Funny up date on the young farmer I tried to help.

I posted a while back about being sick and tired of the younger guys taking advantage of any help offered. The one kid sold a set of gravity wagons I helped him get at a deal. Then he was supposed to help us during harvest with them. We would have harvested his crop. I posted how he was helping/working with a real slimmy local BTO.

So today I came home from church and saw a real mess. The farm the kid rents has a county grade "B"( low maintenance road) farm access road to the back half. There is no other way to get to the ground back there. About half way down this road there is a ten ton bridge. We always crossed it with just a half a wagon load of grain. Even then we went real slow.

Well the kid was trying to pull one over on the old man that owns the ground he rents. The owner hates the BTO with a passion. He has told anyone and everyone that the BTO will never set foot on his farm. I warned the kid when he told me what he had planned for this fall. The attraction of the big fancy, mortgaged, BTO equipment is just like crack for this kid. He is just slobbering at the bit to drive the big stuff.

The old man owner took this weekend to go to his daughters in Chicago for a mini vacation. The kid waits until the old guy is gone and tries to rush in and use the BTO equipment to harvest the corn. They got the crop on the house side all done yesterday. This morning they tried to do the back. They got the combine across the bridge okay. They where smart enough to not try taking the BTO's semis back the road. They where not smart enough to think about how much a full 1000 bushel grain cart weight on the one axle. Maybe 50-60K on the one axle. So you take ten ton bridge and put a cart with 25-30 ton on it. Do I need to tell you what happened. LAMO

The cart went clear through the bridge. About a ten foot drop. They tried to just pull it on across with two tractors. They pulled the tongue off the grain cart. The cart flipped up on it rear. So it is standing straight up in the air. LOL

So the bridge is ruined. The grain cart is stuck in the remains of the old bridge. There is a bunch of corn down in the creek. The BTO combine and second cart are stuck on the back side of the ruined bridge. There is ZERO way out other than the bridge. There are limestone bluffs all around the back of this farm so you can't just drive through to another field and get out. Both upstream and down stream the creek that the bridge crosses is all limestone shelfed too. So I don't think you can bulldoze a path across anywhere I know of.

Then the icing on the cake. The owner will be back anytime. That grain cart is sticking up in the air like that planter down at Kinze's factory. You can see it from the main road easily. When he gets home the fireworks are going to start.

So here is what he is going to find.

1) The crop harvested off his ground. This is a crop share agreement. So where is his share at right now??? He wanted to be there during harvest.

2) The BTO that he hates on his farm without his permission.

3) The only access he has to the back of his farm blocked.

4) The bridge on that access destroyed. The county sent him a letter several years ago that they would not have the money to fix any damage done to the bridge. If it was damaged he would have to have it repaired at his cost. The county was just going to close the road if that happened.

I really should not feel the way I do this afternoon but I am human. It is rarely that I would be able to have this big of a I-told-you-so. I really, really want to go down and take some pictures but I am sure that would be a big fight. I might have to shoot someone.

I do feel sorry for the old man that owns the place. I hope he does not have a health issue over this. I do know there will be law suits over this one. The BTO and the kid are toast.

The kid can forget about farming around here in the future. The BTO has done this type of thing before. It cost him big time with the county then. I wonder if they will enforce the ten ton posted load limit???? If they do I wonder if the BTO insurance will have to pay for the bridge damage??

So you guys can have a chuckle about this one with me.

Got to love the get rich quick thinking of the young .

Yikes!!!!


:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

I think it is OK to get a laugh out of it. The BTO jerks around here always seem to be one step ahead of bad luck. I am hoping the scales of justice start tipping out of their favor soon. I play by the rules and it really gets me down to see things running wildly in their favor as it has been the past several years.

Sure wish you had some pics. I'll bet that it will get very interesting.

great reading. this is better than any "reality" show ! that kid is getting what he deserves. it being rented on shares is they worst part of it. how about a pic?

What goes around comes around, but I place part of the blame on the landowner,how many times have they left a good tenant in the lurch when they decide to rent to someone else for a few dollars an acre more. How often does that come back to haunt them? If you decide to rent land to someone you better have a good idea of who they are and how they behave or you're setting yourself up to get hurt. How do you counteract that? Big 300 page leases with insurance and liability contingencies? That's how we do it in local government, and that's why it costs $250 to have a blind installed in a Courthouse, yep can't get the owner-operator 4 doors down from the courthouse to do it as an Owner operator he isn't required to carry workman's comp and he sure as heck doesn't have the 1 million dollar liability insurance, why carry insurance for more than you're worth?

