Just and odd thought about Made in the land of almosr right

There have been a lot of complaints about the quality of replacement tractor parts from China.......well if we ever have to fight em....the same companies are supplying their military hardware!

Rick

Unfortunately they are probably making our military parts and repair parts too!

Oldtanker, I like that post...

Don't delude yourself - I"ve purchased several weapons made in China, before the importation of them was banned, and I'm here to tell you that they would easily compare with any made here in the States or anywhere else in the world.

I have said it before and will again and again. Back in the 30s we sold a lot of scarp iron to Japan then in 1941 they sent it back at us in bombs etc. Then at the end of the war there was a guy who came out with a quality control way of doing thing. The U.S. industry did not want it but Japan bought it and now days they produce some of the best made stuff in the world.
Now fast forward to today. China is buying as much scrap as they can. Why well so they can do the same thing as was done in 1941.
Back in the late 30s the stuff you could buy from Japan was believed to be well as the saying was Japanese junk quiks quickly

I think they make the better stuff for them selves.
Boy if I was going to war against someone I would
relish the ability to make their weapons and
machine tools for a few years before the battle.
The stuff they make for us is all priced based the
cheaper the better 'cause that's our business motto
the cheaper the better we can sell more and hold
higher margins and get to sell again to the same
customers.

They make quality stuff for themselves,we get the cheap junk,it makes more money.Were the sucker of the world.

And ours.

Dean

The QC guy was Edwards Deming.

He taught statistical quality control to the Japanese. It was well known here but not practiced to the extent that the Japanese did for reasons beyond the scope of this forum.

Dean

One of those things that if they build it to good it does not break and if it does not break then you can not sell parts etc etc etc

Do they? I always wondered about that.

Now if something breaks it is just assumed it was made in China. Or you just say d@#$ Chinese.

The intel reports we were getting up till I retired in 96 on Chinese military hardware was not flattering at all. And I know that the M1A1 rifle that they imported under the Polytec name had lots of problems. And I wasn't talking about rifles but more like thier fighters, tanks and so forth. The Soviets made the AK47 that was a pretty darn good assualt rifle, one of the best in the world but thier tanks and aircraft didn't measure up.

Rick

You must have never taken a look at a Norinco copy of a Browning .22 cal. semi-auto rifle.There wood to metal finsh is terrible and a poor grade of bluing. The metal still has machining marks that you won't find in the Belgian or Japanese versions.

I dont think that they care about hardware all that much when Stalen was threatening China Mao said something like you will drown in our blood.. scary way of thinking huh

I have an SKS rifle from china.Very good machine work thru out.Never had much interest in an SKS until slick willie banned the import.Got to wondering why he didnt want me to have one.I would like have a Garand but the price is too much.

There are one point three billion Chinese.

Unlike the US, their technology and manufacturing capability improves every day.

Unlike the US, they don't think in terms of weeks and months. They think in terms of decades.

Unlike the US, they have a huge trade surplus, which they've used to secure access to raw materials in Africa and elsewhere.

I've been to China twice. My opinion: Great Britain dominated the nineteeth century, but the twentieth century marked the decline of the British Empire and the rise of the United States. In the twenty-first century, the US will decline and China will take the dominant role in commerce and politics. I would like to be wrong, but nothing I see here and in China contradicts this assessment.

Unfortunately - their lack of quality standards is more a function of profit.

They usually have no problem meeting quality control standards set by the customer when they first start producing something - it"s later when nobody"s looking where corners get cut and cheaper materials and processes get substituted in.

You have to remember, american companies manufacture there for the extremely low costs. To the chinese - a savings of a few pennies is much more significant than it is to us. In our country - skimping on quality happens, but it"s less profitable than it is in china, relatively speaking.

China will never go to war with us. They are too smart for that. All they need to do is call the loan of the trillions of dollars that we have borrowed from them and they will own us lock stock and barrel with out fireing a shot or loosing a man.

wrong ! , the chinx know how to make the very best !...we just DONT Get IT !.. Opening trade with China, does a multiple of BAD THINGS for America, cheap breakable tools is only one ,every novice kid mechanic that was from a broken home ,, who proudly buys such tools only to discover the pizpoor quality, could be come dishearted will not learn the techniqe of good husbandry and popular mechanics ,thats the worse case scenario,///or will learn to hate the chinx that built that schit !!.SAME GOES FOR THE ENTIRE AMERICAN populance ./the american economy suffers because Quality is shoved aside and makers of fine tools are weakened

There is some history about the manufacture of the M14 rifle by Springfield Armory, (the real SA) over here in Mass., and what cause the cessation of production. Ironic though, just read another article about the re-use, and or latest rifle built off this platform. I have an M1A1 myself SA - but Geneseo, Illinois has some trw surplus parts, great rifle, I hunt deer with it, heavy but has its place.

