(800) 853-2651
SHOP NOW

Never heard of this problem before

J

john in la

Well-known Member
Location
What part of in La do you not understand
Dad calls me a few days ago and ask me if I could come over one day to look at his truck. He has a major oil leak on about a 18 month old long block rebuilt motor that I installed in his truck.
So since it is the weekend and I got off work a little early today I drove the 50 miles to his house to look at it.

Get there and look under truck and it is covered in oil from front of motor to rear end.
Start looking around for a leak and notice it is coming from the oil pump/filter area on front of motor.
After much wiping and looking I can see the oil filter has a pin hole in it.
Took the filter off and do not see any dings or dents in the filter but it has a hole right in the side of the metal case about half way down the filter.
Its like the metal was so thin the oil pressure blew a hole in the side of the case.
Never in my life have I seen anything like this.

For those of you that must know.....
It was a fram tough guard oil filter put on by a shop my parents get work done at. Dad said they had the oil changed about a month ago so it lasted a little while but not very long.
I went and bought some oil and a motorcraft filter and did a oil change for him while I was there.
 
Any chance the fan picked up something minute and threw it back at the filter ? Could have been something very small and sharp?
 
I'm thinking there was a flaw in the sheetmetal, maybe something got in the drawing die during the manufacturing process. I've never seen a pinhole in a filter, but I have seen them leak where the can is seamed onto the flange.

Anything is possible, think how fast those things would be coming off the assembly line.
 
You would think if the fan threw something at it there would be a ding in the filter where it bent in from the impact before the hole was made.
No sign of that.

It looks just like what a rusted on the inside radiator would be like when the metal wears so thin that the water pressure causes a leak.

Now that I think about it maybe I should put a mechanical gauge on it to see where the oil pressure is. The relief valve in the new oil pump may be stuck causing the oil pressure to spike way up.
 
doesn't take much rust I had one here this summer a wix oil everywhere just a good thing it happened right here in the yard.
 
That's true. You would think the filter (if properly made) would blow up like a balloon or maybe come apart at the seam long before it would blow a hole in the side of the sheet metal case.

I might go back over there and check it anyway just to be sure but it really looks like a defective case to me.
 
Remember the days you could stand on the roof of your truck with out it denting? Try it witha new one. I'm betting you would do a great amount of damage. Same thing with filters, they getting made thinner and thinner and...
 
If internal pressure was to rupture an oil filter case, I would expect a tear or split pushed out of the case rather than a pin hole leak. A pin hole sounds like either a puncture or maybe a rust through.

The completed filters should have been leak tested before they were packaged, but today maybe inspection and quality assurance tests like that are skipped to reduce costs.

The good thing is that it was a relatively easy and inexpensive fix that shouldn't happen again. He's lucky he didn't run the engine out of oil. I would have your dad return the filter to the store. They should at least give him a complementry free oil change.
 
Possibly the filter wrench may have contributed to it. Filter wrenches have little dimples so they don't slip, so if the filter had a thin spot it's possible it caused a slight indentation that caused the leak.
 
There is an oil filter study done by a regular guy, it is on the internet. This fella buys all brands of engine oil filters and tests them. He has plenty of spare time, likely retired. He tests them for rupture, in hydrostatic burst, filter element condition after use, and several other things. He puts his conclusion in at the end and FRAM is the worst, Wix was okay, Mobil One was good. I think of it like this......The oil filter is the weak link of a pressurizd system. Thin metal can with cheap filter element. And you buy it for under ten bucks. What do you expect. Buy the high quality filters.
 
I have seen defective oil filters leak where the top is crimped on.

You not only need to check the oil pressure to be safe, but you might want to check the filter bypass valve that it is not stuck. Oil filter systems are bypass systems, usually the bypass opens at 15 to 20psi so the filter does not see full system pressure. No spin on auto size filter can handle full cold start oil pressure, even when regulated down by the oil pressure relief valve.
 
Once when I changed oil in the minivan, I started it and the filter leaked like a sieve. Took it back off and discovered the old gasket didn't come off with the filter so it had double gaskets. I check for that now before putting on a new one.
 
You are correct. I have seen what stuck pressure regulator valves will do and when this happens the filter will bulge first, usually at the outer end. I would say that if there was no sign of bulging it was not an over pressure issue.
 
John

A friend had the same thing happen to a brand new FRAM filter, he contacted FRAM, and they sent him replacement filters. They also reimbursed him for an oil change. The contact FRAM led my friend to believe that this problem had happended before.

Rich
 
John, I had the came thing happen a while back on a Fleetgaurd brand coolant filter on a tug boat. The engine room is protected, not like driving down the road, not even a cooling fan as these engine are keel cooled (heat exchanger) from river water. The filter was from fresh sealed stock also.
 
Like everything else these days the filter case is made from recycled metal. It probably had a tiny piece of crud in the metal that eroded and leaked. I've seen similar with Purolator and Wix filters too over the last few years. It's rare but it does happen.
 
Saw a lot about the filter study over on the Turbo Diesel Register. After reading about it I will never buy a Fram or Wix.
I think at one time you would void your Dodge Cummins warranty if you put a Wix filter on.
 
LONG STORY; SHORT VERSION: Changed oil on a truck and had NO oil pressure when done. After replacing nearly everything else; I changed the filter and everything was fine again. No oil could go thru the filter. never could figure that one out.
 
Yep. I had the same exact thing happen to me a couple years back. I noticed the leak before I got out of the shop though. Fram filter as well.
 
not the first time this has happened, we saw wrong oil filters put on cars by supposedly professional oil change artists, leaky filters, wrong filters sold to customers by the local professional auto supply stores, most of the time the motors were ruined. Glad he caught it in time.
 
