I was talking to a roofer about redoing my garage roof. It currently has shingles and I thought metal sheeting would be quicker and in the long run better. He wants to pull the shingles because he says that if he covers the shingles with the metal sheeting it could catch fire. I would welcome your opinions.
- Thread starter dej(Jed)
- Start date
Russ from MN
Well-known Member
- Location
- Bemidji MN
Get the old shingles off, put down new felt and put the steel directly on the felt. If you have a hail storm you are less apt to have denting. Some building codes require this procedure.
MarkB_MI
Well-known Member
- Location
- Motown USA
How many layers of shingles and how much do you suppose they weigh? Unless you're comfortable with the having weight of a VW Bug on your roof (plus snow load), I'd get rid of them.
As I recall, a square of shingles weighs about 240 pounds.
As I recall, a square of shingles weighs about 240 pounds.
I would like to hear the rest of that roofer's
story about how putting steel over the shingles
could or would ever cause a fire. I have two
homes that I have put steel over the old shingles,
there was only one layer of shingles, and they
were so deteriorated there was nothing left. I
brushed, and used a leaf blower to clear all loose
debris, then put 30# roofing felt over the roof,
then put the steel down, one home has been done
for 15 years, no signs of any problems, the other
is about 5 years. I am in the process of doing
this same process to a pole barn I put up 20 years
ago, with apparently 20 year shingles as they are
toast, how it is not leaking I have no idea. It
is going to get the same treatment. If there were
multiple layers, then I would recommend striping
it.
story about how putting steel over the shingles
could or would ever cause a fire. I have two
homes that I have put steel over the old shingles,
there was only one layer of shingles, and they
were so deteriorated there was nothing left. I
brushed, and used a leaf blower to clear all loose
debris, then put 30# roofing felt over the roof,
then put the steel down, one home has been done
for 15 years, no signs of any problems, the other
is about 5 years. I am in the process of doing
this same process to a pole barn I put up 20 years
ago, with apparently 20 year shingles as they are
toast, how it is not leaking I have no idea. It
is going to get the same treatment. If there were
multiple layers, then I would recommend striping
it.
Mark - IN.
Well-known Member
I've never heard of the fire angle. That's a new one to me that I don't believe. However, I would strip the old to remove the excess weight as others have pointed out, and replace any bad sheets of plywood. Also, one of my barns has a metal roof and has a vapor barrier between the metal and the perlins to protect the perlins from condensation that accompanies metal roofs. When I built my tool sheds, I followed suit and put a plastic barrier between the metal and the wood. A fella down the road from me also did a metal roof, and laid perlins down on top of his old roof to support the metal and keep it separate from his existing roof for ventilation and creating a moisture barrier which I think was a good idea for heat and cooling as well, but he didn't strip the old shingles first, which I would have done.
Its your roof, you can do whatever you want, but one thing is for sure, you don't want to have to go up there sooner then later after you finish, so do your homework ahead of time. Good luck.
Mark
Its your roof, you can do whatever you want, but one thing is for sure, you don't want to have to go up there sooner then later after you finish, so do your homework ahead of time. Good luck.
Mark
flembo
Well-known Member
I agree with you on the better job and you can then inspect roof for bad boards as you say but I don't agree with no savings both cost and time. the cleanup takes time and the cost of disposal can be quite costly. when I did my roof Waste Management wanted $400. for a dumpster. I found another co. that was cheaper but still close to $300.
I redid my barn last year and took all old shingles off first. It
gave opportunity to fix any bad boards, and there were quite a
few, and also lighten the weight factor on a 100 year old
building. One of the contractors that bid the job wouldn't
remove the old shingles, he also didn't get consideration for
the job.
gave opportunity to fix any bad boards, and there were quite a
few, and also lighten the weight factor on a 100 year old
building. One of the contractors that bid the job wouldn't
remove the old shingles, he also didn't get consideration for
the job.
colekicker
Member
Maybe you mis-understood him. This is a fire hazard
and a code violation. If it does catch fire, how
can you put it out? It is very difficult. You
can't just put water on from above because you can't
get to the fire below. I saw a house in my hometown
burn to the ground because of this. Very old house,
1x4 between shingles and tin roof provided a great
way for oxygen to feed the fire.
and a code violation. If it does catch fire, how
can you put it out? It is very difficult. You
can't just put water on from above because you can't
get to the fire below. I saw a house in my hometown
burn to the ground because of this. Very old house,
1x4 between shingles and tin roof provided a great
way for oxygen to feed the fire.
Metal roofs do not start home fires. They just prevent the fire fighters from being able to get water down into the burning room from above. With normal shingles the fire will burn through, opening a hole. With a tin roof it takes longer to burn through. I have known fire departments to have to chop through the tin inorder to fight the fire, assuming they can even get on the roof. I think every situation for or against using tin is different.
Anonymous-0
Well-known Member
I put a new metal roof over my hunting cabin last year and I did not take the shingles off. The was no warning that said take off the shingles first
DaninKansas
Member
Agreed.
I would remove them just to get rid of the weight. Shingles are heavy - layer upon layer of shingles is real damned heavy.
I would remove them just to get rid of the weight. Shingles are heavy - layer upon layer of shingles is real damned heavy.
they do it all the time around here, but what i found on a place i take care of is if you put the metal over the shingles a high wind can rip the metal sheets off the roof, why it does that i dont know, i put several sheets back on the mans roof several times and i used screws that were more than long enough to go through and catch the roof plywood, he finally gave up and had the roof redone and removed the shingles, end of problem
Steve@Advance
Well-known Member
Don't really see a fire hazard, might be a code restriction though.
