O.T.-Trust Accounts

Anybody have experience with trust accounts set up by a qualified lawyer? One lawyer tells me there not worth
the paper there written on.

there wurth al thee papyr theyr writen on
k

Seem almost any sleezy lawyer can break a trust. Neighbor set up his land in a trust for wife and kids; trust said that they could not sell the land. Sleezy lawyer pointed out to them that the trust did not prohibit them from mortgaging the land, so they borrowed as much money as they could, spent the money, defaulted on the mortgage and moved away. They had a high old time until the money was all gone though.

I think there is something wrong with your keyboard.

I'm an Attorney in Indiana and its my professional legal opinion a well drafted trust can be a good, legal, binding and efficient estate planning tool. Of course some lay persons may have a different opinion and to each their own.

John T BSEE, JD Attorney at Law & Electrical Engineer

In the State of Louisiana a supposedly ''irrevocable'' trust can be easily broken, Louisiana private or civil law retains a strong basis in the Napoleonic code and Judges have much more leeway to rule as they wish regardless of established precedent. Then the government has its say, most trusts include as a primary aim some measures to ensure tax minimization or avoidance, all branches of government want that money and they have plenty of lawyers of their own who will role in the mud and manure to get it. There are many ways to protect your assetts and see your assetts transferred with minimal tax to your chosen heirs before you die, this way the government gets nothing and their is nothing to be gained by chiselers squabbling about their ''share''. All a person really needs to know about lawyers is the fact that fully half of the members of the US congress hold law degrees.

Spend enough or scheme enough and there are ways around most things, legal or not there are ways....

But in general a properly written irrevocable trust works.

Now, you mostly are signing your assets over to the other person, irrevocable, so if that person turns out to be a turd, you may not get the results you wanted - but the trust itself worked out right?

Paul

There are revocable and irrevocable trusts. Each have their place. Irrevocable is for the bux you want to leave to someone/entity, with no control over them or any changes in the future. Revocable is typically used to pass your estate to family while maintaining control/income over it while you are alive. It allows you to change things as you desire. So your question is moot without further details. With today"s land values, if you have a couple hundred acres, you likely have an estate problem, depending on your State laws. Trusts allow you to bypass many issues.

JohnT, Friend's lawyer is looking into how a daugher with Finical POA that she got from her dad long before he set up a trust, changed her dad's trust by putting her brother's name as co-owner on all his accounts and investments while dad was in poor health just before he died of cancer.

With a Revocable Trust, one can put any finiancial accounts, personal property(not vehicles), or real property in the Trust. You, as the Trust Owner and Beneficiary, retain full control over the Trust. Since the Trust owns everything, you own nothing. The Trust is responsible for any and all taxes except income taxes, if you are still working, under the Trust Owners SSN. You cannot lose your home or monies if you have an automobile, or any other type accident, and are sued. If the Trust owns the automobile that is another story. The Trust lays out what happens to the property and any monies owned by it. A Successor Trustee should be named to carry out the terms of the Trust, along with any Beneficiaries. A Revocable Trust becomes an Irrevocable Trust when the Owner dies and must apply for a EIN(Employer Identification Number), since the SSN is no longer valid. The beauty of a Trust, along with a good Will, is that there will be no reason to go to Probate Court to settle the deceased's Estate. As long as there are Named Beneficiaries, there are no death taxes if the Estate is less than 5 million dollars. A good Trust and Will is called proper Estate Planning. If one has any valuable assets, it is a must.

YMMV

Noah W

I think a good PS to what I posted below is in order FYI. Many non lawyers drink the kool aid and go to Holiday Inn free lunches to learn how a Trust can be used to avoid probate, and indeed if done properly by a competent trained professional (NOT Billy Bob or Bubba or your brother in law or what you read here) such is so (after you pay maybe $3500). HOWEVER in my estate planning and probate practice there are times when I recommend a trust and times when I do not IT DEPENDS ON THE CLIENTS PROPERTY AND HIS DESIRES AND FAMILY SITUATION. Also, its possible (and I often do it) to avoid probate using methods other then a trust. And there may be times when I recommend a combination which has parts of both. NOT ALL TRUSTS ARE THE SAME, NOT ALL ESTATE PLANS ARE THE SAME, what's good for Billy Bob may be the exact opposite for Bubba.

THE BOTTOM LINE is a trust is NOT for everyone but is best for others PERIOD. Its IMPOSSIBLE to determine whats the best estate planning tool until you interview the client and find all the facts assuming your a competent trained professional who understands the laws of your state. Billy Bob may post on here how by golly he has a trust and that's the best and only way to go, while Bubba may have a Will or may have nothing and by golly that's the only way to go.

THE QUESTION YOU HAVE TO ASK is do you want what was best for Billy Bob or Bubba OR DO YOU WANT WHATS BEST FOR YOU????

