(800) 853-2651
SHOP NOW

Can't we get along?

I

IaGary

Well-known Member
Why is it the farmer makes a few dollars and we all get upset and jealous of him? City folk as well as country folk.

But back in the 80's we didn't care how many went broke. Or the farmers that struggled to raise a family since then.

I've been through it all. Low and high prices of grains and livestock.

There are farmers who want to raise certain crops without GMO's. There are those who want to raise without chemicals or man made fertilizers.

That is all fine but don't condemn the way most are farming.

Even the livestock farmers were upset with the grain farmers the past few years. Now the livestock farmers are doing well and that is great. They deserve it.

We are all farming to make a living and do what we want to do. Do it the way you want but don't condemn the others.

The mega farms had to get there some how. Maybe you and I should have followed in there footsteps and gotten there as well.

Take advantage of the opportunity's available to you and when you think the others are getting more than you, then do what they are doing to get it or don't complain.

Gary
 
Tried this conversation over on the farming site last year, it just doesn't sink in.......

Agree with you, but not very many do.

Paul
 
Since it's our nature as humans, it won't go away until we do. However, animals have their problems of sort also. Just look at a feed trough with more than one animal present, or any animal in a field that is fenced. Look at some of the antics they contrive to get their mouth on the other side for sometimes less quality and quantity than they have in their own pasture.

Mark
 
Farming ain't the local church its a business(es)
where each segment is at times in direct competition with the other and even producers producing the same thing are in competition.Each has its ax to grind and then throw in the political aspect which we are all affected by whether you're into politics or not.There are winners and loosers.It ain't gonna be one big Ole Happy Family singing on a
hillside with all the farmers in the world.Generally speaking its usually the current winners that want everyone to get along and accept things as they are at that time.The loosers only get back to being winners by rocking the boat.
 
Well I really do not care who or what guys farm or get for their crop. Each of us has to run our own business.

I do care when the BTO are getting MILLIONS in government farm payments. One local fellow here 10 years ago would buy a farm each year with the government payment as his down payment.

The middle class has gotten beat up in the last 10-15 years. So they are not real happy to see tax dollars they have to pay going to some "poor" farmer driving a $50,000 pickup to town.

I disagree with the government payments AND the bankruptcy laws. Many of the BTOs around me have all filed some form of bankruptcy in the last 20 years. I think they will again with grain prices falling and inputs/rents still being high. So am I supposed to be happy that they can write off MILLION while I have PAID my bills with MONEY that I made without ANY government hand outs????

Another example of the way people are: There is a very large farm operation here close. In the last 5 years they have boughten $23 million dollars of land. They have a farm corporation that they where in with their father and now their sons. Some how they structured it so that now the Father is in the local nursing home on the government's dime. HE is on title 19 as he does not have any assets according to how they setup their corporation. It is funny when they started that farm corporation he had three farms that they started with. I do mean three farms that where paid for.

So they are messing the rest of us over BAD in several ways:

1) Their father is costing the rest of us tax payers $50K plus each year.

2) They mess around with with who the names of their crops are sold in so they can all draw the maximum government payments. It is ONE farming operation. It needs to be treated as ONE farming operation for payments.

3) If they go bankrupt AGAIN they should have to lose the ground they bought not be able to write it down to the value it will fall to in a few years. They gave $15k and acre so why should they get to write it down to $5-7K per acre in bankruptcy???? The last time they bid $2500 in 1980 and then got it wrote down to $750 in 1985 with Farm Credit having to take the loss. They did not lose ONE single farm they bought.


So to sum it up. IF you have honestly EARNED what you have and are doing then I have ZERO problem with it but if you have lied and swindled to get there then I DO have a problem with it.
 
Yes i miss the way it was before the govt stepped in .the small town and small farmers that helped every body out. i can still remember harvest time going from one farm to the next.
as far as govt payments look up ewg .org
my last thought govt farming didnt work for russia
 
I agree. Its interesting to see the cycles. It seams there is always one form of farming that is making money, its just which one. The last few years it was the grain guys, while the cattle and dairy guys suffer due to high feed costs. Now the dairy and cattle(ME) guys are doing ok, and the grain guys are suffering. I have a saying "Its your turn to take one for the team." I took one for the team with high feed prices, now its my time to make some $$. Give it a few years, and it will be the grain guys time to make some bucks. Its a just part of the cycle/game.
 
