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Duramax South America in Chev pick-up

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wilson ind

Well-known Member
Neighbor had discussion with fellow who recently returned from South America. Which country I'm not sure, point is reportly Chevrolet makes a smaller duramax for half ton pick-ups. Reportely mileage is in the area of 40 to 45 mpg. Fellow tries to buy either a truck or just a motor to be shipped back to United States. Not possible !!Makes one wonder if a standard duramax could be setup without US controls to get acceptable mileage.
 
It's the same deal in Europe with these small diesels. They don't meet EPA standards,simple as that.
 

I still haven't figured out HOW the emmisions can be lower, and at the same time it takes MORE fuel to get the job done.
 
The truck does not meet US safety or emissions standards, and cannot be imported.

We will never see the small duramax diesel in a half ton pickup here in the USA. Diesel is viewed as "noisy, smelly and messy" here in the USA, and if you own one you're a hippie or a redneck.

Even with my scientific background, I can't figure out why using MORE fuel is "good" to the EPA. The emissions controls they force on us choke down our vehicles and prevent them from getting good mileage. Half the fuel is half the emissions, right?
 
They can't. EPA is over reaching their hand so far, its not funny. I think that with all the new improvements, I could get well over 30MPG with my Cummins, IF I would take off all the EPA garbage.
Back in the late 60s, I know there were Caddies that were getting 25mpg, and they were tanks.
 
People tend to remember things much better than they really were. I do not remember many vehicles that broke 20MPG in the 60s.
 
Unfortunately the emissions do not scale with mileage.

Modifying a modern diesel to get 20% more mpg by removing the
emissions equipment may increase emissions by 10 X, 20 X or
every more depending what you do.

There is more to emissions than a smoke opacity meter.
 
South America still can by new old style Canyans, Colorado with the Fiat VM diesel . It"s related to the engine in the Chevy cruise, Citivia, Canyon, etc. also used in the Dodge 1/2 ton and Grand Cherokee .
 
Ya they did. Don't you remember? The folks who had them went out to find their hood up and somebody running off with their carburetor. lol
 
Must be you aren't old enough to remember the conspiracy theories and old wives tales. Folks claimed to have cars that were getting 40-50 mpg,but they'd hear something outside and go out to find somebody,allegedly from GM,Ford,what have you,running off with the carburetor off their car. Or they'd get a recall notice and when their car was done,it had a different carb and was getting 15 mpg. It was a conspiracy between the oil companies and auto makers.
If you aren't old enough to remember,oh well. I tried.
 
I had a 66 MG Midget that got 40+MPG,also the 60 and 61 Ford Falcons with that small 6 cylinder got in the high 20's.Slant 6 Dodge engines usually got very good mileage.
 
With most of the late model electronically controlled engines, if you mess with them much at all, they will not run nearly as well and will get MUCH poorer mileage. Maybe you could get a bit better mileage with a Cummins by careful modifications, but I think 30 is pretty optimistic. You can"t fool the computer.

25mpg late 60"s Caddies? As I remember, most big cars with big engines got around 10 to 12, and 15 was considered exceptional. My slant 6 Mopar Darts and Valiants, which weighed half as much as a Cadillac would only get about 20 to 23 with manual transmissions.
 
I remember them, was a mechanic, so never believed any, so must not have stuck in my mind. I had a customer that dropped some of the overhaul pellets in his engine, had to take the head off and clean it up.
 
Dad had a Falcon with small 6, he was happy if it broke 20, I think your memory is sweetening things up a little.
 
Dodge is offering a diesel in there 1500, you can order a new one think they will be ready on April.
 
YEP. YOU ARE CORRECT. GM has a version of the 2001-2004 LB7 duramax that is a 6 cylinder version. Could not meet the emission requirements. I always heard that GM has a HUGE supply of these engines and no platform (truck series) to put them in.

After all, the LB7 engine had really NO emissions. PCV dumped to atmosphere. No EGR. Computer couldn't tell if a glow plug was out on federal emissions package. The Cali emissions duramax could though.

Thanks Gov.
 
(quoted from post at 09:44:02 03/19/14) Must be you aren't old enough to remember the conspiracy theories and old wives tales. Folks claimed to have cars that were getting 40-50 mpg,but they'd hear something outside and go out to find somebody,allegedly from GM,Ford,what have you,running off with the carburetor off their car. Or they'd get a recall notice and when their car was done,it had a different carb and was getting 15 mpg. It was a conspiracy between the oil companies and auto makers.
If you aren't old enough to remember,oh well. I tried.
Click to expand...

As a matter of fact I bought a brand new 1994 Chevy Beretta that got 45 mpg with the 2.2 4 banger and 5 speed tranny....and I got a recall notice from GM. I called and they said it had a problem that could cause sudden acceleration. I never did take it in. I ran Amsoil in it, changed the oil 4 times in 125,000+ miles and still didn't use any oil when I sold it to a friend. The mileage dropped to 42 when I replaced the original Goodyear tires @ 88,000 with some Pirellis....

