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Dads with daughters.

J

JayinNY

Well-known Member
I have a little over 2 , year old daughter, I want to put her in 4h
when she's old enought, so my question is, what is the
differance between 4h and Girl Scouts, I haven't done a
google search yet. Any one know anything about 4h? How did
you like it for your child. I have to look and see if my county
even has it anymore. Thanks, J
 
We like 4h have 2 daughters and 1 son in it. Our daughters show sheep and a horse, plus many projects. Our son only shows his projects so far. 4h is a good self-esteem boost for them and we all enjoy the fair for the week.
 
My kids are in 4H. My girls used to be in Girl Scouts. Do yourself a favor and research causes they support and where their money is spent, it is an eye opener.
 
I'd vote for the 4H. Our daughter started out in Girl Scouts and left after a couple of years. Way too much fund raising and most of the money went to the national organization.
 
4H here is project oriented and I won't pretend to know if they all are. If you decide you want to raise a certain type of livestock, your project is a major show where you exhibit your animal(s). Locally they encourage the county fair but you had options. Some of the kids were working on cars or tractors. Don't know what all the categories are. There are group leaders who guide the kids in their projects. Groups will only be as good as the leader who runs them. All in all, not a bad organization but STRONGLY urge you to shop around on which 4-H you want to be a part of. Certain parents splintered off the main group and started their own group, which consisted of their kid and a circle of select friends. You don't really want one of those.
 
We did the Girl Scouts first. It was okay I guess. After a couple of years it got to be more fund raising activities than anything. Moved on to 4H and had many years of fun with it. My daughter stayed in it until she aged out at 18. We chose raising dairy goats and meat meat goats. She did well and liked the competition. Ended up being grand champion showman three years running at the fair and competed in Round Robbin. Fair week was something we always looked forward to and still show in the open classes today.

Whatever you choose be ready for the commitment of the club. 4H requires project books to be completed and an entry in the county fair to get a complete on the project as well as making it to club meetings each month. I saw some kids who's parents were not engaged and the kids suffered because of it. While it is the kids projects to complete, parents being involved and supportive really makes a big difference. And being there to see that first ribbon being won is priceless.

Greg
 
The roots of the 4H program are based on county-state Cooperative Extension in the early 20th century. the land grant colleges were developing useful information but farmers and ranchers were not utilizing it. 4H was developed to pass on information developed at land grant colleges through the children of farm families. It seems most adults were set in there ways and did not want to try some of the newer, scientifically developed information regarding farming methods and animal science. So by passing the info on through the kids through small prokjects, the parents could learn new methods and techniques.
It has changed over the years but still has it roots in agriculture and there are also programs for city kids. I grew up in a city and never got the opportunity to be involved with 4H. My involvement came after my retirement when I was appointed to the County Fair Board. I was very impressed by the responsibility that this program instilled in the paticipaants, the competitive spirit and the sense of fair play that the kids have and as they go through the senior programs, the poise and confidence that these 4H'ers have. The volunteers that teach thee kids are farmers and ranchers themselves and they do a great job and I never understood where they find the time to do this and run their operations.
The only down side I see is, like Little League, etc , the program would be better off with out the parents making it an extension of their unsatisfied egos. But that's human nature I guess. Parents injecting "politics" makes a great program less than great.

Nothing wrong with scouting. Both of these are worthwhile programs for kids, male or female, and they will get out of either one what ever they are willing to put into it.
 
I agree with Dave. The group leaders are key. Ours was very good and made it fun for the families. The families that split off and started their own group never did as well. The parents made it a money and political thing and the kids hated it. The groups that stayed close and tight were like extended family and they worked well together.

I never did a group leader position, but did sign up for project leader. The group leader organized the club group and project leaders helped the kids learn about their projects and organized the projects. As a project leader I held clinics open to all groups in the county. I taught fitting and showmanship clinics. Kids in any group that attended were always the kids doing the best at fair. I would hold half day clinics at the fair grounds three times a year. Kids brought their projects with them and practiced fitting and showmanship. This gave the kids the opportunity to meet kids from other groups and visit too.

Greg
 
Really depends entirely upon who's leading either.

Girl scouts, the way I've seen it, is probably a little more structured where one girl scout group is roughly like to others. There are more traditional ceremonies and patches they earn like merit badges in boy scouts. They do a lot of field trip type things.

4H CAN have a much wider range of possibilities.

4H relies more on the leader's interests and can range anywhere from cooking to woodworking to raising beef cows.