I sold a big Ford tractor to a farmer. Tractor was in very god condition when I sold it. A year later the farmer tells me his engine has gone bad. Not blaming me though because he had started in on a cold winter morning and left it running unattended and the filter burst and let the oil out of the engine. He thought the by pass valve had stuck and over pressured the engine oil. I believe the filter was bad and burst because the oil was cold and the filter weak.
 
Cummins is bad about wanting to deny warranties. Per the
Manges Moss act (sp?) If a manufacture claims you have to use their fiters the have to provide them for free.
This law can be seen in the back pages of aftermarket filter catalogs.
 
Had a run of bad fuel filters on my truck, had several blow. They were napa filters. They would blow the ends right out of the can.
 
How did I know the 'F' word would be involved in this story...
You can also go to any cummins dealer and have them cross your filter to a FleetGuard number and then you'll get a good filter with a shell that won't perforate.

Rod
 
I own an automotive repair shop, and I refuse to use or install Fram filters. There have been a large number of failed Cummins engines due to Fram oil filters. I don't remember how many Cummins engines I personally have changed.
 
I was going to change the oil in my truck. I got a new Fram Filter sitting on the bench for it.
Now you got me wondering.
 
I had a Fram filter blow apart years ago on a drag strip. I was running 5w-20 oil and pressure never got over 50 on the run. I had a camera mounted to record the run. When the filter blew, I was right at the quarter mile lights and at 106 mph. That gave me a nice ride but never hit anything. I contacted the warehouse the store got it from and heard "not their problem, it is on a race car." I then contacted Fram directly and that was their first reply. When I said I had the run on video, had the bad filter, box, and receipt, as well as an appointment with my attorney for the next week, they changed their tone. They even sent me a filter, a case of oil, and asked if I would be interested in them sponsoring my car. The filter went unused and I finally threw away the letters after several years.
 
The thinnest area of a filter shell SHOULD BE just below the top "dome". This is where the greatest forces are exerted in the draw die to get the metal to start flowing.

Finding a pin hole half way up the shell almost smells like sabotage ???

So far I have only experienced one filter failure. It was a fuel filter on a 5.9 Cummins and developed a crack in the area I spoke of above.
 
Had the same thing happen years ago with a brand new filter.
Took it back to the parts store , they replaced it and the oil no questions asked.
 
Similar thing happened to a friend's car. I noticed an oil trail in show. Engine only had 2 qts of oil left. Good thing it didn't cost an engine.
 
I've read many tirades trashing Fram, but have used them for 45 years and no complaints. Have a new Ford truck and it rattles a little when it starts up with either a Fram or Motorcraft filter. Have recently migrated to using the "best" Fram filters which have a denser medium and although more expensive than the standard and "better" Fram alternatives they are still as cheap or cheaper than the OEM products.
 
You probably got the one out of that particular lot that got pressure tested at 5000PSI for 1000 times a minute....

How would you bleed the pressure off fast enough to do that test anyhow? I don't see how they could get much pressure variation at that rate and still keep the pressure that high?
 
Had oil filter gaskets blow out on my 2000 Chev PU (350 cu. in.) and IH 1066. Neighbor had filter gasket blow on his JD 6620 combine couple years ago. He didn't catch it in time-cost him major engine repairs.
 
I had to go under my parents RV back in the fall--can't remember why. He was backing it off the ramps I noticed a fair amount of oil on the ground under the engine. I mentioned it and they said they'd noticed it at the last camp ground they stayed in on their way home from a long trip and they said they thought they'd put too much oil in it and eventually it'd get back down to the correct level. Yea, I don't even need to bother explaining it doesn't work that way. I said I think we need to take a look pull it back up on them again. I noticed oil all around the filter. Touched it and it wobbled. I wasn't even snug! I tightened it up. I don't know if the shop that changed the oil a week earlier hadn't tightened it or if lousy roads caused it to vibrate off--I wouldn't think that would happen. But they did have the air cleaner cover come loose on their trip and come completely off and the filter slide out. The funny thing is it's hard to get off by hand--how'd that happen? They had it duck taped on in addition to the clamps.
 

a friend got a pinhole leak in a fuel filter last summer. I just happened to come along when he was waiting on the side of the road for someone from his shop. At the time there was a thread about holes in filters. I remember that it was thought to be uncommon.
 
I had the same problem on my bucket truck on the spin-on hyd. fluid filter. Tiny pinhole that only leaked when you operated the hydraulics. Unfortunately, it is mounted bhind the cab, higher than the roof, up on the hyd reservoir. I found it the same way, with lots of wiping and scrubbing, but it took about 3 times before I finally located it. Unfortunately, it was shooting all over the cab and windshield rather than the bottom of the truck!
 
(quoted from post at 01:30:56 01/18/14) Possibly the filter wrench may have contributed to it. Filter wrenches have little dimples so they don't slip, so if the filter had a thin spot it's possible it caused a slight indentation that caused the leak.
Click to expand...
But you are not supposed to use a filter wrench to install a filter. Only to remove. At least that is how all my old engines are. Just hand tighten.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

4
Allis Chalmers B oil priming after filter change
2
Replies
23
Views
972
49clipper
4
5
Sealing a 1/8 inch hole
Replies
11
Views
667
stevieb49829
stevieb49829
4
Allis Chalmers oil filter
2
Replies
21
Views
987
Jim.ME
J
Geo-TH,In
Napa Gold oil filter
2
Replies
23
Views
1K
Absent Minded Farmer
Absent Minded Farmer
I
spin on oil filter for IH 444 gas tractor
2
Replies
21
Views
729
Fixingfarmer
Fixingfarmer
Tractor Parts Tractor Manuals

We sell tractor parts! We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today.

Copyright © 1997-2024 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters
Website Accessibility Policy

Back
Top