Getting new people started in grain farming

I might be digging up old graves here but I would like to talk about the future of farming. First I will start off with my story and how I am getting started in farming. My background in farming is somewhat extensive for someone that did not grow up with parents farming. My grandfather however farmed up until 10 years ago which I helped him during my early childhood. I also worked on various other farms around the area in my early and mid 20's. I am now 30 years old and have decided that its now or never to take over my grandpas 200 acres. I have been reading horror stories about beginning farmers trying to get started, and how they "better have a good bankruptcy lawyer". But on the other hand there are farmers telling me that I am very lucky to have this opportunity and that thousands of people would kill to be in my shoes. Why the mixed feelings from you guys? Trying to get a straight answer is near impossible when your a beginning farmer. You could ask 100 different farmers a question about getting started and a new farmer will get 100 different answers.

So being young and inexperienced on the business side of farming, a guy like me becomes confused. I ask myself daily if I am making the right decision by jumping into this from scratch. I work full time and will continue to work full time while farming on the side. I would be happy if I could just break even every year but have been told that I should be able to do better then that! I bought myself a good tractor, an old drill, and a couple tillage implements. The land is not premium high quality land but I am not paying top dollar cash rent for it either.

I have figured its going to cost about $440 an acre to plant soybeans with rent included. So I am right on the line here as far as crop insurance goes. If I can stay covered at 40 bushels an acre at an $11 market average guaranteed income I should break even on a bad year. This is how I am managing my risk.

It seems like the farmers I talk to in real life are all for what I am getting in to. But on the other hand you internet chair jockey farmers are very negative; so what gives? I have decided to find out for myself no matter the mixed signals I have been getting. I have already got soil tests done and bought my seed for next year so there is no turning back now. The soil tests came back pretty good. I am in pretty decent shape, just need a little lime here and there and some potash here and there. So this is it I am going for it. Win or lose at least I tried right? I am going to try protecting myself with crop insurance by not over spending what I am covered for and if I break even the first three or so years well I could sell my equipment and back out hopefully free of debt. I could see how someone trying to farm full time would be in a lot worse situation then me. But since I am doing it on the side trying to make a couple extra bucks or at least break even it cant be so bad right?

The uncertainties of farming keep some of the BTO's up at night; just think how us beginning farmers feel, we are all really shaking in our boots... What it comes down to is it really should be easier then this, but the reality of it is, one of the toughest things a person could try to do is get started farming from scratch. Its been a rough road for me so far, fixing up old equipment and sponging every second of my free time trying to learn everything I can about this business. It takes a true gambler with a rock hard poker face to do what us young pups are doing. Good luck to all other people out there that are in my shoes.

Old farmer here told me nobody hates a farmer succeeding more
than another farmer, and from what I've seen its sort of true.

I say if your numbers are good go for it. If you have full time
work remember what your priorities are, it would be hard to
replace a job with farm income from 200 acres of grain in many
areas so don't get yourself fired chasing a few hundred $.

I'm in a similar situation only with hay. Its taken almost 10 years
to absorb the startup costs. I'd recommend avoiding big
investment up front. Hire the combining out etc. Big fixed costs
up front aren't good and big repair bills on expensive assets will
kill your cash flows.

You can make money farming, no one seems to want to admit it, but you can. You sound like you have inherited the 200 acres from your grandpa? Or will you lease it? Or leasing other ground? Buy used equipment, good used, search craigslist and auctions for good deals. Contract grain prices up front once in a while to make sure you can get out your input costs every year. Keep a budget, dont try to grow too fast. Use good seed, fertility, and you will have good crops provided it rains. I havent bought crop insurance, doesnt seem to pay when it rains, and didnt pay in drought of 12" where i am at. I know many farmers who go without it.

How much is your rent? My soys cost about 160 to put in per acre.

You have an opportunity to get started- jump on it.
Build slowly, and build well. Used iron is cheaper.
New paint costs less than new steel, at least until
you can afford it. If Grandpop wants to get out,
offer to buy him out, and give him a fair price.
It's his retirement. But, he may also help you out
for quite a while after he retires. And listen to
him. If he's been in the business for a long time,
he's not dumb. Learn from him- it's how he stayed
in. Good luck.