Problem is, you're kind of stuck with what the leaders are interested in doing. (unless you want to volunteer yourself)

For example - I'm a 4h leader for poultry, farm equipment restoration, and goats. Another guy does beef cows, another does gardening, another does technology and photography, yet another does horses.

Kids can pick and choose what they want to do.

So we're kind of all over the place, but we make it work.

2's a little young, but once she's around 4/5, anybody running either 4h or girl scouts I'm sure would be more than happy to let you sit in with your daughter to get a feel for what they do.

Not sure what the starting age for girls scouts/brownies is - but for 4h it's 6.
 
Wife and I were 4H leaders (She did 99% of the work).
Had a large and very active group for about 7 years. They compete all the way to eighteen.
We did a few fundraisers and they were fun. One was a petting zoo at a local town October fest. Kids brought rabbits, goats and chickens for folks to hold and pet and we alwayus brought our pony and a gentle Arabian mare for rides. The $ earned went to a trip to the Springfiel, Illinois State fair.
Funny thing was tha My wife NEVER had any parents as helpers more than one year! BE INVOLVED with your kids...don't treat it as a baby sitting service!!!
 
My daughter is in 4H, but I have to admit my wife is more involved with all of it than I am (my wife was very involved in 4H as a kid, me not so much). The nice thing about 4H is we could find projects that fit with some of the things we are already involved in. We live in town, so the livestock projects are not something we can manage, but she participates in Shooting Sports, Performing Arts, Arts and Crafts, Birding, Fashion (I don't know what that really is other than an excuse to go shopping!), and we tried Gardening. If you can think of it, there is likely a project available, but as others have said, you may end up being the "project leader" (it isn't difficult).

I like the leadership opportunities and the "real life" applications like record keeping and running a meeting. There are some real "grown up" things for the kids to do, but in a way that allows them to "learn by doing".
 
My girls did both. We had a good scout leader and I'd still say if you have to choose between the two, it's 4H hands down. My girls would say so to.
 
Thanks for all the great info, I have time to do some research, and 4h looks like the way to go.
 
Hi Jay. This is Larry's wife. As a mom, I can tell you both sides of it.
My daughter began with 4-H in 1st grade-that is when you could begin. She was offered G/S also but was more interested in 4-h. The grammer school she went to, she was the only person in 4-H, the rest of the girls were in G/S. They are both good choices. In 4-H you have so many choices as to clubs, either as animal or regular club. As she loved goats, we purchased two and that is what she stuck with. We have something called "loan a " goat, cow, sheep, alpaca, horse.
The 4-Her's work with someone who can not have an animal, They work with them, teaching how to take care of them and all that goes with it. They also have to do presentations once a year on anything they want and are judged by adults. This is all in conjunction with Rutgers U.
In her freshman year of high school she decided to join G/S. Again it is a wonderful organization. She worked to receive badges and work up to the senior level. They are both great, whether you choice 4-H or G/S. We let our daughter decide and she ended up experincing both. Let your daughter be introduced to both and she will know which she wants to do. You can not go wrong with either choice.
 
Hi Jay I forgot to mention that I was a 4-H leader for 12 years. There are not many fundraisers, just ads for our book(that was all to pay for the 4-H fair, so keep it free) and wreaths. That was it! Girl Scouts be prepared to buy cookies and more cookies. Before our daughter was born, I was a 4-H leader for a baking club. So my heart was in 4-H. But,we let our daughter decide and she did well. We have one goat left and I spoil him every day.
 
Drive by the local Girl Scouts headquarters and get a quick realization that too much of the money does not go to help the kids !
 
Sprint 6, yes I am glad you mentioned this. While the local GS chapter may not appear to have a political agenda, the National Organization sure appears to. 4-H is an organization where the interest of the youth is valued and cultivated. It may be their project, but it gives parents an opportunity to understand their childs interests and spend time with them. 4-H hands down. gobble
 
larry - great advice about being involved as a parent!

In fact, I'd say our 4H club is just as much for the parents as it is for the kids.

I think of 4H as more of a family club, where girlscouts is more about dropping the girl off with the group. Might be an unfair assessment, but that's been my experience.

We do a lot of fundraising too - in girlscouts that tends to be sitting out in front of banks selling things (like cookies). Where in 4H we too do petting zoos at local fairs and events, cow chip bingo, pony rides, etc.

It's a lot more fun than just selling stuff. The kids educate the public on their various animals, and it develops an amazing level of confidence and conversation skill.

