so I mention it to the guy and he says that as long as it's venting like it was it wouldn't explode. Apparently there's a plug that melts when it gets to hot. I've never heard of this before and I'm not sure if I believe him. Not making any assessment about his intelligence, just saying what I saw. JD
 
Our farm shop burnedin 1976. I reloaded there. Had one workbench devoted to equipment with gunpowder stored on a shelf underneath.

I went in the door 40' from the front. That part was all on fire. I was wanting to get my beagle dog out. He shot out the door. The loaded ammunition was popping, but that was all.

The real excitement was the cutting torch bottles. We used propane instead of acetylene. The propane bottle was one of the 100# styles. When it went, the top of the tank split, it sounded like a jet engine. I was trying to get into the shed side of the shop when it went. Then the oxygen tank went and the whole side of the shop turned white hot instantly. But I was pretty busy running then.

Gene

PS. local firefighter did get hit in the leg by a .22 that was loaded in the gun and laying under a bed. Minor wound, but it did happen.
 
For black powder to real do damage it would have to be contained in a very tight and heavy container.
 

Propane tanks have pressure release valves that open if there's to much pressure in the tank, usually from when a tank gets hot in or near a fire. Keeping the tank cooled or away from the fire helps prevent the liquid inside from boiling and increasing the pressure , the tank will vent and the escaping gas could be ignited from the fire.
If left in or to near the fire the boiling liquid will build pressure faster than the vent can release to a point that the tank will rupture becoming an instant and deadly fire bomb.
The firefighter rolling the tank away from the fire prevented the tank from overheating where it would simply vent the gas out burning it off or if it cooled enough the relief valve would close and the fire would go out.

We recently worked a shed fire where the owner stored around 50 old military fire arms along with 15 50 cal cans of ammo (some of it 50 cal BMG) that his wood stove set on fire. We flowed water from 25 ft away until the fire cracker show was over,then moved in and saved the main building the shed was attached to.
If they had said or it was suspected that black power was in the building we would have been flowing water at maximum flow reach which is around 100-125 ft waiting for the bomb to go off. If they had said there was a lot of black power we would have pulled everyone back to around 500 ft.

Regardless of what is seen on tv, no ones property is worth the life of one of my firefighters.

Yes I am the Fire Chief of our little local fire dept.
 
I had a class specifically on propane fires. As long as the fire is not impinging directly onto the tank it won't explode. They showed us railcars in accidents that for days shot flames from the vent before they were cooled and put out. Another scenario is an overfilled home supply tank that vents on a hot afternoon, vapor trail finds a spark or trash fire and then flashes back to the tank. Makes a nice fountain of flame. Strategy is to hose the tank and cool it until the internal pressure drops enough that the safety valve closes.
 
What ammo, ya like any body would believe that. But that said I have it all over since you never know when you might need some for something. As for it burning well I have yetto see any go boom from a fire and yes I have had some in a fire before when we threw out some trash and did not know it was there
 
sorry boys, black powder nor smokeless powder explodes !! black powder has a specific burn rate depending on how course it is, the finer it is the faster it burns but at a steady rate, it burns the same in the open as it does in the barrel. smokeless burns progresivly faster as pressure rises.
 
Guys everything I've posted was not reported in the news. A house fire in the country isn't newsworthy in TH unless there are bodies inside. The information I posted was given to me by a man, friend, living about 100 yards from fire. It was his take on what happened with the fireman, may be true or man not. The LP tank is my speculation. I find it entertaining how the observations and my speculation has spun out of control and it all the firemans house the house is a total loss. Could have been a total loss when they showed up. I wouldn't bet my life on if the man had LP heat, wood or electric. Only choices we have in country.

So here is more of my conversation with friend. I said, Boy that double trailer sure went up in smoke real fast. Friend, No, it's not a trailer. I said are you sure, it looks like a double wide. No it's stick built that looks like a double wide with metal on sides and roof. Speculation on my part. Back in the 60-70 farm houses were put together like trailers with wood paneling, some with aluminum siding. Trailer fires go real fast. This place did the same

Here are the facts you can count on, the fire was put out after the metal on the south side was gone. That is easy to see before they boarded up all the windows.

Speculation on my part. All fireman could do is spray water through windows. They didn't get on a hot tin roof to cut holes in it. If they had you would see the holes. Metal is good on north walls, missing on south wall were perhaps the leaf fire started everything. Appears to me it started in the garage area and swept through the house. Friend said there was a lot of shooting going on.
Good idea to keep your power dry and in a fireproof safe.