To answer some of your questions, I have not inherited the land. Down the the road I will be inheriting a 1/4 of it. I am paying 186 an acre cash rent. Grandpa has been retired for the last 10 years and a different farmer has been renting it ever since. How are your inputs so low tractormialis? $160? man I paid half that an acre for just seed. I bought triple stack seed and since im drilling at 170,000 population its gonna cost me about $80 an acre.

You can do it if you can shop wise and have a nose for a good old piece of equipment , ya know how to repair what ever come up , you have a decent shop that you can work in in the bad weather and you have the tools to work with . so if your going to grain faarm what do you need ?? are you going to go NO TILL Min. till or tillage . Fuel costs are the killer with tillage . Time factor is another with working away . I did it for awhile and i really did not own the equipment so to speak . I had one tractor that i owned a junk plow that i bought for 200 bucks a junk 370 I H disc and a really good 1240 J D platless planter . I became a seed corn saleman and got my seed at cost anything else was needed it got bought used and sold as i was also jockying equipment along with fixing tractors . as for a combine i got hung with a Maseey 300 that i bought at a sale and was hoping to make four or five hundred bucks on over what i had in it including trucking . Well lets just say that it was a tuition payment in jockying iron as after running it thru five sales and never having a bid on it i was stuck with it . A buddy and i were at a sale in In. and i saw him buying these Massey two row corn heads for four to seven BUCKS . Yea they were the old style and when i asked him why he told me that scrap was two hundred bucks a ton and they weighted in at about a ton and a half . Then it hit me hey wait that will fit on that massey so i bought one , dang i had to out bid my buddy and i had to give seven dollars and fifty cents for mine . when i got it home i had to do some work on it and the replacement parts were high , I swapped my junk parts for good parts off the heads my buddy bought . I mounted that head on the 300 Massey . OK time is getting close to do corn . I made a comment to one of my tractor customers to the fact that if he knew of anybody that may want a field opened up or some small acres shelled to give me a call. Well he end up calling me with close to 80 acres to shell and i got 24 bucks and acre . I left the combine at his place over night and was going to go do my corn the next day. While i was fueling up and going over it a neighbor asked me if i could do his 86 acres , so up the road we went . finished that up and the guy across the road asked me to do his . My 650 dollar screw up along with the seven dollar and fifty cent head had already paid for it's self and was making money . The next year i was at a sale and i bid on a 1805 Massey got it for 4250 bucks gave a grand to have it hauled home . Put three batterys in it refilled the master cylinder with brake fluid and it was fine . the next week i ought a set of Massey 880 hyd. resets they were 8 bottom onland for 200 bucks . I took them to the farm i was renting . Told the wife that as soon as i was done with service calls monday i was going to the farm and start plowing . Now this was the first time for me with a tractor that big with a plow that big on a farm with field that small (big field was 10.2 acres , the small field was 3.2 acres ) set into plowing at around 6 pm and was home at the house 19 miles up the road by 10:45 . Wife asked me if i was going to be plowing the rest of the week , NOPE DONE , what i am DONE . The year before it took me and my trusty old ratty 706 with four bottoms five evening to plow that farm . I borrowed a disc off another Jocky to disc it with the Massey and that 24 footer with the harrow on the back did the job in one pass where my 370 I H would have required two to three . Now the dumb thing i did was sell the Massey and plows , yea they made money and the guy that bought the massey he was a BTO he farmed a whoppen 185 acres and he worked away . He also became a good customer of mine , not on the Massey but his herd of Olivers . The Massey came out of the shed in the spring he filled the tank on it hooked to his 11 shank chisel and went at it . Then he would hook to the field cultivator and the tillage was done and back into the shed till next year. some years i would go thru a hald dozen tractors before i could get done as i was selling them out of the field . Found no better way to sell a used tractor then let the prospective buyer roll some dirt with it . So if you can fine a good barginnd you can fix the LITTLE stuff and make a good machine out of it use it and sell for a LITTLE profit as you DO NOT HAVE TO MARRY it for life . I use to buy a lot of I H tractors out of the dead row or snatch up the one running with bad T/A's . I am good at putting them in and it does not take that long to do if you are set up to do them as i could have three apart at the same time on three different splitting stands , with no interruptions two days in and out New clutch rebuilt T/A new MCV pump valve body spring kit new PTO input shaft. and a Warranty .