People are "funny". They always have been and they always will be. Sometimes jealousy and greed drive both sides of the conversation. My wife and I went to visit a guy who was on his death bed, and he was delighted to have recently learned that his neighbor was losing his place. It really cheered him up - and the guy was dead two days later. You gotta admit, there's something sick about that.
 
I am 71 years old. I have seen our nation change from mostly agricultural to manufacturing then to present service-oriented. It seems that although many of us long for the "good old days" of less stress and competition, I do not think that is the prevailing opinion of most folks. There is animosity and misunderstanding of the trade unions that created to middle class during our manufacturing era and also of farmers who city folk blame for creating high costs of food products and impinging on their suburban life style in their new housing development (which used to be a hay field).
Add to that the divided and often toxic nature of our present day politics and you come up with the culture of distrust and outright animosity even among farmers.
 
A percentage of people just aren't happy....NOTHING can make them happy. Rather than accept the fact they have issues that are of no fault of anyone else, they see it as therapeutic when they slam anyone who does things different than they do.

99 times in 100, the chronic whiners complain because things aren't done THEIR way, when their way serves only a handful, if that many. And they complain AFTER the fact, rather than offering good advice BEFORE hand.

Then there's those who are just stuck in a time long ago. Here's a news flash. It will never be yesterday again. Today isn't perfect, and there will be troubles to work around tomorrow. You man up and deal with what REALITY hands you.

A wise man takes what he has and makes the most of it. A moron simply whines about what he wishes the worlds should have been in his mind.
 
And don't forget the little guy the produce farmer. No guberment payments and the same costs of doing business. Used to be that folks went to the farmers market to get the freshest and best grown produce around. Not anymore. They come looking for a cheap price. Quality doesn't matter much anymore. When somebody looks at your best corn and beans and then says they can buy it cheaper at the grocery store, that's the biggest slap in the face you can get. Where's the incentive for the next generation?
 
My thoughts exactly. I have no issue with anyone making money from hard work or investments combined with hard work. My issue is with Government handouts or subsidies of any kind.

I graduated from a University with a degree in Economics. For 4 years I was told free market economy works! I'm not sure how they know that b/c the govt. has never let us find out! They've always got their thumb on every little thing!
 
I agree with what you say but i remember when you do nothing you do something .i dont like big cooperatee farms there are some that are probably ok and im fine with the guys that worked for what the got .
So saying that i would like to tell you what i do if a weekend farmer or young kids starting im there time money manchery etc .big factory farms that are muscling in im there to stop them . we had one try and come in promised all the builders they would get paid on the completion of the project .guess what happened when the project wasnt completed .
 
Please BTOs and others,read the contents of the link below and tell us if 1.6 million acres in the hands of one operator is; too little, too much or about right?
Commie BTO
 
Many good points in your post.

I find it interesting, that many people that complain loudly about the freeloaders in our system are also working the system for all it is worth. Examples, like the asset transfer to avoid nursing home charges, and getting their kids on disability, or their daughters "no Daddy" kids on medicare. We all see it in our communities all the time.

Another example is the guys that want "no government intervention"...except for the tax breaks and subsidies for their own industry.

Talk is easy, walking it is the proof.
 
Your link will not open. Anyhow, 1.6 million acres in the hands of one BTO for the US is too much. Sure that BTO will provide jobs but lets not forget that same BTO will strive for efficiency so long term he will be trying to trim his labor back. Also, the pay scale will be low enough that there will be an income gap to be filled. No matter how you slice it there are only a certain number of jobs to be filled. It used to be employers found value in all age groups but now they put anybody over age 50 in a very undesirable light. Some people are already left in the cold and more people are joining their ranks every day. Sure a number of people could try harder but going back for more education is not solving everybody's problems plus it just is not true that somebody such as WalMart is going to absorb every displaced worker. Our economic philosophy is not taking into account the social problems it creates. Eighteenth Century France and Twentieth Century Russia found out what happens when too many people do not feel an investment in the then current system of each country.
 