Over the years, I've often been complimented on my kids abilities to converse with adults at such a grown up level, they really stand out amongst their peers - and I attribute that COMPLETELY to 4h.
 
Dave & Greg,what you say is very true about friendships and learning things.However jay and anyone else getting into 4H needs to know that at least 50% of the people into it are in it for BLOOD.They will win every yr.regardless.The same familys-group takes the top prizes every year and have for the past 50-60yrs.or whatever time and will be winning the next 100 or more yrs.It can be hurtful for some kids to learn this and knowing some of them will give up.It is a shame but a fact of life.
 
I guess it depends on the childs interest if she even has any at that age, but having raised a daughter I can say this. DO AT LEAST ONE OR BOTH. My experience was any of those type of wholesome activities helps a daughters self esteem and sense of worth and interests plus are good FAMILY experiences and sure beats the Mall and Cell Phone use lol

GO FOR IT, ONE OR BOTH as a family that shares any types of clean wholesome activities with children is blessed in my opinion.

Daddys little girls are so sweet as kids but can break your heart in teen years grrrrrrr (get sort of snippy then grrrrrr) but if they survive that and get to be twenty something they start liking old dad again lol

My daughter the architect had moved to Texas a few years back and calls me one day all upset saying she locked her keys in the car.......I say what you want me to do I'm 1000 miles away........Then I tell her where to look under the cars rear bumper where I had hidden a spare key.......SHE THOUGHT I WAS THE GREATEST DAD IN THE WORLD !!!!!!!!! I tell her to put it back or the next time dont call me

Ol John T and all
 
4h was good for our girls.they can do alot things and projects. the leader of course can really make or break the program. parent involvement is really important.it is not a babysit class for the parents to drop then leave thing,or it should not be. projects can qualify for county fairs then on to state fairs etc. it can each teach leadership,speaking,record keeping etc. i really enjoyed going through the years of it with my girls. one of my girls now heads up the queen contest. as far girl scouts it okay but like mentioned earlier always money fund raising and they don't actuslly get much. went thru the girl scout sales thing etc. that has really went down hill far as i see on how you can sell them. expose them to both and trust me you will learn alot also
 
Yea she loves going to the stable with me every morning, she watches the cows and likes feeding the chickens. When she's older ill ask her if she interested in trying it out. My wife did 4h a long time ago, but she did baking, and I'm not sure what else. I know she said she won first place at the NYS fair for a chocolate pie or cake, I don't remember which! But she never did anything with animals, even thought she grew up on a farm. Lol,
 
Our daughter was in GS when she was in grade school and had a good leader. It was a good experience. She joined 4H in middle school and raised and showed lambs and turkeys (along with goats and roasters in FFA). Again, she had an excellent leader and lots of parent support. Her success at showing resulted in a pretty good bank account and a scholorship when she graduated from high school.
 
4-H is a great organization, my wife has been an adviser fro 40 years. It is less structured than Girl Scouts. In 4-H the child takes projects they may include agriculture related such as raising farm animals or horseback riding. They may also be projects like sewing, cooking,photography,rockets,or a self directed project.
 
Jay,,,,,,heres your sign,,,,
a147065.jpg
 
My 4-H expriences go back 70 years I was in 4-H at the time of World War II We have three girls and a boy who have been throgh it. There is more o it than showing live stock. Do not forget the speaking projects and judging oppurtunities. Both my son and I were National Project winners.
It is a great organizaion.
gitrib
 
Jay,,,,,each year the 4h member is required to give a speaking presentation,it can be on anything they choose,it is to give the kids ability to speak in front of people,one year my little girl gave a presentation on her Ford 8n, she won a blue ribbon . Talk about a proud Dad! I went and found the posters she made for he presentation so you could see them,I think she was around 10 years old at the time.
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Our oldest daughter liked 4H a lot. We don't have any farm animals except chickens, so she liked being able to do photography, cooking, etc. It is real nice that they learn to be confident enough to get up in front of others and speak about their project too. I wish I had done more of that when I was younger. Next daughter coming is going to be quite different, we're signing up for "shooting sports" I hear!
 
that has go to be the most re-tarded, small minded, most bigoted comment I have ever read on any internet board
sir, please crawl back under the rock you just left and leave those kind of comments in the gutter
not a lot of experience with either group ( but some ) think they both have their good points
bob
 
Wow, That's what I'm talking about right there Larry, that's
something to be proud of! Now I can see my daughter doing
that with my Ford 4610, lol, thanks for taking the time to
posting that, it was great, J
 
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