An example of getting in too deep.

This is a youtube series of a guy who kinda got in too deep restoring a IH 350U, I'm quite positive his a member here.
I'm just totally amazed at how optimistic and persistent he remains as the rabbit hole gets deeper into dispair.

Have you ever faced such a situation before where a project like this has sucked your soul and your wallet dry?
IH 350U Restoration Youtube.

Yep,there's a reason these things go for scrap,and I'm usually the guy at the end of the line that realizes it's time to end it for those money pits before they can plague anybody else.

I think we all have been in that boat once. Where we could have replaced the item and been further ahead.

My buddy is attached to his fathers old JD 420 and decided to strip and rebuild not knowing that most parts are exclusive to JD . Well after the project he had about 4500 into it , and brand new it was around 3500 --hope tha next generation appreciates it since it like brand new again .

Larry -- ont.

With the new requirements on tractors for emissions and the fact it's so darn hard to fix or adjust much on them I've wondered if we won't see a resurgence of folks totally rebuilding older equipment. Yes this guy will end up with more in this tractor than he could buy a good one for (if a 300 utility ever was a good tractor). But I bet he's going to be in it for less than a new one and he can fix it himself!

You repair them because you want to keep them, not because it makes economical sense. I took every bolt out of my H. Replaced all bearings with new in transmission and final drive. Couple of new aftermarket gears and several good used gears. New sleeves, pistons, valves , guides, springs, etc. etc. in engine. Took every linkage apart on throttle, clutch, pto etc. and rebuilt all worn holes , bushings etc. Rebuilt the draw bar by welding in all worn holes and areas. New rear tires and rims. Over 6K in parts and painting. Should I have done it, I don't really know but I remembered the day Dad brought it home spanking new in 1952. It has sat out side , unmoved for 15 years or more and it just hurt to see it sit like that. Probably worth about lK now but hope I don't have to find that out. Tore the end out of the old grainery and made door to get tractor in and it sits high and dry now.

I'm more into the construction side of equipment than the agricultural side, but I see the same thing over here too, and encourage it. On this side of the fence, often it actually does make sense to refurbish/restore an older machine rather than to buy a new one.

I've got one customer that we completely redid a D9G CAT dozer for a few years back, in fact I've posted a couple of pictures of the project on here over the years. In his case, with a new machine approaching a million dollars, he wound up with a practically new, but older model, machine, that could do the same amount of work, for less than half the price. Not to mention when something breaks it's simple often simple enough to be repaired with basic hand tools, and when it's not, he can call me and pay far less than he would have to pay a dealership to put send out on of their "technicians/parts changers" with a computer. Even better, there are plenty of NOS and quality aftermarket parts available for the older machines that will keep them running for a lot less than the parts for the new machines.

In the end, the cost to restore anything will always be an issue to some. However, the simple fact is these older machines will still be operational, and repairable, years from now, while the electronics in the newest stuff either isn't repairable because the electronics were obsoleted a year or two after it came out, or the cost to repair is so HIGH due to the electronics that are available, that they get parked.

Like I said, that's what I see on the construction side of the fence, and based on what of the ag side I do see, I imagine it's either already to that point, or getting close, at least for the small time guys.

I like the definition of the term technician ie. (parts changer) that's what and old mechanic I learned a lot from would call some of the ones that claimed to be mechanics when he had to lick their calf over for them.

I complain about the cost, and the wife sez that it's money the nursing home won't get.

My Farmall M chore tractor was someone's "restore" job years back. They did a good job rebuilding the engine. The paint faded badly and thinned easy. I kind of feel bad when I stop to think about it, but it gets used every day for what it was made for. It hauls bales and feeds cattle in the soupy muck, it lifts things so I don't have to jack, today it ground two tons of hog feed, and next week it will do the same. I'm sure whoever restored it would be crushed at the way it is used, but I use it and it isn't sitting and rotting. The way I use it, it will be another 20 years before I need to touch the engine or anything else. That's one less tractor I have to buy that needs a computer nerd to diagnose it.

