Liability and accident question #1

Here is what happened. I took some large tires to a tire shop. I only deal with this outfit occasionally it used to be real good (but not impressed by current conditions). They unloaded them buy hand (not to my liking) One young fellow slipped and came off my truck did a body slam face first into the parking lot. He seemed to be ok but needed an 8 count!!!! The division/bay manager was right there helping but that to me was an osha/safty nightmare when a forklift or hoist was available. Observing the place safety seemed to be in the back seat!!! My questions are could I been liable for the kid that fell??? The truck has insurance and my business does too. What comments do you have and should upper level management know about this??? This outfit is not a small mom and pop shop but big several location company. Thanks for you input, oh I have other liability posts that is why this is #1.

You could get a better answer from your insurance agent, but it looks like you were on the store's property and the kid was an employee of the store, doing work assigned to him by his boss at the store. I think you were merely a customer - but if you are worried about it you could call your insurance agent (for free) or a lawyer (for $$).

You are correct on the kid and the store.

The legal system has a mind of its own, people will sue anyone they want to, and judges/juries will make up their own minds.

it will have to shake out within the interested parties.

Anyone can be accused for anything in our legal system.

Most likely the employee on the business property would not be involving you.

But can't say never I guess.

Near here a tire shop manager told a truck driver (employee of truck owner) to back the truck out of the bay. For some reason an employee was still under the truck. Killed him.

I think that legal case is just starting. So you got the shop manager, the shop worker, and the truck driver as individuals.

You got the shop and the company that owns the truck as businesses. All involved.

Paul

IF you have any assets I think you could be involved in any law suit. The "victim's" lawyers usually shot for anyone with anything to try to get. Now the odds of your having to pay would be less but in today's Lottery style jury trials I would not bet my farm/house on being not sued. I would point blank asked my insurance agent and have put a note in your file stating if your covered or not.

I do not trust the legal system these days in any type of injury liability case. The courts are allowing many pay outs that just defy common sense.

I think if anything it would be a workman's comp. claim.Similar thing happened at my work and that's how it was handled.

I would call your insurance company and report what happened.

Rick

As long as you didn't jump on the back of his neck with both feet,you're probably OK.

I think it depends on if you did something negligent. For example was the slip was caused by oil on your truck bed floor? Was the tire somehow not secured correctly which caused him to loose balance? Did he trip over something in your truck bed? Not saying any of these are what happened but just examples of possible negligence by you.

Did you ask him to get in the back of the pickup? My view (and I'm in the back seat on this one) is that if he did it of his own choosing and the boss did not stop him, it is a workman's comp thing. He was not under your employment at the time and you did not ask him to do it. That boss should be looking for a new job for not stopping the kid. I have a couple of young brothers that work for me and I have to stop them from pulling stupid stunts all of the time. They are very good kids but don't think about things like jumping off the hay wagon on frozen ankle twisting uneven ground. They are just eager. It's nice to see, but you have to stay a step ahead of the older one.

Write a memo for the record while it's still fresh on your mind and send a copy to your insurance man. It might take years before they decide to sue. A dated piece of paper is stronger evidence than your memory years from now if you end up on a witness stand.

write the upper level management and state the facts as you did here about the forklift being available and such! certified letter---at least you will have something if a law suit comes thru that you were concerned about there actions.

No I did not tell him to get in back of truck boss did (I was shocked not using equipment) I went there "expecting professional service" not something out of the funny pages. You are right on looking out for safety as I try to do and stop some of these stupid acts!!!! I too have seen a lot of stuff that was lucky someone was not killed in!!!

I agree on the legal system and jury if someone is hurt.

i would say it has nothing to do with you, as you are the customer. the manager should be having safty meetings with the workers. you did not tell him to unload tires. manager should have instucted him to do that, and not using proper equipment for the job at hand would come back on manager. there should have been crane hoists for heavy eqipment or forklifts. them failing to use these is not your problem.also lots of times when safety is not followed the person gets written up, as a near miss. i am not a lawyer just stating a few things. best is to get advise from somebody in that profession. we fix tractors not broken hearts. if it was you that fell off your truck can you sue them? i dont know. law is a complicated thing.

Yes, the lawyers will check around and go after whoever has the money (insurance) and zero in on them rather they are liable or not. After all, what has the voice of reason to do with anything these days?

That's a question best answered by an attorney, and possibly your insurance company, although I wouldn't mention it to my insurance company unless or until it comes up. Don't mention it around the kid or tire shop. Don't give them and ideas by making suggestions. I wouldn't mention a word to anyone about it unless or until it comes up, unless or until you are contacted by a lawyer representing the kid. Let it go, because unless or until something comes up, there's nothing that you can do except worry and give yourself ulcers.

Common sense would be that the accident happened where the kid works, so that's where any potential litigation SHOULD take place and end. However, what often happens is if litigation takes place, everyone is named in hopes of finding deep pockets. And when I say everyone, I mean including the guys that stock the pop and coffee machines, deliver the office products, and even painted the stripes in the parking lot. Lawyers go for as many deep pockets as they can name, including the company that made the ink pens used in the office...because the pens were there.