How many family farms (and implement dealers, car dealers, hardware stores and grocery stores) have we killed with death, estate and transfer taxes?

How do we find young people to farm and if their family isn't farming how do we get them started? I don't think it's big government programs. Maybe elderly landowners work three way leases where a young farmer, and experienced farmer and the landowner identify ways for the landowner to get rent, the young farmer to get some income and the experienced some help, income or revenue from leasing/sharing equipment consulting or what ever else he brings to the table. Does the path to farming start with an hourly job with a farmer and a defined path to growing into your own operation? If you hired a young man to work directly for you how long do you need him under your wing until you might enter a three way lease where he has skin in the game, maybe working for you for a share on the crop from rented land with the young person eventually assuming more and more responsibility for rented ground by paying for inputs and eventually acquiring their own equipment?

Two words-- Telephoto lens!

What goes around sometimes comes around (but not often enough).

Dean

Now I dont appreciate that comment to much. Im 18 and me and 2 of my friends are farming 125 acres together, 75 rented and the rest through family members. We do everything by the book. If we are going to do something in a field we let the landowner know whats going on first and get prior permission. We are to the point now where ground is coming to us, we dont have to look for it. We want to be trusted and have a good reputation in the community. We enjoy driving the new big toys, but we have so much more fun using our old "junk" to get the job done. In fact the only reason we are trying to buy new equipment is we need more capacity for the yields we are geting. Not becase we feel the need for cabs and AC. The 3 big guys farming in our area make fun of us for our 40 year old equipment and we embrace it. The son of one of these farmers told me if he had to use the equipment we have, he would quit farming which tells me he aint a real farmer anyway. We always pay rent before the first of the year and we try to get it done before the first week of December if the elevator gets us our money by then. That is how we have chosen to operate. We would never do anything our landlords wouldnt want us to and we have gained a whole bunch of respect for that. There are a buch of old timers that go down to our local gas station every morning and solve the worlds problems, and before we started farming all they did was talk about those three big guys, now all they talk about is us kids and our 125 acres and outdated equipment and they find it cool as heck. I think we can say we did somethig when we gained the respect of guys who are second and third generation farmers. So please dont go around condeming a whole generation over one dumba$$ attack from an idiot that couldnt farm without his half million dollar machines. There are some of us out there that have farming in our blood and know how to do it right!

Yes post some pictures

Unfortunately most kids today don't have your grit and determination. I wanted to farm real bad when I was your age but dad sold out six years earlier and Grandpa was already committed to my older cousin. Best of luck and may God bless your endeavors.

I was taught never to delight in the misfortune of others regardless of the circumstance, but I sure do understand it.

Especially coming home from church...

Yes sir there are, I'm 24, started custom haying with a #3 MF square baler and running 1 cow when I was 16. My family hasn't farmed in 2 generations, I started with a 75 year old neighbor who had retired and had 5 cows. Using his equipment I started haying more ground and started row cropping with 50 acres. I built up my name, my equipment and my herd piece by piece with my own 2 hands and fierce determination. None of that was easy, I am still an interloper in community, just now starting to gain a little respect. Went to a producers dinner and meeting awhile back, stood alone, and sat alone with my wife while we ate. A lot of the guys will talk all day with me one on one, but in public I'm on the outside. My wife and I bought the cattle from the gentlemen I had farmed with this spring, we now run 70 cow calf pairs, and farm 300 acres. I also work in town, have been part time the last 9 months, but just applied to go back full time working 4 ten hour shifts. I get really sick of this younger generation crap, there are lazy moochers in every generation, always have been and always will be. They are the ones who have their face in the paper and make lots of noise. The rest of us are too busy busting our butts.