“There are many fine things we cannot say if we have to shout.”
¯ Henry David Thoreau,

You'll have to forgive me for being in a Thoreau philosophical mood today. My problem isn't with the operations of the BTO or the organic operator,it's with some of the operators themselves. I have good friends at both extremes,but I have big problems with some folks at both extremes too.

I laugh right along with my BTO friends who say that according to MSU I shouldn't even exist. I don't take it as a criticism of my way of doing things,but as laughing at the academics who think they can tell us what we have to do to make a living. I do have a problem with those who think if I don't farm on a large scale that I'm somehow less a man. To be honest,those who think that aren't liked by the other BTOs either.

If somebody wants to live the way they think "nature intended",that's fine if it's their own belief and they enjoy it. My problem is with those who are just following a fad like a religion. If you have to promote what you produce by claiming what I do will kill somebody and that I'm OK with that as long as it makes money for me,I have a huge problem with you.

Give me a laid back old hippy with a hoe,working in his own garden any day over some loud,vocal extremist on either end of the spectrum any day.
 
I don't care what you do for a living I just don't believe in free government money give it what name you'd like.or give all people who work free money,equal rights not special rights.You ask for it I gave it to you. If you can't make it farming without the govement ad get another job,dont take tax payers money.
 
(quoted from post at 05:55:23 01/15/14) Why is it the farmer makes a few dollars and we all get upset and jealous of him? City folk as well as country folk.

But back in the 80's we didn't care how many went broke. Or the farmers that struggled to raise a family since then.

I've been through it all. Low and high prices of grains and livestock.

There are farmers who want to raise certain crops without GMO's. There are those who want to raise without chemicals or man made fertilizers.

That is all fine but don't condemn the way most are farming.

Even the livestock farmers were upset with the grain farmers the past few years. Now the livestock farmers are doing well and that is great. They deserve it.

We are all farming to make a living and do what we want to do. Do it the way you want but don't condemn the others.

The mega farms had to get there some how. Maybe you and I should have followed in there footsteps and gotten there as well.

Take advantage of the opportunity's available to you and when you think the others are getting more than you, then do what they are doing to get it or don't complain.

Gary
Click to expand...

Gary: I think where the problem here is that someone ask a question and folks tried to answer that question . The OP and several others then started to try to ridicule those who don't farm the way they do or at least think it should be done. It degenerated from there.

Rick
 
Earlier I unsuccessfully posted the link: "Commie BTO", let's try to cut and past this: http://www.startribune.com/business/239924611.html
 
I can honestly say I don't care what anyone else makes or does. I have a TO-30 tractor, a two-row planter, a $40.00 grain drill, a disc, a two-bottom plow, a brush hog,and a few home-made tools for leveling. I plant about 2-3 acres of food plots, rotate crops, and build habitat for rabbits. I am having the time of my life and am happier than I have ever been. I love being tied to the land, even if I never make a dime, unless it's from training someone else's beagle.

Larry
 
I agree with JD completely. Let's get the government out of AG,and every other small business. Did you see Mike Lee's stack of regulations compared with laws passed by congress.
BUT, Let's start with welfare recipients, they unlike BTO's contribute nothing to society to get their money. YEA RIGHT, like that's gonna happen. Until that happens, get your share of the dole, if you don't get it they're only gonna give it to NYC to buy condoms for 5th graders, Did you ever notice there is no mention of the United States in the book of Revelation. Criticize me if you want, I won't fight back your entitled to your opinion just as I am.
Mike Lee
 
JD- to address your 3 points:

1- Same rules apply to all- short answer, if you divest yourself of assets at least 5 years before going to Shady Rest Nursing Home, your stay there will be on the State. In the corporation, all anyone owns is shares, and I'm sure he gifted his shares to his kids long ago. And they worked out some arrangement whereby he lived in a corporation-owned house for free, and got a monthly stipend for as long as he lived there. So he has no assets, and no income once he moves to the nursing home.

