Silverado 2500HD

What worthless engineer decided you need to loosen/remove grille on 2008 2500HD with Duramax to change the left hand high beam head light?? The 2003 2500HD you just have to pull a pin or two to remove whole headlight assembly to change bulb. Engineer must not have had to try this. IF there is an easier way, please fill me in.

LOL, I am one of those blankity blank engineers, and I often have similar comments about equipment that I decide to fix.

So I blame things on the accountant who told the engineer he had to reduce the cost of the truck by 50 cents.

Regards
Rich

I know what you are saying Rich, I have a family member that works for GM and he always talks about making things a few cents cheaper. Just a rant since I just did this and seemed like a hard way to change a headlight to me.

Before I read the other post, I was going to say my '91 K1500 is that way. You have to take the grille off to get to the headlights.

The first one I did gave me a fit... :evil: I will say they did make the radiator support so it comes out and it sure nuff helps if you have to work on the front of the engine are to pull it...
Book time to change a blub is 0.8 I charge 1 hr. and earn it...

As my dad always said, if the engineers had to work on or fix the crap they design, they wouldent design it that way, since they don't work on it, they don't care.

1989 Toyota 2x4 pick up. The first thing to remove to change a headlight---front bumper, then the grill, then you can take out the screws that hold the headlight. (I still own the truck)
I put plastic ones back in because they would not break, just burn out.
I quoted $150.00 labor to a customer, and two weeks later he was back and said the next one to burn out he would pay the $150.00

On the new ford trucks you have to remove the cab to work on the engine.

I would like to get hold of one of'em so I could retire of'n it...

My '89 Silverado 1500 is the same way...must be a generational/nepotism thing at GM

Oldsmobile made some where the rear bumper had to come off to change a taillight bulb. Not to defend the engineers (or GM) but it's more the guy that designs the headlight doesn't or can't talk to the guy that designs the grill or the guy that allocates the real estate under he hood. The engineers are given allocations of space, weight & cost, then the stylists give them a design to adhere to they have to make everything fit within what they're given. And I thought I had it rough 'cause on one of our cars I have to pull the battery to get to the RH headlight bulb, and the bumper to change the whole light assembly.

I've worked on quite a few vehicles here (OZ) and your side.

And the only one that looks to have seriously thought about the mechanic that comes after the factory is a 1981 Alfa Romeo Alfetta. There is always just enough room - though sometimes you need the workshop manual to find it.

Yeah I had an 05 thought that headlight set-up was the smartest thing anyone had done in a long time, now have a 13 and was pi$$ed to find you have to take half the truck apart just to plug in the wiring harness for the snowplow lights.

Oldest girls 05 Trailblazer headlight bulb change requires removing grill too. That never goes well in our cold weather. Of course I had to search for a Trailblazer website forum to figure out how to get to it since it's not covered in owners manual at all.

My F250 is same way.

I just have to respond to this. I am an engineer and have had this same conversation with my dad about why did the engineer put something somewhere on a piece of farm equipment.
1. The engineer didn't design it for the guy running old equipment and trying to fix it himself. He designed it for the guy buying it new. I have never seen my dad think about maintenance when he bought something new and I don't think he would spend more money to buy something that is easier to maintain.
2. Not all parts can be put in a perfectly accessible spot. So when you are complaining about the hard to get stuff look at all of the stuff that is easy to get to and compliment that.
3. Most new things like cars or tractors are not 100% designed from ground up. The design evolves over time keeping some old things and adding new designs. This leads to less than perfect solutions.
4. Things are not made to be maintained (taken apart). They are made to be assembled and built at the lowest cost.

I had a company issued 2008 3500 Chevy duramax. We owned five total.
I did the maintenance on mine at home and changed the bulb on driver"s side in 15 minutes.
One day walking into our shop, the guys had the grill out and all tore up.
I asked what they were doing and started laughing.
All you need is a extended handle long reach needlenose pliers.
And a thin long handle screwdriver.
Use both hands reach in and twist build from top use screwdriver for final nudge.
pop old bulb out and reinstall.
Or if you have a small hand loosen battery slide over and remove bulb no need to remove grill.
really not bad to change

Since you have to comment, it makes me want to comment. One of the most perfect examples I can think of is my 6400 John Deere. It was designed by a mad, Bavarian puzzle maker. The electrical connector under the deck took me two days to cut apart with a Dremel tool after it melted and I had to replace it. Terrible location, and designed to try to do ten things at the same time- but could have been much simpler and just as workable. The hole that the AC line, along with about twenty other lines and cables, near the rear of the engine compartment could have been a bit bigger to facilitate repairs. As it was, it was barely big enough to accomodate what was in there. The newer versions later were bigger. But the real pain was cheap fuel lines from the tank to the injector pump. They deteriorated in less than ten years. And, they were routed from under the left deck, around the rear of a hot engine, to a filter on the right side on the engine behind a piece of trim that made it difficult to replace the fuel filter. Then the line ran back around the rear of the engine again to the injector pump on the left side of the engine. I made a new bracket that fit on the left side of the engine, made the filter simple to get to,and rerouted the lines to the left side of the engine, eliminating about five feet of rubber hose in the process.

This kind of stuff should have never made it from the testing stage to the production stage, which is why I think engineers should work on this kind of stuff BEFORE it is produced and sold to the general public....

Step back and look at it. How do you think it was built in the factory? I would bet the whole dash was assembled off to the side and brought to the tractor. It was designed to be built at the lowest cost. Also realize the engineering team who designed it had a budget and timeline. They probably got a lot more right than wrong. You also mentioned it lasted 10 years. How long do you think prototypes are tested for? Pretty hard to simulate 10 years wear and tear in a months worth of testing. Every machine ever built has some part that will break first. The whole machine does not just fall apart at the same time. No one knows what that weak link is until the machine is used for a period time. The engineer did not know and had no way of knowing that the fuel lines where going to be a weak link. There are plenty of other hard to access and fix things on that tractor they just are not the weak link. Also consider that the parts you are complaining about might have been a common parts for another tractor or combine where it worked out very well. Common parts lower costs. Common parts also allow stocking of spare parts. You have to understand the total design criteria the engineers had to meet. It is more than what you see on your tractor.

Another thing about that bad fuel line. The engineer put together a general specification for the fuel line. It went to purchasing who put it out to bid to suppliers. The supplier then selected a fuel line that they said would meet the requirements. The supplier picked the lowest cost option they had that they thought would meet the specification. Chances are the mistake is on the fuel line supplier side not John Deere's engineering. The engineer might have reviewed the selection but in the end the engineer has to rely heavily on what the supplier is telling them.

Like it or not, Duane is correct. The end product is almost always designed to be easiest and cheapest to assemble is the assembly plants as that is where the manufacturer will make their money. Often things are routed such that whole assembles can be bolted in an entire modular design. (I bet that fuel line routing made total sense for installing whatever part of the tractor was installed as an entire assembly).

Ease of service is usually a total afterthought and will be paid by the end consumer regardless of whether it is cheap and easy - or alternatively hard and expensive. Since service is not a profit making item for the original manufacturer then there is little thought given to it. Service is usually only a profit making item for the dealer when paid by the end consumer. Dealer's usually hate warranty work service as those prices are always pre-arranged between the dealer and the original manufacturer and thus little profit in it for the dealer so they do not like it.

Funny all of this "lowest cost" and making something a "few cents cheaper" doesn't lead to lower cost vehicles. The prices of everything has skyrocketed. Who would have ever thought they would see the prices of pickups today?