Pete If it was Worth it to YOU then its a Done Deal Larry

(quoted from post at 13:50:53 03/21/15) My buddy is attached to his fathers old JD 420 and decided to strip and rebuild not knowing that most parts are exclusive to JD . Well after the project he had about 4500 into it , and brand new it was around 3500 --hope tha next generation appreciates it since it like brand new again .

Larry -- ont.

Click to expand...

If it was a brand new JD 420 that cost $3500.00 in '57 it would cost $29,776.88 in 2015. $4500.00 looks pretty cheap to me.

Every major repair you ever make on any tractor of any age comes under that category.

But, it doesn't matter what it costs to fix. What matters is what it costs to replace it.

Hi I subscribe to his channel , If you think thats to deep, I guess you haven't followed his Oliver backhoe series . He bought that after this tractor . I told him why old backhoes/tractors are cheap at the start. I think since that comment he has learned why.
Fair play to Steve though he has got some interesting machine shop tools to he's working on.
I can most defiantly say he's not an easy quitter with these projects. He just has a few I wouldn't of even started or owned unless scrap was a good price that day.
Regards Robert

I am in the process of rebuilding a Cockshutt 1855 i bought last year. PO said all it needs is a engine overhaul.
Yeah right!.:roll:

I have so far 3 grand in the engine and 1 grand in the over/under + a new clutch..parts only!
The rad and the fuel tank both have a leak and need fixing too(relatively minor).The wiring is a complete mess and needs redoing as well and there are numerous other little things to attend to
I have no clue yet if the brakes are still good and if the main tranny and PTO has issues as the tractor needs to run to find that out and i ain't at that point yet.
And then it needs new tires all around.
By the time it is running and ready for work that tractor's gonna run over 10 grand in parts and labor and still be worth only 5 grand at best.

Needless to say i should've left the thing where it was.:roll:

But Bison, what would a new tractor of equal HP cost you?

Hi
It's not always about what a new tractor
costs, it's the fact that this one will have
cockshutt still written on the hood that awful
cab, it's older than me and it's still worth
$5000 after he has 10 plus his time in it.
I came up with this problem with our 96
Belarus. it needed big bucks spending to keep
using it as a main tractor, is worth $7000 tops
on a good day fixed, and is not the tractor I
need for loader work now for my barn cleaning
and baling work due to it's weight build and
lack of air con and a few other nice things.

We spent $37000 on a 2000 valtra and the
difference is night and day. I know which one i
want to spend 14 or more hours a day in during
the summer. You couldn't pay me enough to run
that pile for 14 hours plus a day, it's now our
spare tractor.
Regards Robert

(quoted from post at 13:51:52 03/22/15) Hi
[b:938e2054c7]It's not always about what a new tractor
costs, it's the fact that this one will have
cockshutt still written on the hood that awful
cab, it's older than me and it's still worth
$5000 after he has 10 plus his time in it.[/b:938e2054c7]
I came up with this problem with our 96
Belarus. it needed big bucks spending to keep
using it as a main tractor, is worth $7000 tops
on a good day fixed, and is not the tractor I
need for loader work now for my barn cleaning
and baling work due to it's weight build and
lack of air con and a few other nice things.

We spent $37000 on a 2000 valtra and the
difference is night and day. I know which one i
want to spend 14 or more hours a day in during
the summer. You couldn't pay me enough to run
that pile for 14 hours plus a day, it's now our
spare tractor.
Regards Robert

Click to expand...

nd that is the problem,..its not so much the spending some money on a an old tractor but i like to get at least my input back out of it come sale time.I put maybe a 100 hrs a year on my two other 1855's as all i do is putting up a 1000 rounds of hay with them and this tractor was gonna be used for pulling the bale self loader and pitch in for one of the other 2 in case one has a break down during hay season.

[b:938e2054c7]But Bison, what would a new tractor of equal HP cost you[/b:938e2054c7]?