You mentioned drilling at 170,000. The term drilling refers to soybeans. A population of 170,000 would be soybeans. You should be able to buy roundup ready soybeans for around $40.00 a bag. Roughly a bag an acre, slightly more depending on seed size. It shouldn't be anywhere near $80 an acre. You mentioned triple stack seed .... that would be corn. Maybe you meant to say 30,000 popluation for corn and the cost would be roughly $80 an acre???

The seed is RR2 treated fungicide, insecticide, and votivo. It was $64 a bag 170,000 population is 1.3 roughly bags an acre. So roughly cost me $80 an acre. And yes soybeans.

I didn"t start till I was in my forty"s also on my grandparents place. This is what I discovered.
1) You really need a mentor--sounds like your grandpa"s going to fill that slot. For me it was a second cousin that lived next door and had farmed the place after my grandfather and uncle died.
2) If your married make sure she"s on board cause you"re going to spend a lot of nights farming.
3) You need an outside source of income as a backup. Sound like you have that since you are continuing to work off farm.
4) Try really hard not to go into debt. Those payments don"t stop when the crops don"t produce and that"s where a lot of guys fall down. It gets hard but it will work.
5) Finally keep your eye on the goal--don"t get distracted or impatient.

Good Luck, We moved away from the farm 40 years ago last August. Dad worked day and night to support his farming habit. I talked him out of planting in 72 never dreamed it would cause us to move to town and never go back. I don't miss farming but I miss the farm. Wish You well.
Ron

Soybean population must be different in different parts of the
country. Here in the south we usually plant 90- 100,000 for
early beans and 130,000 for second crop beans. According to
university studies, there was no advantage in planting more
than 60,000 for early beans if an even stand was achieved. I
guess the optimization would be to plant as few beans as
possible that can totally canopy as to absorb every bit of
sunlight in the field. I don't think many folks in the south
exceed $50 per acre for soybean seed.

You farm to make money,not break even..$186 rent per
acre sounds high for land thats not top quality..Whats a
normal soybean yield in your area? You cant plant beans
every year..Your seed bean costs seem pretty high...

$440 per acre sounds high to put out beans unless you can
average 50-60 bushels most years...My renter grows 125
bushel corn for less than that..Of course rent is only $75-
100 per acre in my area..

Even with 3 dry years in a row famers have made lots of
money in my area thanks to high grain prices and crop
insurance...Thanks to 7 great crops in a row from 2004-
2010 everyone went in to these dry years with great proven
yields for insurance.

I was enjoying your post up until the part where you characterized us as "Internet Chair Jockey Farmers". That was flat insulting.

We "chair farmers" have been where you are now and can relate to the hardships we had to endure. The reason many of us are relegated to our "chairs" now is because we've worn out our bodys doing what you are starting to do. Our minds are fine. We just can't do all the physical work anymore. Our "negativity" isn't so much being negative as it is being able to relate to all the problems you're going to have. And you ARE going to have them.

I best can sum up your endeavors like this: You are going to live poor, and if you're lucky, you'll die rich. Just prior to dieing you'll join the "internet chair jockey farmers". It ain't all bad.

I admire your courage, but if your attitude remains this disrespectful, you will fail. There is a wide array of operations on this website, from people that want to farm to BTO's. It is important to always know that someone knows more and someone knows less.

I farm about 200 acres with my buddy. We have more than full time jobs and do this in the spare time. We constantly run into conflicts with our jobs, and this is where the size of equipment is important. It is not worth losing your job over a few thousand dollars of farming income.

I would estimate your income, then count on half of that to be conservative and safe. Listen to the others in your area.

