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Farming Steep Ground

J

JD Farmer

Member
I just posted some pics of raking and baling hay on steep ground. Some of you seemed to think it really wasn't that steep. So this morning I had time to go back there with a rule and a 6' level.

What I want to know is this. Just how steep is too steep?

Here are my findings.

After taking measurements, and being by myself with no one to hold things, I finally found a location that would hold the level.
mvphoto21113.jpg


Just for verification.
mvphoto21114.jpg


Another view.
mvphoto21115.jpg


I first set the left end of the 58" level on top of the left rear fender, raised the right side up to level and took a measurement back down to the right fender top....27".

Is that 45% slope?? How many degrees would that be?
 
I hay road ditches all summer long like that. Been
going on as long as there's been mowers and balers
here.

Casey in SD
 
According to my calculator, that is just over 5/12
slope. About like the roof on my house.

Way too steep for my taste and I live in the
mountains where we got plenty of STEEP. Just not
being plowed.
 
Well I knew someone would come along saying just that....

Having one tire in a road ditch with the other up on a bank is not the same as working on a hillside with nothing to hold you from sliding to the bottom.
 

To insure I understand your measurements correctly let me describe it as follows. The level is 58" long and the 27" is measured down to the fender in a plane perpendicluar to the ground. In other words if you had placed a straight board across the top of each rear fender the 27" would be at a right angle (90 degrees) up to the end of the level.

If so; we have Arc Sin = 27/58 which is 27.7 degrees.

BTW - Sin is pronounced "sign"
 
All I know is you better make sure your tires are properly inflated on that slope. I've seen rears slip completely off the bead before.
 
It"s been a long time since I tried to use trig, but I calculate 24.9 degrees.
If your tractor was at 45 degrees, your 58 inch level would show 41 inches on both the right edge and bottom of the cab window (measuring from the lower right-hand corner).
Still plenty steep for me.
really steep haying
 
Now feel that puckering factor kick in when you hit that little swag with that lower wheel
 
LOL...worse than that was the time I ran over a loose rock with the upperside tire......things kinda stood still for a second while the tire rolled that rock out from under it and came back to earth....that was the last time any loose rocks were left on that hill.
 
Looks too steep for that tractor. I farm a lot of
steep ground here in s.w.Pa (where square bales
roll off the hill), but my wheels are widened out
farther. I'd pull those rims out to the next ridge.
If from the seat you look straight down and see the
inside sidewall, getting too steep. Watch that
upper tire like a hawk - if it hits a little rise
like a groundhog hole mound you're in trouble.
 
Real problem we see with operating in that maximum permissible range is like someone else said is IF the upper tire crosses a large stone, or the lower wheel drops off in a hole things really go bad quick. Tennessee has plenty of slopes and also has it,s share of tractor accidents.
 
(quoted from post at 18:27:11 09/30/13) It"s been a long time since I tried to use trig, but I calculate 24.9 degrees.
If your tractor was at 45 degrees, your 58 inch level would show 41 inches on both the right edge and bottom of the cab window (measuring from the lower right-hand corner).
Still plenty steep for me.
really steep haying
Click to expand...

Deere,

Your trig is good but the 27" is in a plane perpendicular to the ground. As such you need to use Arc Sin instead of Arc Tan.

Respectfully,

Ken
 

JD Farmer you are not going to trick me with all that! From being on this forum for twelve years I know for certain that if I were to go on a side hill steeper than 10% grade with my tractor it would roll over instantly. And my narrow front tractors would roll over instantly at 6% grade. You must have had a crane set your tractor there and then turned a huge screw into the ground to hold the up hill tire down.
 
I didn't do the math but 45 PERCENT slope sounds about right, not a 45 degree as mabey some are thinking of... We've got a short dive in one field here that would light the oil pressure light on one of the old tractors. It's probably close to 80% slope at it's worst. The general slope of the hill is something like you're working on. Then we have pastures that run down to the lake that are over 100% slope (45 deg) in some places. They were cleared by hand and with horses I guess... they've never seen a machine.
I generally prefer to attack grades like you're working on straight up and down. At least when you slide you have some semblance of control. Sliding sideways is never much fun.


Rod
 
(quoted from post at 17:50:06 09/30/13) I just posted some pics of raking and baling hay on steep ground. Some of you seemed to think it really wasn't that steep. So this morning I had time to go back there with a rule and a 6' level.

What I want to know is this. Just how steep is too steep?

Here are my findings.

After taking measurements, and being by myself with no one to hold things, I finally found a location that would hold the level.
mvphoto21113.jpg


Just for verification.
mvphoto21114.jpg


Another view.
mvphoto21115.jpg


I first set the left end of the 58" level on top of the left rear fender, raised the right side up to level and took a measurement back down to the right fender top....27".

Is that 45% slope?? How many degrees would that be?
Click to expand...
I do a lot of brush hogging on hillsides. I have an 8' wide Bush Hog and set my tractor wheels out to 8'. You know you are getting close to the limit when the downhill tire is rolled about 6" inside the rim...and you need to hook your feet on the footrests to keep from sliding off (I mow standing up, just to get a better view). I always try to mow from the bottom up so I can see where the lower wheels are going and notice any washouts or holes. By the looks of your rear tires, you are in the "pucker factor" range LOL!
 