Geo.
 
Can't count on a fusible plug to get hot and blow before the tank ruptures, but he is right if it is venting the probability of a rupture is greatly diminished. But I wouldn't be rolling it around.
 
No, wrong end of the county. I have three locations, North, south and west. This place
is in the south end of the county. Exclusive neighbor hood is in the north end. Sorry to
confuse you.
 
(quoted from post at 12:45:57 05/24/16) sorry boys, black powder nor smokeless powder explodes !! black powder has a specific burn rate depending on how course it is, the finer it is the faster it burns but at a steady rate, it burns the same in the open as it does in the barrel. smokeless burns progresivly faster as pressure rises.
Click to expand...

Black is an explosive, smokeless isn't according to the tables. That's all I was saying. In either case you'd have to enclose the powder in a case capable of holding the pressure to the point that something resembling an explosion occurred. In open air or otherwise non-pressure vessel type situation both burn without theatrics.
 
(quoted from post at 12:54:43 05/24/16) Guys everything I've posted was not reported in the news. A house fire in the country isn't newsworthy in TH unless there are bodies inside. The information I posted was given to me by a man, friend, living about 100 yards from fire. It was his take on what happened with the fireman, may be true or man not. The LP tank is my speculation. I find it entertaining how the observations and my speculation has spun out of control and it all the firemans house the house is a total loss. Could have been a total loss when they showed up. I wouldn't bet my life on if the man had LP heat, wood or electric. Only choices we have in country.

So here is more of my conversation with friend. I said, Boy that double trailer sure went up in smoke real fast. Friend, No, it's not a trailer. I said are you sure, it looks like a double wide. No it's stick built that looks like a double wide with metal on sides and roof. Speculation on my part. Back in the 60-70 farm houses were put together like trailers with wood paneling, some with aluminum siding. Trailer fires go real fast. This place did the same

Here are the facts you can count on, the fire was put out after the metal on the south side was gone. That is easy to see before they boarded up all the windows.

Speculation on my part. All fireman could do is spray water through windows. They didn't get on a hot tin roof to cut holes in it. If they had you would see the holes. Metal is good on north walls, missing on south wall were perhaps the leaf fire started everything. Appears to me it started in the garage area and swept through the house. Friend said there was a lot of shooting going on.
Good idea to keep your power dry and in a fireproof safe.

Geo.
Click to expand...

Then whats your point George? You present something as fact and then back peddle. The metal isn't the problem any more than aluminum siding, stucco, concrete, slate, copper, or tile is. The ammo isn't going to "shoot" anyone. I don't get you sometimes.

More coffee, I need more coffee......
 
Friend stands on his comment. Fireman
waited . Is that a fact that could be used
in court. Hear say. No

Keep your amo in fireproof safe is my point.
Can't I show a metal house without everyone
beating metal to death. If everyone will
stop beating the metal horse, so will I.
 
(quoted from post at 04:17:22 05/24/16)
Recently a house a few miles away burned. I saw the smoke. Realizing it couldn't be Indians sending up smoke signals because Indians only use white smoke in the movies, this was black smoke, I concluded it was a house fire in the direction of where a friend lives. He tells me the neighbor lady was burning leafs. Couple go to town, come home only to find the cops had the road blocked of and the fire department, which is only a mile away, was there too watching their place burn. The guy was a gunsmith, had a lot of ammo in the house and the fire department didn't want to get shot. Back side of the house is gone. House is a total loss. So where do you store all your ammo?
a227575.jpg
Click to expand...

Surplus ammo cans, away from the house except for a box or 2 for the 'house' guns. 8)
 
(quoted from post at 13:13:55 05/25/16) Friend stands on his comment. Fireman
waited . Is that a fact that could be used
in court. Hear say. No

Keep your amo in fireproof safe is my point.
Can't I show a metal house without everyone
beating metal to death. If everyone will
stop beating the metal horse, so will I.
Click to expand...

I don't think you can imagine the size of safe I'd need. :lol:

Ammo is no more of a concern than a whole bunch of other common items in peoples houses. A can of hair spray jetting out of a fire and smacking into something can break out the windshield of you truck. Thats first hand experience. It's gonna hurt on skin and bone too. But no one gets panicky over hair spray or barbeque tanks or cans of gas or much of anything else, yet mention ammo and you'd think it was certain death.
 
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