The worst problem I see is if there were a leak it would be very hard to find.
Also what's under there? Is it decking or 1 x 4's?
If it's 1 x 4 would be impossible to know where to fasten.
The worst problem I see is if there were a leak it would be very hard to find.
Also what's under there? Is it decking or 1 x 4's?
If it's 1 x 4 would be impossible to know where to fasten.
Many local building codes now require old shingles to be removed before new shingles are installed. New shingles seem to last 50 percent longer if the old shingles are removed, and old shingles are a lot of unnecessary weight on a roof. The building codes are mostly to protect future buyers from half-buted repairs that don't hold up or cause problems later.
I can understand that shingles under a metal roof would be much harder to extinguish if a building ever catches fire, but I doubt that alone would increase the possibility of a fire starting.
It's your shed. If no building codes apply, then metal over shingles might be the least cost for you now. If you go that way, I would also try to save some more money by not insuring the building for fire, or collapsing in high winds. Odds are if the building does catch fire, your fire department won't be able to save it before the roof falls in, and your insurance company will find a way not pay for the loss because of the substandard roof. Is the shed close to any other buildings of value?
I can understand that shingles under a metal roof would be much harder to extinguish if a building ever catches fire, but I doubt that alone would increase the possibility of a fire starting.
It's your shed. If no building codes apply, then metal over shingles might be the least cost for you now. If you go that way, I would also try to save some more money by not insuring the building for fire, or collapsing in high winds. Odds are if the building does catch fire, your fire department won't be able to save it before the roof falls in, and your insurance company will find a way not pay for the loss because of the substandard roof. Is the shed close to any other buildings of value?
Geo-TH,In
Well-known Member
I would want them removed. The weight is one reason,
the other is shingles will cause flexing, screws may
come loose or leak in the future.
I would also want a moisture bearier to prevent
condensation from getting the decking wet. Some even
put 1/4 inch of fan fold under metal.
the other is shingles will cause flexing, screws may
come loose or leak in the future.
I would also want a moisture bearier to prevent
condensation from getting the decking wet. Some even
put 1/4 inch of fan fold under metal.
We just had our house done with standing seam steel. Contractor bid was for stripping over existing shingles, but mfgr wanted steel directly on roof, over felt. Some of our 17 yo shingles were so upturned, stripping would not work well anyway. Plus, this way we don"t need to worry where we step if we ever need to get topside.
I can"t picture a steel roof causing a fire..I do understand the fire fighting issue, but with saws/axes, I think it"s only a slight delay regarding access.
I can"t picture a steel roof causing a fire..I do understand the fire fighting issue, but with saws/axes, I think it"s only a slight delay regarding access.
ShadetreeRet
Well-known Member
I know more than one who has installed metal over shingles, but personally, I would feel better if the shingles were removed first. I think the main concern about fire is the fact that shingles get so hot under the metal that they could possibly ignite. At least, that's the way I understand it from what I have read and heard.
As long as your deck is good, which all three of mine have been, and one uses good 3" screws thru the existing plywood deck and into the 2 x 4 purlins below, the roof will not come off. If you have an irregular surface due to worn shingles, you may see it, but afterall, it's metal roofing... Not removing the existing shingles also means many less flat tires due to missed nails in the cleanup...
What is supposed to be the cause of this fire?
Sounds like nonsense to me. I've done many roofs
with steel over asphalt. The main issue is usually
weight load and how many layers of asphalt are on
there already. I've yet to live anywhere that the
building code specifically did not allow steel over
existing asphalt. The code restriction of issue was
usually the weight load per square foot when done -
as compared to the existing rafter system.
Sounds like nonsense to me. I've done many roofs
with steel over asphalt. The main issue is usually
weight load and how many layers of asphalt are on
there already. I've yet to live anywhere that the
building code specifically did not allow steel over
existing asphalt. The code restriction of issue was
usually the weight load per square foot when done -
as compared to the existing rafter system.
Tony Vidlak
Member
Both of my sheds had shingles at one time now both have metal roofs right over the top of the shingles. I"ve never had no problems, Why would he think it would catch fire ?
Jim Phelps
Member
I used to roof some, and would never put sheet metal over shingles, just too many thing could go wrong down the line.
Wemedeeres
Member
A guy down the street from me put metal on his roof and it looked nice so I stopped and asked him what all was involved since I had been thinking about doing the same to my house. He told me that the only requirement by the manufacturer was that the old shingles needed to be removed because over time they could curl up from the heat and cause the screws to loosen and panels to lift. My uncle had his roof done a few years back and his contractor removed the shingles installed heavy felt a layer of 1 inch blue Styrofoam and then the metal panels. The Styrofoam is supposed to deaden the sound of heavy rain and hail and also allow for a little "give" to not dent as easily from the hail.
Only downfall, he lives in the country and with the combination of trees, steel siding on the house and the steel roof now, he needs an external antenna for his work cell phone!!
Only downfall, he lives in the country and with the combination of trees, steel siding on the house and the steel roof now, he needs an external antenna for his work cell phone!!
fixerupper
Well-known Member
By metal sheeting do you mean corrugated or ribbed metal roofing? If it's corrugated or ribbed and you feel the roof is strong enough to carry the extra weight, leave the shingles on, nail down 2X4 nailers with #40 or #60 pole nails , nailed into the rafters and screw the steel down to the nailers. Lay the nailers just below a row of shingles so they lay flat. In my neck of the woods in Iowa we have condensation problems with metal roofing and this will take care of that problem. I've done four roofs on my farm that way plus one roof where I put the new steel over the old galvanized corrugated steel, with nailers, of course, and I've never been sorry. The first one was done 30 years ago.
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