Chinese, have the capability to build quality, adhere to reference standards that we created based on a lot of engineering and science, but whomever is dealing with them has to clearly specify and mandate that the product adhere to those standards, which is going to come at additional cost, vs cutting corners and producing an inferior product but at a savings.

One example I can recall is one of the crane collapses in NYC '08, 2nd one, where the carbody (top) fell off the tower (tower crane), their 2nd price for overhauling this crane was significantly less (from reading about it, who really knows)than the first bid, they went with the lower bid and look what happened.

I've dealt with a few chinese outfits in NYC and you have to watch them, they play stupid and try and get you to do their work and similar, this one company's field personnel played dumb on me once, stated they did not know how they would hang these expensive ornamental panels they built for a building, up on the top floor, I told them it was bought erected, its your problem, either you figure it out and get it done per your contract or you have 2 choices, 1.) I default you, (failure to perform) just pay for acceptable materials delivered, to be installed by the replacement contractor and you had better deliver the entire job,(no time to re-fabricate). 2.) I make the arrangements to erect your work, you pay the bill for that. They took the 2nd option, then tried to negotiate the price, I told their representatives this, get me the president of your firm on the phone right now, they did, I explained the situation for the last time, told him the price was non negotiable, you will pay the contractor I have arranged to set up the rigging and whatever else, if you don't I will backcharge your contract (always hold money on them) the full amount. He saw it my way, and to be honest, the president was actually a respectable guy, but people under him trying to make a name for themselves, thought it wise to play dumb and play hardball with an experienced veteran, not going to happen. There is an air about them, they work hard, they are extremely dedicated, can be real pushy, when the new year comes around the entire company shuts down and they all take vacation at the same time. You have to watch everything they do, often times, they will cut corners if you do not.

I had a concrete pour at the entrance on a saturday, I also had a canopy to erect above that pour the same day, had to park 2 cars in one spot, told both outfits to come in, one doing concrete goes first, I pay the down time via time and material ticket for the canopy crew while they are idle during this,until they can work that day, (couple of hours) meaning they are paid for sitting. One of them gets into medium size box truck and starts lurching and revving the engine at the concrete crew, a family outfit, all brothers that do excellent work, almost had a riot, had to remind them about the deal even though they are paid to sit, still trying to intimidate others and see if they can do better, even though everything was clearly mapped out as to how this was going to work, they don't give up easily.

I would love to have a Garand, too. Had one in my hands a few years back, mint condition, made by International Harvester. Didn't buy it and have regretted it ever since. Went back 4-5 days later and it was gone.

The reason the price is so high is because the annointed one has banned the reimportation of over 500,000 M1 Garands that our military wants to bring back and sell as surplus. I figure he doesn't want the military to have the cash, or us to have access to the rifles.

Like they are doing to Japan right now over the island dispute.

You can blame it all on NAFTA and GAT. They where the great killers of American industry. And don"t expect any politician to try and speak against it if he has any hope of rising to higher political power, because it is suicide to bad mouth these treaties. But until they are revoked, American industry will continue to die off.

I don't understand where people get that China is going to attack us militarily.

Time and again, military conquest has proven to be a dismal failure. These days it's only attempted by small-time despots on tiny third-world countries where they have no concept of the history of the last 10,000 years or so.

Even if you do manage to take over, the logistics of keeping everyone in line overwhelm the system, and the empire falls apart. Look at the USSR. Look at the ancient Romans. Look at the British Empire of the 19th century.

Chinese are smart. They know it makes no sense to "buy the cow" when they already get the milk for free. They already get everything they want and need from us.

A shooting war is just messy and would destroy all the resources that we willingly give them now. It would take 20+ years to get this land's productivity back anywhere near where it is now, and that's if there is no nuclear war damage or resistance from the American people.

The entire world is living hand-to-mouth as it is. A disruption that large would cause a worldwide collapse of economies and societies. Basically, China starting a shooting war with the USA would pretty much mean the end of the world.

China's out for WEALTH and POWER, not to bring and end to society. Without society there is no wealth and no power.

I don't know guys. I think we've been riding hard enough on China that they were beginning to get it right, and then along comes "made in India", and we're right back where we started.

Many M1 Garands have been cut up in the usa.Some in the market are rough parts guns.Makes me wonder why we cant afford our US service rifles.