Where do the old farmer's heirs stand then? Mostly I see that when older guys die off, the farm is usually sold to the highest bidder to give the family the most $$$. I don't see that changing. All this anti BTO talk doesn't seem to be grounded in reality. At modern prices for ground and equipment, the little guy is in the same position as the local grocer vs. Wallmart. Ag is big biz, little guys need not apply, except maybe in specialized, local markets.

same here frank. al

JD
that is about the biggest snafu that i ever heard and i'm sure the young fella that is behind all this is embarrassed as all get out he certainly doesn't have any reputation left.
i know that it is only corn completely bio-degradable and all that but is that much corn spill reportable?????? you can bet your keester that the deer hunting is gonna be record there this year.... WOW al

May be a bit of the Devil in me too! Please keep us posted

Bad cause = bad effect.

Anytime I've tried to take a shortcut or otherwise not do the right thing, it has always backfired on me. The kid is learning a valuable lesson, but a very expensive one. Hopefully he'll never repeat his mistake, but some folks never learn.

Just goes to show that bad things happen to bad people too.If I was the owner I'd be down at the Court House bright and early Monday morning filing a lein against the equipment for the damages on the bridge of course its probably not paid for.

In the words of Joseph Stalin: "Little by little, we learn!"

Would someone please define BTO!

Big Time Operator

Big Time operator, i think.

Not that it would have been smart to take the tractor/trailer across there, but it would have been a better bet than a buggy! What do they do for brains?
What do you suppose they will do for immediate access?
We'll be waiting for more!
In a world where so many seem to get away with "murder", it's good to see someone reap what they sow. It is just really too bad for the property owner.

In our area their is a couple btos,and then their are couple of guys that run thousands of acres and treat us small time farmers with respect,the one lets me cut his marsh field no charge.the btos want half of the cash when sold.i surpose in al areas you have good btos and bad btos that you wish their corn would blow over flat.

Tell your neighbor not to get too upset. He has a crapload of silver linings in this cloud.

1. Now he knows the true character of his renter.
2. He is going to get a new bridge to connect his land.
3. The BTO's insurance company is going to pay for it.
4. The BTO is going to have to spend more cash to get his crops in this year with his equipment stranded.
5. Everybody in the county is going to see what a moron the BTO is.
6. He gets a front seat to the show.

Oh, come on, give s pictures!!! A telephoto digital camera is cheap, nowadays. Come to think of it, take a video, post it on youtube, and after about 1700 hits, they pay you to advertise, on your video!!!

We expect daily updates please.

To most of you anybody that farms more than 5 acres and has a tractor bigger than a 8n or h is a BTO!!!!!!

(quoted from post at 17:52:08 09/23/12) To most of you anybody that farms more than 5 acres and has a tractor bigger than a 8n or h is a BTO!!!!!!

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LOL I know I an't a BTO and I have 200 acres a M and a 1206.

Rick

"I get really sick of this younger generation crap, there are lazy moochers in every generation, always have been and always will be."

I can"t agree more! I leave the house at 4am to go to a "9 to 5" job and if I"m lucky I might get home by 5pm!

Unfortunately for the old chap it maybe a case of "you can"t get blood out of a stone". He may get a court decision but that alone won"t grow a crop.

Just thinking, how big and heavy is the combine? If it is a newer one it must weigh at least ten ton wouldn't it? Feel kind of sorry for the kids but it is kind of funny. Wouldn't want to be in their shoes.

I don't think Super Trucker was talking about you at all.He means those that the topic was about.

The original poster tried to help this so called BTO out and he crossed him...so payback is "Heck" (for lack of ability for using the correct word).

you seem like you guys are approaching it in a rightly manner,looking before ya leap , and not over spending your budget..new equipment will break down, for now ya know what you have. and how to maintain it new stuff got too much electronics to figure out going big time.

I don't like to chuckle or laugh at others having missfortue, but such things are alwas pretty interesting to follow along and see how they turn out.

JKeep us informed on how this all sorts out.

With the county involved, that will be a good one. Bridges aren't easy to replace any more, tree-huggers get involved, things have to be done such & so & studied, etc.

Feel for the land owner, it would seem he was trying to give the kid a break renting the land to him, and then it all blows up like this.

What moron would take a loaded grain cart over a small bridge? Sheez. The semi's woulda been better.

--->Paul

I couldn't have said it better myself Erik.

