O.T. firearms

A simple, quick poll for the firearm enthusiasts on here. What is your opnion of quality of the Taurus firearm versus the Rugar, in the small handgun catagory??

The Ruger is one of the finest quality arms made. Taurus is OK, but Sturm- Ruger is and has been a premier maker for many years. My Rugers have never given me any trouble and are dead-on accurate.

Agree, ruger by far a better product. The department I work does not allow us (deputies) to carry a taurus

Taurus quality has improved but they are still not up to the quality and design standards of Ruger.

If it is a gun I am going to depend on then it is going to be a Colt or Ruger. The others are just cheap knock offs compared to them.

I have 3 ruger handguns, and only the single six convertible 22 is of modern linage. I bought it in the 80"s The super blackhawk 44 mag flattop, and the Mark 1 22 were bought in 58, and 62, and have been used extensively. Cleaning,lubing, and grip changing, is all the maintence, they have recieved, and the automatic has never caused me problems, from dirt or wear. (May Bill Ruger rest in peace!)

Ours aren't cheap knockoffs.As with any guns, any maufacturer has a few that don't work right.Only cheap guns IMO is a Glock, cant use a good cleaner on cause the tupperware warps (plastic).Taurus has a lifetime warranty,as does SA,Smith and Wesson,the others don't have a lifetime warranty,but may fix the problem with their guns,if you catch them on a good day.
LOU

I've only had one Taurus. It was a P.O.S. I won't have another.

Yes, I realize I may have gotten one of the lemons that can come from any manufacturer. Don't care. Burn me once, shame on you. Burn me twice, shame on me.

I'll stick with my Rugers and S&W's.

No, not even close. However Taurus has 3 things going for it. 1st Imagination: they started the 410 revolver thing, 22 Hornet revolvers, even a 26 oz 2.5" barrel titanium 44 Mag if anyone wants one, They are far ahead on developing new products. 2nd: price. 3rd Warrenty, they will fix it, no questions asked.

Anything can be polished to look pretty. Taurus is a cheaper gun. They are not know for selling real high quality guns. Take a Taurus out an shoot thousands of rounds through them and see what the are like then. The movements and actions are sloppy compared to a Ruger or a older Colts semi-auto. S&W has a pretty good gun too in the right models.

I have a matched pair of Colt 1911 45 ACP pistols. My father bought them and gave them to me while I was in Vietnam. I carried them both the majority if the time I was in the service. They are consecutive serial numbers. One shoots just a little better than the other. That pistol have had over 18,000 round fired through it. The other is over 10,000 rounds. I have kept a log of all the shots they have ever fired. The better of the two pistols just has had two clips and one firing pin in that many rounds.

Try that with one of the cheaper brands of pistols. I will guarantee that they will not hold up that well. I have shot a few Taurus pistols. They will not hold a repeatable pattern after they are hot. The actions will jam while hot and in dirty conditions much worse than a Ruger or Colt. You rapid fire them and they start to float. The barrels do not have the quality of the major manufactures. They are a cheaper pistol for an economy price.

I have a very good friend that is in the gun business. He is a licensed gun dealer plus a gun smith. He buys and sells thousands of guns each year. The older Colt 45 ACPs will bring right at a thousand dollars each. A Taurus copy will be worth half that price.

The original question was about how the Taurus compared to a Ruger. There is no comparison in quality between the two. One is a Cadillac and the other a cheap imported Yugo. A Taurus pistol is fine for someone that is not going to shoot much and just wants a display gun. If you are going to use it and beat the "H" out of it then go with a more main brand of pistol.

I own a few fire arms to include several Ruger products. My Rugers have been tough and dependable. The only people I know who own Tarus guns like to brag about what they have, don't shoot much and buy everything on price point.

While at a range with one shooting pistol at 50 feet was making his targets look like he was using a shotgun. He took a look at my target and ask me to look at his "Beretta" Tarus knock off. Didn't see anything wrong with the pistol so I put about 10 rounds through it and got the same kind of group I was getting with my 1911. He got mad and claimed I was just showing off. Big difference is that I have put thousands of rounds down range, spent time in the Army as a small arms instructor and shoot often. This guy is so tight that he only puts about 50 rounds a year through that 9MM.

Ruger sent me a replacement pin for my 22/45 when I lost it free of charge. Only person I know who has had problems with a Ruger had one fail due to him hot loading. Ruger did fix it but charged him for the repairs.

Not saying Tarus is bad but I wonder why anyone who owns one I talk to always adds in a conversation about them "well this had a problem but Tarus fixed that problem" or "Tarus has come up in quality".

Rick

The "Thunder 5" .410 revolver started selling in 1992.

My humble opinion, go Rugar and forget Taurus. I traded a 2 month old Taurus PT 24/7 9 mil for a new Rugar SR9C 9 mil. Also got the wife one. The Taurus never fit my hand the way I wanted it to and the shots were all over the target. Had to use sandbags to get close to the center. The Rugar came with adjustable backstraps and optional mag bottoms. Hit near center target everytime with the Rugar after around 100 rounds. No FTFs or FTEs with either gun. Just like the Rugar better.

Taurus has a life time garauntee. We have had several taurus'. Right now we have a 357 taurus revolver and we have put about 7000 rounds through it. It still shoots as good as ever maybe a little bit better. We have a Ruger SR9 we have put about 1000 rounds through it with no problems. We have several Ruger 22's and really like them.

I have a Tarus Judge. Had to send it back within a month of buying it. Cylinder would lock up. They fixed it, but will it work everytime, 100%, from now on? dont know.

Never had a single problem with any of my Rugers.
Bearcat, Single Six, or Blackhawk .357.

Gene

I have a Ruger semi-auto handgun that has been very good. Ruger 10-22 rifle has been exceptional.