CHOICES Consult a local trained competent professional estate lawyer,,,,,,,,,, or go to a free Holiday Inn lunch and seminar on "How to Avoid Probate",,,,,,,,,,,, or ask Billy Bob or Bubba,,,,,,,,,,, or do what your know it all brother in law tells you. Its your property your money and your call none of ours.

Best wishes yall

John T Attorney at Law

John, I agree completely. Now the thing is how do you find that qualified lawyer? After you found what you think is what you need and later find out he missed a lot. My lawyer that is working on settleing my wifes estate, 51 days since she passed, I think could be smarter but how do you find the best one? The one I have now took over from a previous one after working there for a while as also did the previous one. And the office has family records dating into the 50's, at least I think they are required to keep them. This is Ohio.

So lawyers are the only people on the planet capable of reading and understanding tax law? I know that is what lawyers want people to believe, that is why they couch everything in made up legalese that is largely meaningless. There won't be any lawyers getting a nickel of my life's work, we have been transferring land for years using the gifting limit rules in the tax code, the same with machinery and livestock. Every bit of it legally recorded in the courthouse and when I am done 320 acres will change hands without a penny owed to the government, if I croak today my Wife will carry on with the program. Beside that, the limits that have been in effect for the last several years regarding inheritance tax thresholds mean very few people would leave a taxable estate anyway. If inheritance tax laws change for the worse in the coming years then I will transfer money and draw down cash and lock it up, once I am dead no one can prove whether I went to Vegas and threw it on the dice table or not. The reason lawyers are required in many estates is because of greedy grifters, if I thought any of my children would act in such a manner and disgrace their family name I would take an axe handle to them myself.

No problem with that, its your money, your risk, your choice to do as you like. You can do it yourself and you certainly have that right and I applaud it, were much alike, I prefer to do my own work if competent and qualified, otherwise I consult a trained professional. You know the old saying, any person can be their own attorney (or doctor or mechanic or plumber or other professional), and he who is has a fool for a client lol. Just like other professions, engineers, plumbers, mechanics, doctors, surgeons, nurses, lawyers etc there are trained competent professionals and there are some not quite so professional grrrrrrrrrr. If theres not much property or money at risk the less need for competent trained professional advice, but if theres a ton of money, the more I would use a trained professional myself.

Best wishes and God Bless, I'm also a do it yourselfer any time I'm qualified, so cant disagree about using self help. More power to those who choose to do things for themselves, they have that right regardless if its done correct or not, that's their risk not mine!!! They can even do what someone says on a Tractor Forum if they like!!!

John T BSEE, JD Attorney at Law and Electrical Engineer

Yes finding a trained competent professional is critical. Consult the local bar association and ask around best you can. Its a persons free choice to do things themselves or use a professional, but when there's so much money at stake you need to do your homework first.

Best wishes and God Bless

John T

For sure George consulting an attorney is a good thing to do. However it sure sounds "fishy" to me lol

John T

Us three kids set up a Irrevocable trust when Dad just started having problem with his health. His Lawyer did a great job. Most of his Money was split three ways before the trust. Kept enough in a trust account to run the farm. All the equipment was given to me before the trust since I was going to do the farming. Everything worked out great. You do need to think about capital gain. Great uncle sold the farm to Granddad for $1, and Granddad sold it to Dad for $1. I sold it for $$$$$. lawyer worked it out, but you can do some good paper work. THINK AHEAD.

He's telling you that because he can't make any more money off of you after the trust is complete !! ask me how I know ?? Jim in N.M.

Friend is thinking her lawyer may not know what he's doing. Again where would a person find a good lawyer if you've never had a need for one? Angie's list?

Some times it is alright to not have any property to worry about. I do know one thing from experience though. Don't leave undivided property to your heirs. Makes for a real mess and hard feelings when some want to just leave it lay and others want to have it finalized.

Oh, I don't know. I have a cousin whose grandfather on the other side of her family left her several hundred tillable acres through a "living trust" that she, her husband, and children farm. They have now for the last 20 or 30 years and still are. I'm not sure how it works, but gets passed down, passed down, passed down to be managed I guess, and since no one inherits it per say, there's no inheritance taxes to be paid. Seems to be working ok for them. I plan on attempting the same thing. I want my family to get it all, not the government, and no inheritance taxes on land that I paid the taxes on through a mortgage. Annual property taxes are one thing, inheritance tax is a crime.

Mark

The wife and I went to a lawyer twenty years ago and drew up a trust. This lawyer was recommended by our church's district office. Ten years later get a letter in the mail saying that this lawyer is going to the pen for taking money from widow ladies. Hope I still got the letter saying who our new lawyer is.

I don't think the bar association would do you much good with that. They would only give you a list of people licenced to do that but not have a quality rating on their work. Would only open themselves up for a lawsuit from a bad one saying discrimination.