Well an updated update!!LOL. Some late information. The BTO's son and the kid I was helping where the bosses today. The BTO was in at Dubuque at the gambling boat. NO Joke here. They have a real cheap buffet Sunday meal. So lots of people go to just eat and never place a bet. The boys where lucky and did not know it. The old bridge has/had two main beams. The combine tires hit right over the beam. So the bridge held driving the combine across. The trouble started with the heavy grain cart. The cart straddled the bridge beams. So the old wooden bridge planks had to carry the load. They did not do the job. The cart's tires just broke through the bridge floor. The main beams held. If they had stopped right there they more than likely would have been able to save themselves a bunch of trouble. They could have gotten a grain vac and unloaded the grain cart. Then jacked it up and put planks under it and drove it on off. Then they would have only had the floor to repair.

The two kids decided to just pull the cart on across the bridge. Thinking the tires would hit the bank and jump up off the bridge. (My youngest son went down to see his old buddy) When they tried to pull the cart the two tractors would not budge it. So they decided to jerk the one tractor with a used truck tire and several chains. You loop the chains through a side of the tire and use it like a stretch arm strong. (That toy will date me by age. LOL) Well when they jerked the cart tractor it tore the draw bar out of the tractor. They also pulled the bridge beams off of the abutment on the far end. That is what dropped the cart into the creek. My son said the draw bar support was broken off the cart tractor. He said it looks like the transmission case was broken.

The kids had went and got the BTO grain vac and where emptying the cart and sucking the corn out of the creek bed. My son said the cart did not look hurt too bad. He said the axle hit the bridge and kept the bottom protected. He said the back panel was damaged but it looked like it bolted in so it could be replaced.

The county engineer was already out and took pictures. He was gone by the time my son got there. The BTO was there and he says he is going to get one of those old railroad cars they advertise for use as a culvert. He thinks he can drop it in next to the bridge and back fill it with gravel. He thinks he can get this done in a few days. So he can get his equipment out.

The land owner showed up. My son said he was hopping mad. He really chewed out the renter. Told him he was fixing the bridge and had better have weight tickets for all of the corn to him by noon tomorrow. The land owner said he will not let a culvert be installed. So the show down is going to start. He also had the sheriff out and had the BTO walked off his farm. Told him to stay off or he was filing trespassing charges. So it looks like the boys are going to be in the hot seat.

It was dark by the time my son went down so no pictures. I will try to get some before they get the cart out. It may be there a while. The two local wrecker services, with big enough wreckers to do the job, will not touch it. They have been burnt by the BTO before.

This BTO is farming about 4500 acres. He has been as high as 8000 in the past. He is a real slim ball. He has filed chapter 13 twice that I know of. Once in the 1980s and then again in about 2000. He burnt many local people both times. I often wonder how he can still borrow money. He seems to buy what ever he wants. It seems he can always find some absentee land lord to rent to him. He always promises big money rents. He just never tells the whole story. He only will pay for the tillable acres the Farm Service office shows. He will just keep on farming around anything that falls in the field and just lowers the rent. Says there are fewer tillable acres. He goes for five year deals. He fertilizes the first two. Then only nitrogen the third year. Then the last two years in soybeans. So when he is done the ground is way short on fertility.

I love how JDseller so quick to point out the down side, I really believe JDseller is upset about this young person coming in and putting him to shame. If! And I say if he was working this farm would JDseller done if different? We will never know! Why? Because JDseller is not working the farm. JDseller is older, I believe, but not as aggressive as the young gentlemen and is little jealous. Jdseller has had chances to work this farm but…..missed them.

60,000+ of grain PLUS the weight of the cart. I've had 71,000# on our 1050 Kinze a couple times.

If this really and truly happened, there would be pictures.
Also, the owner of the grain cart is liable, not the owner, so its no big deal. Pretty much an insurance issue. The landowner should rent the land to the kid again since he gave him a free, new bridge.

Kudos and ditto!

Jealous: Your posting is real funny. Did you read the original post a few weeks back??? How do you think the "young kid" got the farm to rent in the first place??? I got him and the owner together. I turned down renting the farm. I have been around this kid since he was 3-4 years old. He grew up with my youngest son. They where good friends. This deal has kind of strained that relationship. We where trying to help the kid get a start. He kind of stabbed us in the back.

Plus how did the young kid get his fertilizer on a fall pay note at the Coop??? I guaranteed the payment under my line of credit. I wrote this in the original posting.

As for " not working the farm". The last twelve harvests on this farm where done by my brother or myself. We harvested the crop for the owner. He just fully retired this year. We all knew to be careful with the bridge. The kid should have too. He helped us as a paid hired hand the last three years.