There are three allies you will really need for success. You will need a bank loan officer with extensive agricultural background, an experienced county extension agent, and an understanding wife with a good paying job. You will have some good ideas and some hare-brained ideas, so a neighbor who is still farming on a reasonable (not BTO) scale is the one to run your ideas past before you commit to them.

I grew up in the early 60s on a 30 acre small farm. We had 4 milk cows that we milked by hand 6 or so hogs and chickens and 20 acres tillable with a 2 acre family garden. It was a lot of hard work that had to be done but I grew up this way so it didn't seam hard to me. I learned a lot as a young boy that I still use this wisdom as I farm today.

One of the biggest things I can tell you is, Don't try to keep up with the Jones's! If you try you will go broke. My newest tractor now is a 76 model and I take pride in my old fleet that I farm with. With everybody having to work a full time job myself included, I found that what we did as a years ago still works today for several reasons. 1 we never had one crop a year to count on. We had 3, corn (to feed with) soybeans as a cash crop and wheat to sell and for bedding. We did all this in a rotation to help keep the ground built up and the manure would be spread on next years corn ground. 2nd reason is it gives you income more spread out over the year and most importantly it spreads your work out load out more evenly. Instead of trying to get 200 acres planted together maybe its 60 or 70 acres of corn followed by 60 or 70 acres of soybeans to plant. Come July 60 acres of wheat to harvest and bale or sell the straw to someone to bale. It will give you more time to do it right and do a better job with your crops. Last years $8 corn is this years $4 corn and last years beans at $14 are this years $12 beans. Well you get the point. Just don't put all your eggs in one basket, It never works out to good.

Being in your 30s and wanting to farm.... well there is nothing wrong with that and I give you my whole hearted support in wanting to. But you are going to have to find a balance for your life, Don't work yourself to death trying to do it. There is more to life than that and don't let life slip by because you have to go to work or the field, You will get to hating what your doing and that aint good.

Being a small farmer these day is hard, And getting started even harder. You have to pay more for everything so you have to make every dollar count. Phone calls are cheep and face time with seed and chemical reps can yield cheaper costs if he wants your business, Don't be afraid to ask for a cheaper price. As others have said a good mentor is always helpful but the bottom line is you, You have to make the final decision and live with it. So chose wisely young grasshopper.

Life is short, Do what makes you happy and live life don't let it pass by and have as few regrets as possible and you will do good. You sound like you are willing to work hard to get what you want and you want to farm, I applaud you for that. Especialy now with the give it to me generation. I would say all of us hear are behind you and want to see you prosper and make it. Bandit

in my area rent is going from 200 to 350 per acre so 186 is not that bad. Average soybean yields are around 45 to 55 bushels an acre.

That population is way to thick for drilled soybeans.
You will have problems with mold and fungi. I drill
my beans with 6"drill at about 120 pop. With drilled
beans if they look good when they come up then you
planted to thick.

I won't get into all of the details of grain farming because there are others a lot more experience than I am. I will give you all the encouragement that I can. I sounds like you have a good start. I've been a livestock farmer all of my adult life and was finally able to go full time 13 years ago so I do have an idea of what your up against. Be prepared to work when you don't want to and live on less than you would like. Some years you will need to take out of your day job to make ends meet. You won't break even every year.
Don't be afraid to shop around for a good banker, they can be your best ally or your worst enemy. A banker that loans you money without asking some hard questions might not be the best. My banker has kept me from making mistakes just by getting me to do some thinking.
I would also put more faith into advise from local small farmers than the as you say internet armchair jockeys. There are a lot of good people on here but there are a lot that will give advise on things that they have little experience. Local guys also know your area and conditions better than most on here. A good county agent can also be an asset, some coops have a crop consultant on staff to help but they are also there to sell stuff.
It sounds like you have a good start. Grow slow and steady as you can and I believe you'll do fine. Good luck, we need more young people like you.

I would say you have 2 options. Buy lottery tickets. Marry it. You can marry more in a minute than you can make in a life time but more than likely you will pay for it the rest of your life.

The way the market and economy is going now, you should have started 3 years ago. Just wait another 20 years for the farming economy to bubble again.

Tractorvet,I enjoyed your story just thought I would let you know.