I have no clue what a new 100 hp tractor cost,..i never bought one and i ain't about to either.
I never paid more than 5 grand for a good running tractor yet.
I have 2 other 1855's, i paid for one $3250, the other 3500.
I have an 1800 i got for $400 and spend another 350(injection pump) to get it running.
And i have two belarusses, one was 5 grand the other 4.
So you can see that the one i am working on is becoming rather pain fully expensive to a cheap SOB like me

(quoted from post at 19:37:24 03/22/15) build

[b:edc2115921]But Bison, what would a new tractor of equal HP cost you[/b:edc2115921]?

I have no clue what a new 100 hp tractor cost,..i never bought one and i ain't about to either.
I never paid more than 5 grand for a good running tractor yet.
I have 2 other 1855's, i paid for one $3250, the other 3500.
I have an 1800 i got for $400 and spend another 350(injection pump) to get it running.
And i have two belarusses, one was 5 grand the other 4.
So you can see that the one i am working on is becoming rather pain fully expensive to a cheap SOB like me

Click to expand...

Okay, I thought we we're talking replacing with a new one. I get ya.

(quoted from post at 17:51:52 03/22/15) Hi
It's not always about what a new tractor
costs, it's the fact that this one will have
cockshutt still written on the hood that awful
cab, it's older than me and it's still worth
$5000 after he has 10 plus his time in it.
I came up with this problem with our 96
Belarus. it needed big bucks spending to keep
using it as a main tractor, is worth $7000 tops
on a good day fixed, and is not the tractor I
need for loader work now for my barn cleaning
and baling work due to it's weight build and
lack of air con and a few other nice things.

We spent $37000 on a 2000 valtra and the
difference is night and day. I know which one i
want to spend 14 or more hours a day in during
the summer. You couldn't pay me enough to run
that pile for 14 hours plus a day, it's now our
spare tractor.
Regards Robert

Click to expand...

I haven't got $37K in every piece of farm, shop or mechanical equipment on the place. Thats half the cost of my farm. 2 different worlds.

(quoted from post at 13:51:52 03/22/15) Hi
It's not always about what a new tractor
costs, it's the fact that this one will have
cockshutt still written on the hood that awful
cab, it's older than me and it's still worth
$5000 after he has 10 plus his time in it.
I came up with this problem with our 96
Belarus. it needed big bucks spending to keep
using it as a main tractor, is worth $7000 tops
on a good day fixed, and is not the tractor I
need for loader work now for my barn cleaning
and baling work due to it's weight build and
lack of air con and a few other nice things.

We spent $37000 on a 2000 valtra and the
difference is night and day. I know which one i
want to spend 14 or more hours a day in during
the summer. You couldn't pay me enough to run
that pile for 14 hours plus a day, it's now our
spare tractor.
Regards Robert

Click to expand...

Just curious what are we talking in terms of "big bucks" as those things are pretty cheap on parts unless you're factoring in paying some dealer 120/hr to fix it. Then yeah its probably not worth it especially if you're wanting an upgrade anyway. As for a Valtra vs an old Belarus well yeah 2 different worlds valtra is a premium tractor Belarus is a budget tractor!! I have one of each too and both have their place. Belaurs gets the crappy jobs like staring up when its -40 out. I wonder though if AGCO is going to keep up with parts for the Valtra's as now my local AGCO dealer won't get me parts their telling me. I have to go to a farther away dealer. I'd buy another Valtra if I could find a nice 100hp 2000-2001 (no electronics on the engine) one used but they are hard to come by and typically have lots of hrs. on them. Belarus parts on the other hand are no problem, pretty basic machines.

I would not beat them up to bad unless you are better at fix'N tractor computer issues with a computer than they are...

In my world I had to learn it are find another trade... I survived give me good scan data and the ability to have bidirectional controls I will take it over fudgen with some 50 year old piece of garbage any day if for only one reason "The Pay Is Better"....

If you run from it I hope there is enough old stuff out there you can pick the bones on to hold you over till you retire...