I am really disappointed in the kid. He has made quite a few mistakes this last year or two. This is just the latest ones. I hope he grows out of them but he is really burning bridges as he goes lately.

I think that would be worth a call to the local tv station news room.

(quoted from post at 20:36:04 09/23/12) If this really and truly happened, there would be pictures.
Also, the owner of the grain cart is liable, not the owner, so its no big deal. Pretty much an insurance issue. The landowner should rent the land to the kid again since he gave him a free, new bridge.

Click to expand...

If either offending party had insurance, you'd see a recovery operation funded by insurance by now.

(quoted from post at 23:35:49 09/23/12)

(quoted from post at 20:36:04 09/23/12) If this really and truly happened, there would be pictures.
Also, the owner of the grain cart is liable, not the owner, so its no big deal. Pretty much an insurance issue. The landowner should rent the land to the kid again since he gave him a free, new bridge.

Click to expand...

If either offending party had insurance, you'd see a recovery operation funded by insurance by now.

Click to expand...

I can't see anything without pictures or a link to the newscast. Besides, it takes a workday to get anything done by insurance. We are still working through the weekend. Bankers hours don't care about seasons.

Hey Oliver KID... just pulling your chain man... You just let those old farts laugh. You do it the way it is fun for you. The best job in the world is the one you can't wait to get up in the morning to get started at. What your old iron lacks in glamour, it makes up for in cost of operation. Some of those guys with the shiny new tractors probably secretly wish they were you, with no payment books and no 100.00/hour service calls. Also, don't defend your position to anybody. It doesn't need defending; you're doing it just right.

(quoted from post at 05:38:46 09/24/12)

(quoted from post at 23:35:49 09/23/12)

(quoted from post at 20:36:04 09/23/12) If this really and truly happened, there would be pictures.
Also, the owner of the grain cart is liable, not the owner, so its no big deal. Pretty much an insurance issue. The landowner should rent the land to the kid again since he gave him a free, new bridge.

Click to expand...

If either offending party had insurance, you'd see a recovery operation funded by insurance by now.

Click to expand...

I can't see anything without pictures or a link to the newscast. Besides, it takes a workday to get anything done by insurance. We are still working through the weekend. Bankers hours don't care about seasons.

Click to expand...

Dalet why would this be news worthy??? Do you not know what a Grade "B" or low maintenance road is?? It is little more than a old dirt road that has very little use any more. Many of them are gated off by the county any more to keep ATV and 4x4s tearing up the dirt/gravel grade. The bridge is only thirty feet long and maybe 10-12 feet deep. It sets about a 1/2 mile off of a very lightly traveled gravel road. Not a big news item here.

Also why in the world would the owner want to rent to a person that did something he was told not to do. LETTING the BTO on the owners farm. Plus he harvested the crop without the owner knowing it was going to be done. A share of this crop is the owners. Can he really know 100% that he is going to get that full share??

> I hope he grows out of them but he is really burning bridges as he goes lately.


That's funny, don't care who you are.

--->Paul

That young fellow is probably in much deeper trouble than he realizes. The county will have first say as to how the bridge is repaired, and if there's a possibility of insurance money, they'll go long in hopes of getting a first-class bridge for free.

Meanwhile, it seems improbable that a guy who goes to the casino for dinner carries much in the way of insurance. Probably only what his lenders insist on, if any. Of course, if he is insured, his insurer may still come after the young man for damages, depending on their business relationship. It doesn't sound like he was an employee of the BTO, and even if they had a formal partnership the insurance company won't want to cover damages if the partnership or the young man aren't named on the policy. If there was no formal partnership between the BTO and the young man, then he was merely renting or borrowing the equipment and is now on the hook for damages to the bridge and cart.

well,i am home from work reading the update.
i am behind jdseller 100%. dalet and jealous dont have an understanding of the backstory. again, the WORST part of it is the share farming,who knows what happen over the wkd? YES, the owner should put a lien on the equipment...good advice.

JD,you said it was a public road(gov.),so the old farmer has NO say in what goes back in.That is between the county and farmer(who ever broke the bridge)what goes back in.Was dumb,but we have all done stupid things sometime.

(quoted from post at 05:18:32 09/24/12)Was dumb,but we have all done stupid things sometime.