P.S. Also had a 1981 Olds Cutlass Supreme Broughm 2dr diesel that would get 42 mpg on a hot day. That was a nice car....but got scared with all the hype about the engine and sold it before I moved to MI....
 
Since you brought up the diesels,ya,I had an 81 Bonneville with the 5.7 Goodwrench that got 40 on a long trip on the freeway.
 
There are quite a few auto makers who are starting to develop diesel cars and trucks. Audi and BMW are making luxury diesels, VW has diesels available in most all cars and SUVs they sell. GM has the Cruze available in a diesel now and will offer their colorado and canyon pickups with a little duramax diesel in 2015. Ram will offer a half ton pickup with a V6 diesel and I believe Nissan is offering a V8 diesel in their Titan pickups. Jeep offers diesels in some of their vehicles. Plus, the big three have diesels available in their 3/4 and One ton trucks.
 
I know this is not what you are talking about but the diesel version which we get in the UK is definately more economical that the larger gas motor you guys get. Dodge Nitro 2.8 turbo diesel, 170 hp standard, I have mine chipped at about 209. Standard it returned about 30 mpg, with the chip 2 or 3 more but if I do a long journey keeping to just under 60 mph I have managed close to 40mpg. These 4x4 Dodge models are real good value for money over our side of the world as their looks dont appeal to most european drivers. Of course I just love mine although once my wife stops working at the end of the year we need to get something that can get close to 50mpg, I have my eyes on a Vauxhall Insignia 2litre twin turbo diesel.
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(quoted from post at 09:09:11 03/19/14) People tend to remember things much better than they really were. I do not remember many vehicles that broke 20MPG in the 60s.
Click to expand...

Early 60s, yes, they could achieve 25+ if equipped with an in-line 6, 3 speed manual transmission with overdrive.
 
(quoted from post at 16:09:11 03/19/14) People tend to remember things much better than they really were. I do not remember many vehicles that broke 20MPG in the 60s.
Click to expand...
Some people tend to remember things to be much worse than they really were too.
I remember some 60's cars that family members had that got over 20 mpg. My parent's full size '66 Ford Ranch Wagon was one. Their '64 Fairlane was another. Other family members had Falcons, Mustangs, Galaxie, and even a Chevy Biscayne that all got 20 mpg or better.
 
Respectfully disagree.
Lower emissions goes hand in hand with better efficiency. Think about it. The laws of physics apply here. More fuel = more emissions.
Contrary to popular belief, today's engines are NOT "choked down" in any form. Look at today's engine specifications. Look at their performance. Back in the '60s and '70s, a 6 cylinder engine even in a mid-sized car was a DOG!! Yes, it would get the job done, but don't be in a big hurry about it. Today, a similar size engine is almost considered a muscle car! Engines in the 2-liter class are making 200 horsepower. 3-liter class is up around 300. They are powering that huge Chrysler 300 with a base engine of 2.7 liters. And it drives like a small V-8 did in the '70s. How can that be considered "choked down???"

As it was explained to me at manufacturer emission schools years ago, it is a 3-way split to make an engine and car combination to please every agency that controls it.

The customer wants performance.

The EPA wants low emissions.

CARB wants good fuel mileage.

To balance these items requires a lot of engineering skill to end up with a marketable product.

BTDT.
 
Let me refresh your memory some. Chevrolet Corvair typically got 25 to 30 mpg. Ford Falcon got 22 to 28. Dodge Dart and Plymouth Valiant also got similar mileage. Then there were the foreign offerings. VW bugs typically got 40mpg. My father had a Morris Oxford that got around 30 or better.
The cars were there, but not always popular.
 
Gm markets 2 versions of the Duramax in South America as well as Asia. 150hp no turbo v6 or a 180 hp turbo'd v6. The are available in an S-10 or Colorado only, no full size half tons. These trucks have been available since 2012. A turboed diesel crew cab 4x4 reasonably well optioned will run you about $41,000+ at current exchange rates in Brazil
 
Yes, All my life I heard that a man from a nearby town invented a miracle carburetor that would make any auto get 100+ MPG.. Of course, Gulf Oil paid him one million dollars for the rights... Bet I heard that story 100 times, so it had to be true.......
 
Ken, you are correct. Take a modern common rail diesel engine, bump up the SOIP and advance the timing, you will get your BSFC down but you will also watch you NOx skyrocket.....(which some engine companies do if they have SCR and can dose enough without much urea slip).
 
(quoted from post at 22:19:50 03/19/14) Yes, All my life I heard that a man from a nearby town invented a miracle carburetor that would make any auto get 100+ MPG.. Of course, Gulf Oil paid him one million dollars for the rights... Bet I heard that story 100 times, so it had to be true.......
Click to expand...

But it was a different company or govt paying him.

You can get 100 mpg right now on a moped.
 