2- Don't know much about how the farm programs are administered, but legislation is needed to get to the real structure, not the smoke and mirrors that folks with intertwining corporations routinely use to swindle the guvment.

3- I haven't done bankruptcies for about 10 years, but I think Chapter 12 (farm bankruptcy) is gone, so no write-down this time. I'm in agreement with writing down the debt to value of the collateral and discharging the rest, but only if the property is given to the creditor, not retained by the debtor.
 
No. Because of tax dollars wasted like this- NY just announced 20 million dollars for dairy farmers who turn waste into energy. 2 million maximum per project.
 
I have always lived in town. Grandpa farmed, I cannot remember a day I did not want to farm, never figured out a way! My farmer friend drives me crazy complaining about the economy-then goes on vacation, buys 2 custom toy tractor display cabinets from me! I have not gone on a week long vacation in 20 years! This year we plan on going to DC for a week!
 
(quoted from post at 11:47:46 01/15/14) Big time operator.
A relative term when compared to your own operation.
Click to expand...


Love the way you put that and so true! I've got a friend, considered to be a BTO by many in our area. GMO crops only and all grain operation. He complains about the BTO's 40 miles west of us who crop 2-3 times or more land than he does, but he's one of the biggest operators in a 15-20 miles area.

Rick
 
Well stated; a lot of well stated opinions on this topic from all view-points. I'd come from how do we feed the biggest human population to have ever lived at the same time on the planet and still have independence to get it done in our own way???
 
I could not have said it better myself Gary. Truth of it is I got really tired of all the hatred and negativity towards a bigger farmer on here I just quit following this site for a while. Farming is a business pure and simple. With any business there are some big business and some smaller business that both take advantage of things sometimes. People should consider that big or small without farmers you dont eat. I myself at the end of last year decided to cut back on my acres and take a job workin in town to have good health insurance and retirement and make it easier on my wife and I by being a part time farmer.
 
(quoted from post at 16:20:29 01/15/14) I could not have said it better myself Gary. Truth of it is I got really tired of all the hatred and negativity towards a bigger farmer on here I just quit following this site for a while. Farming is a business pure and simple. With any business there are some big business and some smaller business that both take advantage of things sometimes. People should consider that big or small without farmers you dont eat. I myself at the end of last year decided to cut back on my acres and take a job workin in town to have good health insurance and retirement and make it easier on my wife and I by being a part time farmer.
Click to expand...

I don't have a problem with anyone's operation no matter the size. I do have a problem with being ridiculed for doing what I believe in. And there is the problem. Both on here and in our local area. We have bigger operators here trying to squeeze the little guy out so there is more land available for them and folks on here who just have to ridicule anything that doesn't follow what they are doing.

Rick
 
Every so often an old saying comes to mind. It's a few words that are part of a much longer philosophical writing. The words go: [u:dba9d4fe75]Those who compare themselves with others oft become vain and bitter.[/u:dba9d4fe75] So true! Jim
 
If a farmer has an operation of any size,he has a 24/7 job. How the heck is he going to hold another job? And if you mean quit farming and get another job, well, that won't work either. I'm not saying that free govt. money is always the way to go, but if the govt. can spread money to other countries like spreading horse manure,then they can dang well help our farmers who are trying to feed your face!
 
(quoted from post at 22:20:17 01/15/14) If a farmer has an operation of any size,he has a 24/7 job. How the heck is he going to hold another job? And if you mean quit farming and get another job, well, that won't work either. I'm not saying that free govt. money is always the way to go, but if the govt. can spread money to other countries like spreading horse manure,then they can dang well help our farmers who are trying to feed your face!
Click to expand...

Well if that's the case there is nothing wrong with welfare or giving subsidies to oil and gas companies is there?

Rick
 
(quoted from post at 23:17:52 01/15/14)
(quoted from post at 22:20:17 01/15/14) If a farmer has an operation of any size,he has a 24/7 job. How the heck is he going to hold another job? And if you mean quit farming and get another job, well, that won't work either. I'm not saying that free govt. money is always the way to go, but if the govt. can spread money to other countries like spreading horse manure,then they can dang well help our farmers who are trying to feed your face!
Click to expand...