In reality though, you won't know a thing unless or until someone contacts you, and that's not likely to happen. Document everything though, now while its fresh in your mind, in case it does happen.

Good luck.

Mark

My 2 cents as follows. Be careful who you mention this to. Document for yourself and save. I would tend to think your vehicle is no different than one brought in for work where the owner is absent. Your making a fuss might make it worse than right now where everybody involved may assume any liability stops with the shop. You don't hear about employees suing vehicle owners who leave vehicles at a shop and they slip because rainwater was dripping off the vehicle making somebody slip. Like you said you did not direct that employee to handle the tire the way he did. Stressful but keeping a cool head is the best thing you can do at the moment.

As usual legal or electrical questions get the most responses. Here's the deal as far as your potential liability is concerned:

Did the dude who was injured work for you?? Did you instruct him to unload the tires off your truck and tell him how to do it????? Did your truck bed have some sort of a hazard you were aware of like it was oil soaked and slick or had a hole in the floor but you failed to inform the person of?????

In order to be liable you would have to expose the injured party (under your direction) to a reasonably forseeable risk of injury.

I nor anyone here are the "fact finders" but in order for you to be liable a judge in a bench trial or a jury would have to find you first owed a duty of care to the injured person,,,,,,,,,,,,what was the duty,,,,,,,,,,,you breached that and such was the proximate cause of the injuries.

Unless you were aware of a hazard in your truck bed (like a hole in floor or it was oil covered) and failed to warn him and he didn't work for you and he wasn't working under your direction I don't see much chance of your being liable for his injuries.

NOTE Insurance companies ARE NOT THE JUDGE about this, its a well settled area of the law which ONLY a court can decide if litigated. That's NOT to say a plaintiffs attorney may not sue everyone in sight looking for a deep pocket and there are nuisance values to any suit. Just because you can be sued DOES NOT mean you are guilty. Again to be liable you must have owed a duty of care and breached it and you must have exposed the plaintiff to a reasonably forseeable risk of injury, so absent a known to you hazard you failed to warn of and you weren't instructing the manner of unloading, I don't see you as liable. The company has control over its facility and manner of safe unloading and its employees NOT YOU. I don't see you owed a duty (other then warning of unsafe condition) nor did you breach it so I dont se you as liable.

DISCLAIMER absent a thorough research of your states laws by a competent professional and then having a judge or jury find the facts and then apply them to the local law ANYTHING SAID HERE BY ME OR ANYONE IS WORTHLESS so consult a trained local professional and dont hang your hat on any opinions (lay or professional) posted here, mine included lol

John T Attorney at Law

Thank you John for replying. My take was the company is responsible for there help and I was there as a customer nothing more. The help was under direction of the shop foreman (though I was not impressed by his actions). I have seen several of these issues 1. buying heavy item at store and employee gets hurt lifting it off shelf. 2. employee falls down stairs getting item for customer each time it goes back on the company not the customer. The only quirk is it was my truck but they take in trucks to do tires too. I can see SOME issues if they came to your place to do the work BUT THEY ARE STILL EMPLOYEE OF THE COMPANY NOT YOU OR ME. DID CONCERN ME THOUGH, AND I WAS THE ONE THAT ATENDED TO THE YOUNG MAN. Again shop foreman was not to concerned about him!!!!

IF the kid works for company and if its a large outfit they should have workmens comp on their employees to cover the fall.

Short answer: If the injuries or damages are big enough, the injured party's lawyers will go after anyone remotely associated with the accident who might have some money.

Assuming the worker is actually an employee of the tire shop, their workmen's comp insurance should cover the worker's injuries. But when someone is maimed or killed, the injured party (or dependents) is likely to go after the employer and others for negligence. Obviously first stop is the employer, but in the case you describe a jury could be convinced of negligence by you or your employer because your trailer was unsafe to walk on.

One should not assume that just because the company is big that its employees are covered by workmen's comp. Texas and Oklahoma allow employers to opt out of state-regulated workers compensation plans. <a href="http://www.npr.org/2015/10/14/448544926/texas-oklahoma-permit-companies-to-dump-worker-compensation-plans">http://www.npr.org/2015/10/14/448544926/texas-oklahoma-permit-companies-to-dump-worker-compensation-plans</a>

One should also not assume that just because you didn't do anything negligent that you're safe from a judgement. A few years ago a car caused a fuel tanker to crash and destroy a freeway overpass. The state went after not only the driver of the car and the owner of the fuel tanker, but they also went after the owner of a truck that just happened to be in the vicinity of the accident. Note that not only did the driver of the third vehicle not do anything wrong, he was credited with avoiding a more serious accident!

While reading thru all the replies it occurred to me how VERY sad it is that this country is so goofed up you even had to ask such a question. I also understand why you are concerned. The way things are happening nowadays it's not safe to leave home without a lawyer !

Usually auto insurance includes coverage for loading and unloading so you'll likely have coverage if you get sued. In most states the kid would be required to use the Workers' Comp insurance as the sole remedy. Some states allow the worker to sue also or instead of using the WC. You might let your agent know what happened but don't report it officially as they might set up a claim on it, that could come back to bite you as underwriting reviews your policy sometime in the future. If you get hit with a suit, THEN report it.