GM doesn"t have a four or six cylinder Duramax. It"s a Fiat VM engine they build under license in Korea and other locations.
Get your rubber boots on if anybody says otherwise.
Fiat uses their VM diesel in various Chrysler, Dodge and Ram vehicles. Fiat sells the engine or rights to the engine to GM, Kia, Hyundia, Daewoo, Alfa Romeo, Land Rover, Saab, Maserati and iirc Ford.
I had a ride in VM turbo four diesel powered five speed manual Chevy Captivia ( equinox ) in Italy a couple of weeks ago. Impressive power, smooth, quiet and very fuel efficient. Only drawback was the time and $$$ spent in the shop once warranty expired. Taxi owner and his fellows owners are going back to gassers . Even though diesel was much cheaper to purchase.
Would somebody show me the math of how it saves money to pay for the diesel option. Then pay 20% more per gallon and have 20% better mileage?
Filling a highway vehicle with the off road fuel doesn"t pay either after paying the fines.

http://www.vmmotori.com/automotive/automotive-en.html
 
(quoted from post at 08:19:17 03/20/14) GM doesn"t have a four or six cylinder Duramax. It"s a Fiat VM engine they build under license in Korea and other locations.
Get your rubber boots on if anybody says otherwise.
Fiat uses their VM diesel in various Chrysler, Dodge and Ram vehicles. Fiat sells the engine or rights to the engine to GM, Kia, Hyundia, Daewoo, Alfa Romeo, Land Rover, Saab, Maserati and iirc Ford.
I had a ride in VM turbo four diesel powered five speed manual Chevy Captivia ( equinox ) in Italy a couple of weeks ago. Impressive power, smooth, quiet and very fuel efficient. Only drawback was the time and $$$ spent in the shop once warranty expired. Taxi owner and his fellows owners are going back to gassers . Even though diesel was much cheaper to purchase.
Would somebody show me the math of how it saves money to pay for the diesel option. Then pay 20% more per gallon and have 20% better mileage?
Filling a highway vehicle with the off road fuel doesn"t pay either after paying the fines.

http://www.vmmotori.com/automotive/automotive-en.html
Click to expand...

Isuzu four and six diesels were used in the last but have been replaced since the mid 1990's with VM diesels.
 
?? I had a 99 Dodge 5.9 that got 23 to 25 mile per gallon.I now have a 07 Dodge with a 6.7 gets 12 mile per gallon.It takes 12000 gallon of air to burn ONE gallon of diesel fuel now if I put out 12,000 gallon of diesel smoke over 25 mile[480 gallons per mile]compared to 24,000 gallons per 25 mile[960 gallons per mile]please explaine how the 6.7 is cleaner than the 5.9 Thanks
 
(quoted from post at 07:19:17 03/20/14)
Would somebody show me the math of how it saves money to pay for the diesel option. Then pay 20% more per gallon and have 20% better mileage? l
Click to expand...

b&d
It took longer in this thread than I thought it would for you to get up on "your ANTI-DIESEL SOAPBOX"!!!!!!!!!! :lol:
 
(quoted from post at 08:57:42 03/20/14)
(quoted from post at 07:19:17 03/20/14)
Would somebody show me the math of how it saves money to pay for the diesel option. Then pay 20% more per gallon and have 20% better mileage? l
Click to expand...

b&d
It took longer in this thread than I thought it would for you to get up on "your ANTI-DIESEL SOAPBOX"!!!!!!!!!! :lol:
Click to expand...

I am not anti diesel. I am anti what the EPA has done to the diesel.
Ever since diesel fuel was priced 20% above gasoline instead of 20% less than gasoline . The cost advantage disappeared.
Then add the cost and maintenance of the Tier II, III and IV emissions systems.
 
FYI: My 66 Old's 98 convertible (425 4brl) got 18mpg on the highway if you kept it around 65 and stayed out of the back barrels. After that, 10mpg. My 74 Cadillac Coup Deville (472 4brl) got 10mpg no matter how you drove it.
 
30 isn't too likely, without serious aero changes. But you can easily do better than the 12-14 most of the Cummins are getting stock. Dodge was building trucks that could get 20-25MPG 25 years ago, why can't they do it today?

Just deleted the 08 at work this week. We'll see what it does. If it doesn't get any better mileage, at least it will have the power to show for it.
 
(quoted from post at 22:17:01 03/21/14) 30 isn't too likely, without serious aero changes. But you can easily do better than the 12-14 most of the Cummins are getting stock. Dodge was building trucks that could get 20-25MPG 25 years ago, why can't they do it today?

Just deleted the 08 at work this week. We'll see what it does. If it doesn't get any better mileage, at least it will have the power to show for it.
Click to expand...

????? My '05 5.9 regularly gets 20-23.5 pokin' around empty. A friend's '09 1500 Hemi does better than that empty AND it's as quick & as fast as greased lightning - won't pull like the 5.9 but they make a good team for whatever comes up 8) My 2¢
 
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