Well if that's the case there is nothing wrong with welfare or giving subsidies to oil and gas companies is there?

Rick
Click to expand...

Yup, agree 100% Rick. One of my favorite sayings is "If you rob Peter to pay Paul, you'll never hear Paul complain!" and that's the truth of it. IMO it doesn't matter if it's subsidizing farmers, welfare, foreign aid, pork barrel sidewalks and libraries and highways, grants (pork) to every squeaky wheel around, Medicaid, rebuilding New Orleans or New Jersey or anything else! What it comes down to is the gov't in whatever form is taking money out of your pocket and mine, assuming you work or ever worked, and using it as they see fit to provide a whole lot more than essential services. I essence, every dime of that money becomes no more than campaign funding for whatever politician gets his hands on it. "I got a grant from Senator Lardbottom! What a guy!" or "President Suckup and his party got me a much better Farm Bill than the other guy!". It's wrong in every way I can think of, but we're all so apathetic about it that we don't complain.

Every penny is you get is coming out of someone elses pocket.
 
An ofter misused phrase today is "creates more jobs". You hear it everyday and most folks say yes. Expanded farming does not create more jobs for farmers in this country. More acreage simply means bigger machines. More jobs really means the equipment manufactures in other country's like China, France, India etc. Where was that diesel engine in your tractor manufactured ? Who made the tires? You get the idea. The manufactures do not pour money into the US treasury but the government continues to give out subsidies. There is something very wrong with this idea according to economics 101.
 
Govt money out of our pockets you are so
right on target and so few see it . i always
laugh at the people who brag about there tax
refunds dont they realise they just loaned
there money to the govt at 0 % intrest and not
even a thank you
 
(quoted from post at 05:20:22 01/16/14)
(quoted from post at 23:17:52 01/15/14)
(quoted from post at 22:20:17 01/15/14) If a farmer has an operation of any size,he has a 24/7 job. How the heck is he going to hold another job? And if you mean quit farming and get another job, well, that won't work either. I'm not saying that free govt. money is always the way to go, but if the govt. can spread money to other countries like spreading horse manure,then they can dang well help our farmers who are trying to feed your face!
Click to expand...

Well if that's the case there is nothing wrong with welfare or giving subsidies to oil and gas companies is there?

Rick
Click to expand...


Yup, agree 100% Rick. One of my favorite sayings is "If you rob Peter to pay Paul, you'll never hear Paul complain!" and that's the truth of it. IMO it doesn't matter if it's subsidizing farmers, welfare, foreign aid, pork barrel sidewalks and libraries and highways, grants (pork) to every squeaky wheel around, Medicaid, rebuilding New Orleans or New Jersey or anything else! What it comes down to is the gov't in whatever form is taking money out of your pocket and mine, assuming you work or ever worked, and using it as they see fit to provide a whole lot more than essential services. I essence, every dime of that money becomes no more than campaign funding for whatever politician gets his hands on it. "I got a grant from Senator Lardbottom! What a guy!" or "President Suckup and his party got me a much better Farm Bill than the other guy!". It's wrong in every way I can think of, but we're all so apathetic about it that we don't complain.

Every penny is you get is coming out of someone elses pocket.
Click to expand...


Bret, I've been trying to tell people for years that subsidies, both business and AG, earned income, child care credits and welfare is just a legal way to buy votes.

Rick
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

2
Mixed fleet antifreeze recommendations
Replies
8
Views
437
4play
4
S
Combine operation
Replies
17
Views
517
moresmoke
M
jon f mn
My local feed mill
2
Replies
28
Views
2K
JWinIndiana
J
A
Tractor Seat Recommendation
Replies
8
Views
887
Axtell
A
Geo-TH,In
The older I get!
Replies
11
Views
382
Texasmark
T
Tractor Parts Tractor Manuals

We sell tractor parts! We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today.

Copyright © 1997-2024 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters
Website Accessibility Policy

Back
Top