What the heck??

Goose

Well-known Member
A couple of weeks ago, I ran an underground electrical line to a new shop building that's a work in progress.

What I did, was had the local power company move the meter for the old/current shop to a transformer pole located approximately midway between the two buildings, about a hundred feet from both. I then abandoned the old underground line to the old shop and trenched new underground lines from the meter to each shop, 4 guage to the old shop and 2 guage to the new building.

Everything worked great, power to the breaker box in the new building as expected, and power same as ever to the old shop. Until today I went to the old shop and had no lights.

I tracked it down, and found one line from the meter to the shop was dead when it should have been hot. Checked at the box under the meter and all was as it should be. So how can a new length of 4 guage underground stranded wire that has had nothing done to it except unrolled into a trench, and run through 1 1/4" PVC conduit on each end, have proper electricity fed into it on one end and be dead on the other? Particularly since it worked fine for a couple of weeks? Damage doesn't seem possible since that stuff is so tough it takes a bolt cutter to cut it.

I'll think about it overnight.
 
(quoted from post at 20:26:52 11/20/13) A couple of weeks ago, I ran an underground electrical line to a new shop building that's a work in progress.

What I did, was had the local power company move the meter for the old/current shop to a transformer pole located approximately midway between the two buildings, about a hundred feet from both. I then abandoned the old underground line to the old shop and trenched new underground lines from the meter to each shop, 4 guage to the old shop and 2 guage to the new building.

Everything worked great, power to the breaker box in the new building as expected, and power same as ever to the old shop. Until today I went to the old shop and had no lights.

I tracked it down, and found one line from the meter to the shop was dead when it should have been hot. Checked at the box under the meter and all was as it should be. So how can a new length of 4 guage underground stranded wire that has had nothing done to it except unrolled into a trench, and run through 1 1/4" PVC conduit on each end, have proper electricity fed into it on one end and be dead on the other? Particularly since it worked fine for a couple of weeks? Damage doesn't seem possible since that stuff is so tough it takes a bolt cutter to cut it.

I'll think about it overnight.
personally would start by looking at connections on each end.
 
Did it look good or did you dig in there and check tightness? I had part of the living room that was randomly dead. Turns out the feed (through an outlet) looked tight enough and right but it was not. Tightened it and all was good. Change in temp could have made it angry.
 
And I did check the tightness of all of the connections on both ends. Also shut off the breaker box in the new building to eliminate any possible cause from that end.
 
long time ago i was working for a company installing background music in a building. got through and nothing worked, no sound to any speaker at all. turned out the cable was bad off the roll. even a 6 inch piece of cable was shorted. brand new. I would check all of the connections from the meter to the building and be sure they are tight. if no luck then check each leg for continuity.
 
Goose If you want e-mail me a phone number and I will tell you how an old guy had me check the underground wire. Slick trick but takes more than I want to type. jm. just click on my name e mail open
 
Interesting part is, it worked fine yesterday morning, and when working this afternoon I got a freshly charged battery off the charger for a cordless drill and the battery was still warm from charging. Whatever shut it off must have just happened.

Next step, as I see it, is to get another single wire, maybe 6 or 4 guage, long enough, patch it across and see if everything lights up like it should. Then, too, by disconnecting both ends of the dead leg, I could connect another wire to one end and check for continuity with an ohm meter.
 
I think jm. knows a way to check it with a small gas engine sparking plug(running) and an AM radio. Supposed to work really well. Safe, etc.
 
Good place to use a non-contact tester. It doesn't have to touch a bare hot conductor to indicate voltage. Check both hot wires near the supply breaker, then at the building panel input. If you have voltage at the supply, and not at the input to the building panel, you have an open wire somewhere in between. I would personally suspect a bad connection in one of the panels before looking for an open conductor, so double check that first. Be sure that the connections are good. Even though the screws/bolts are tight the connection may be loose if not properly made up.
 
I had something similar happen to me a few years back. The wire was broken when I pulled it through the conduit. It would touch and give a voltage reading, but lamps, saws, shopvacs, etc. wouldn't work. The break was acting as a self resetting fuse. I lost a bit of hair diagnosing that problem.
 
Almost certainly bad connections. Assuming the cables are aluminum, did you coat the ends with anti-oxidant and work it in good with a wire brush? Retighten everything. Your voltmeter will not lie, but be careful about measurements made with no electrical load. Turn on some lights in your shop before you try to find the bad connection.
 
had the same problem. was tiling for neighbor and had to put a pit and pump to make system work.put a #2 3 wire in with a 4" tile in a 6" boot and ran up to his shop and wired it in. was about a 1000ft run. worked for a week then quit. one wire didn't carry juice. used the other 2 wires (110v)worked for another week. got blamed for poor instlation. finally had to call electrition, he could put a signal on the wires and locate the short under ground within 6 in. we spliced that wire 8 times, and finallyfound that the wire was deafective (alumunim).it didn't have the pvc around the wire in some places,found a defective piece that wasn't buried, took pictures of every splice and sent to the company.i paid $1200 for the wire and they sent me $500 to dig and splice the wire and $500 for the electrican. the wire has worked for the last 3 years. I was about at my wits end by the 7-8 splice. wire wasm bought at menards along with the splice kits
 
I did the exact thing when running power to my house, the cable coming in was not spliced inside the the cover, had power on one leg and not the other
 
The wire does not go bad by itself. Something has to damage it. If you are testing correctly [best way would be to take the leads off the lugs ,bug them together then go to the other end and place the continuity light on that side , eliminating any connection problems like no penetrox oxidized ends etc.. If you have no continuity then the wire was possibly damaged during the pull and a small insulation nick which is laying in muddy water has bubbled enough to eat itself up. Could be someone stepped on it and a sharp rock was under it or the pipe edge scraped it or the handling from the supply house. But somewhere the insulation got breached and once you pull it back out you will see the problem. .All pipes get filled with water that I have ever seen.
It is called tracking and it has to do with ions.
 
If you did not run the cable inside conduit all the way, I bet a stone has worked it's way thru the cable already. I always use direct bury cable, but put it inside solid drain tile. I have seen way too many lines get ruined by stones. Much cheaper to add solid drain tile than to replace cable.
 

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