I was getting dizzy just looking at the pictures.

Back when I was just a kid, we went over to a friend's house for Sunday Dinner. After dinner, he had me and my brother help him feed some cattle. Loaded up the carry-all on his tractor and then headed up to where the cattle were. I never took any measurements, but I swear that grassy slope was close to vertical and prob'ly 100 feet of elevation change.
 
Draw an imaginary vertical line through the center of mass
down to the ground. When the line touches the point where the
tire touches the ground the tractor can tip. If it"s close, a little
bump could push it over. Looks like you"re a foot or so away.
 
If I remember correctly a 6620 sidehill combine will level up to 17 degrees. We farm ground that it was still tipped downhill.
 
OH i see your making hay on the one nasty field we do hay on , now throw in no less then two ground hog holes per round and add in a up hill grade going east and a down hill grade going west and ya have that field. Ya really have to think on just how your going to kick that bale ya just made out. Makes for 6 hours of pucker factor while mowing .
 
I would get those rears as far out as possible. Then I would load them 60% full of cc to lower the cg as much as possible. Then I would pay some neighbor to custom hay it. LOL
 
Because there is no way in HILL that you could do that and make it out alive...with the empty tractor I might make it up the hill IF I stacked 800# of weights on the front end....and with a change in elevation of over 50' and a run of about 125' top to bottom, who's gonna catch you on the way down?? Besides that the resulting torn up turf, would erode the tire marks and you would have a hillside full of ruts within a years time.
A few years ago the land was timbered and they ran the skidder down over this hill on the return trip empty, but never went up the hill dragging timber....it's just too long and steep.
 
I make hay on land that that you'd turn that tractor over going across the hill,only way to make the hay is straight up and down.The hill you're on is no big deal going either way.
 
For me - it's just hay and it aint worth dying over.

I also use older tractors without rops, so it's a different situation for me.

But still - I think you could go back and forth all day at that angle, but then loose pressure in a tire, hit a rut, slip a tire, slide in a wet spot etc - then all of a sudden all those successful passes mean nothing.

Not for me. But I'm not in it for a living either.
 
JD Farmer:

"What I want to know is this. Just how steep is
too steep?"


When the little ball in the Inclinometer is
screaming "HELP!" as the tractor cartwheels down
the slope.
 
We farm at lot of similar type ground. The key is to keep your speed to where you can control when you hit the rock ect. When it gets extremely steep you keep your foot on the up hill side brake keeping the nose up hill slightly. Drivers that are scared rather than respectful of the slope need to stay off.

toby
 
All the posts below are entertaining and either prove or disprove our bravery or lack thereof. (by the way, I was impressed with the math contest)

My only thought while reading all these replies was "It's fields like that, that moved God to creat cows".
 
Yup when the uphill tire starts spinning its time to pay attention. When I have my mounted mower conditioner on I can tackle crazy hills with it on the uphill side but on the hill pictured and hung downhill will spin the uphill tire bad enough that you get stuck and have to use the brake to drive out of it. Due to shape of the fields I can usually change my pattern. Trouble starts when sending my wife out to Ted or rake, she'll get to the point and not want to move the tractor thinking it will roll.
 
When you live in the hills there's frequently no way to get from one spot to another without driving across a hill, and fields frequently follow ridge lines.

You want fun? Try riding a load of hay down a hill back to the barn when the the neighbor's wife driving the 9N pushes in the clutch. Mrs Henderson never took the hay back to the barn after that. Fortunately all ended well.
 
How about putting duals on? .

If you want the correct slope calculated I don't think you should measure it on the tractor. The tires are well inflated yes but doesn't the tractors weight displacement cause the lower tire to sink down a little more than the upper one meaning the tractor is leaning more than the slope?
Why not just put a board directly on the ground and level it up horizontal and then do the Arc Sinus calculation?
 
(quoted from post at 14:03:11 10/01/13) How about putting duals on? .

If you want the correct slope calculated I don't think you should measure it on the tractor. The tires are well inflated yes but doesn't the tractors weight displacement cause the lower tire to sink down a little more than the upper one meaning the tractor is leaning more than the slope?
Why not just put a board directly on the ground and level it up horizontal and then do the Arc Sinus calculation?
Click to expand...

Duals are good: 1) The track width is extended and 2) weight added at the outside edge of the track width. Both work to increase stability.

Yes, the board on the ground would more accurately measure the slope of the hill side. However, the tractor tips based on it's angle not the angle of the ground. You can tip a tractor over on level ground if you jack one side up high enough. Therefore, he measured it correctly to indicate the danger level.
 
Duals also increase the risk of sliding... a LOT. Ever slide sideways down a hill? Ever have the machine behind you slide sideways and try and pass you?
I have... that brings a whole new meaning to 'skid mark'.

Rod
 
I mow a couple road banks where I have to make 2 or 3 passes, and sitting on the angled part under the window, beside the seat, on the 4840 is about right.
 
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