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Yea we have......BUT NOT THAT STUPID!

Rick

Erik,I have seen a picture of you and your wife but didnt
realize that you were only 24..You seem to have a great
work ethic and the maturity of someone thats much older...

Good luck with your farming operation as it grows..It must
feel good to have started out so young with practically
nothing and keep on growing..I hope that this sounds like a
compliment because it is..

Theres a guy in his 50's near me that started out just like
you and he has a large farming operation now..

JDSeller
I am fully aware of a minimum maintenance road and bridge limits. We have them all over the place.
I agree they were wrong trying to run a loaded grain cart across the bridge.

Pictures, we like pictures!

Anyone who has more than the complainant....

Rod

While I tend to agree with you about the previous goings on with this deal... I'd have to take issue with anyone telling me how I was to take MY crop off. If it was a known condition up front that so and so was not permitted on the property then I believe I'd have walked away. Period.
I realise that wasn't the deal up front and whatnot... but things happen.
There was a guy here that rented ground from someone for a vegetable crop a number of years ago. I don't remember if he had way more crop than he needed or weather was a problem or just what... but he sold the crop in the field (tentatively) to another (BTO). When the landowner found out he hit the roof much like this guy and kicked them off. The crop rotted in the ground. That to me is not right....
If you're in the business of renting land, rent it and grow up... Dealing with those kind of personalities is simply not worth the bother.

Rod

(quoted from post at 13:48:47 09/24/12) While I tend to agree with you about the previous goings on with this deal... I'd have to take issue with anyone telling me how I was to take MY crop off. If it was a known condition up front that so and so was not permitted on the property then I believe I'd have walked away. Period.
I realise that wasn't the deal up front and whatnot... but things happen.
There was a guy here that rented ground from someone for a vegetable crop a number of years ago. I don't remember if he had way more crop than he needed or weather was a problem or just what... but he sold the crop in the field (tentatively) to another (BTO). When the landowner found out he hit the roof much like this guy and kicked them off. The crop rotted in the ground. That to me is not right....
If you're in the business of renting land, rent it and grow up... Dealing with those kind of personalities is simply not worth the bother.

Rod

Click to expand...

Rod, I can't agree with that. I have been a landlord through this year. Not going to next year, nothing against tenants. There are some locals who are not welcome on my place. My tenants know who they are. That was a pre condition of the rent agreement. Hire this guy if you want but don't let him on my property. It's my land. Only exception would be in the case of a family or medical emergency for the renter. The people who are not allowed on my place is because they have abused my rights in the past or I don't think they can be trusted. I've never had a renter complain.

Rick

Wish you were in my community! I can tell you I"ve been the "newcomer" in our area for 30 years. Good luck with that....

(quoted from post at 12:11:40 09/25/12) Wish you were in my community! I can tell you I"ve been the "newcomer" in our area for 30 years. Good luck with that....

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LOL I was an outsider city boy when dad trans planted me out here in 72. What few freinds I had in HS I'm still freinds with. What's amazing is that after being gone from 74 to 96 is that after I retired from the Army almost all the people I went to HS with thiks we were great freinds in HS.

Yea there are a few who still think I'm an outsider but they will at least talk to me.

Rod....there are basically 4 BTO's in the area. I've been ones landloard for 9 years total. He has never had any problems with my rules but he sees most people as I do. One who would rent my land in a heartbeat, 2 brother operation, failed to make good on a rental agreement with an old lady who was freinds with my mom. Part of the rent agreement was that they would keep her drive clear in the winter. The 1st year I was out of the Army I plowed her drive because they always had an excuse. They would have had to drive abour 1/2 miles to do it. I drove 5. I never took a dime from her because I knew she was on a very limited income. The next year was the "year of the blizzard", 36 inches in one shot. Well I couldn't do that with my truck and called her and told her. She called her renters who, without asking, told her to move in with my mother for the winter. Those 2 are not allowed on my property, ever! With what I think is good reason. A local guy here is kinda crooked. Takes what farm work he can. Most people that hire him wind up with stuff missing shortly after he works for them. I don't know if he's doing the stealing or if it's his low life buddies. He may only be guilty of getting drunk and telling them what he saw at the bar. He also seems to think he can hunt where he pleases.

I don't want or need people on my place like that.

Rick