Wife and daughter have small Taurus handguns. PT111 Millenium, and PT709 - both bought for size and concealed carry. PT111 isn't happy with my handloads unless I make sure primers are firmly seated. "Hammer" doesn't strike with much authority. Other than that, both Taurus's have been satisfactory.

I have a Tauras Tracker .357 with over 2500 rounds trough it. Not one problem. Very accurate too. I will not part with my Glock 27 .40 cal.

I can't comment on Taurus as I've never used one. I'm not impressed with Ruger and would never buy another. I had a couple of Mini-14's that were only good for 6" groups at 100 yards. Then I had a 10/22 that jamb so often I could never depend on it. I had a gunsmith work on it and it work for a while and then start jamming again.

I have a Taurus in 44 mag, and have used Rugers 44 mag in the Super Black eagle model, and to be honest with you I wouldn't trade my Taurus for two of the Rugers.

I bought a new ruger 357 about a year ago. Like the gun but it is sure stiff - hard to hold aim and get that trigger pulled. It is dual action but you'd be hard pressed to hit a target if you didn't pull the hammer first. I have only shot a couple hundred rounds with it so I am sure it will loosen up. Only had ruger handguns so can't compare. I am certainly happy with it (but wasn't with the price tag!).

I only buy USA made guns. So I stick with Ruger.

JD Seller. I take issue with your comment making us believe that firing 18000 requires little or mild repair. 18000 rounds would significantly wear our the lands and fill the groves with particle welded steel. That effects the accuracy in competition shoots. Barrels wear down with that amount of rounds pushed through the barrel with loads that are sometimes hand loaded beyond Mfg suggestion guide. Regardless of how much bragging a gun owner does, there will be worn spots in the groves and missing land configurations.Polishing pistols preserve the finish (if no Nichol wears thin)but polishing stainless steel has no effect other then cleaning dirt, grime gun powder.off the weapon. I own at least two Smith & Wesson firearms and can tell you the tooling is superb and fitting is immaculate. My Sons 480 Ruger is another example of fine quality workmanship.I say TO EACH HIS OWN. Preference of purchase belongs to the perspective buyer and should not be compared to others gun purchasers.Puts me in the mind of children singing "MY DOGS BETTER THEN YOUR DOG cause mine eats kennel ration yatta yatta yatta.Sure,different strokes for different folks ,so the saying goes, so I wouldn't try to present myself as an authority on any subject. Opinions are like belly buttons, everybody has one and none better then the other.Function is still the same for each of us. LOU.

U R correct sir, I had never heard of it.

IMO a "lifetime" warranty doesn't mean squat if your going to depend on the firearm to save your life, cuz once your dead the warranty won't do you no good.

That said Ruger has traditionally had better fit/finish/quality control than Taurus, I own one Taurus a raging bull .454 Casull and have fired many hottt hand loads through it and not had any issues (also don't use it for personal protection). I also own a few Ruger pistols and they "feel" smoother and have had zero issues with them as well.

Obviously you have never been around a Glock. There is no restriction on on cleaning solvents. Not that it matters, you never have to clean a Glock anyway, they have run them over 100,000 rounds without cleaning or malfunction. In my experience 1911s are picky eaters. Who cares if Glock dosen't have a lifetime warrenty, they never break, that sure beats sending a Taurus back to Florida, FedX overnight for $50. True, while beauty is in the eye of the beholder, the 40 S&W cal is a superior tp the 45 ACP, and the Glock has more than twice the payload of a 1911. That is in my mind, beautiful. For me, first a gun is a tool, Glocks are superior tools. Plus they don't come all dressed up and fancy like some of your guns, a real plus as I don't like all that gaudy stuff. Glocks are even the choice of former Marine R Lee "Gunny" Ermey.

(quoted from post at 19:58:11 07/21/12) Obviously you have never been around a Glock. There is no restriction on on cleaning solvents. Not that it matters, you never have to clean a Glock anyway, they have run them over 100,000 rounds without cleaning or malfunction. In my experience 1911s are picky eaters. Who cares if Glock dosen't have a lifetime warrenty, they never break, that sure beats sending a Taurus back to Florida, FedX overnight for $50. True, while beauty is in the eye of the beholder, the 40 S&W cal is a superior tp the 45 ACP, and the Glock has more than twice the payload of a 1911. That is in my mind, beautiful. For me, first a gun is a tool, Glocks are superior tools. Plus they don't come all dressed up and fancy like some of your guns, a real plus as I don't like all that gaudy stuff. Glocks are even the choice of former Marine R Lee "Gunny" Ermey.

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Well stated, Scott. Glock's are the arguably best semi-auto pistols made today in terms of dependability. Most handgun authorities would agree. Many, many law enforcement agencies including the FBI would also support that statement. They might be ugly, but they just shoot and shoot! When discussing handguns there's a huge difference between semi-automatics and revolvers in terms of function. They can't be considered equivalent tools.
Rick

Scott>Mother use to say when she was told stories that wasn't true."ANOTHER COUNTRY HEARD FROM"Glock owners are now wishing they hadn't bought the BRICK,Tupperware junk.Look on forum that trades,sells guns. Some describe glocks as trying to hold and fire a BRICK. Totally ugly and unforgiving piece of plastic that warps when trying to clean em with any good solution.It was so bad the Company Gun Scrubber had to come out with a synthetic version that is fine to use on Glocks,not the original good cleaner. Personally I wouldn't go to the range for shooting, if you never clean your plastic toy. KA BOOM lost fingers, eyes etc. Holly moley blind man, you should at least wash the glick er glock in the creek once in it's short life time. As for R Lee Ermy liking Glocks, so did Saddam Hussein, so look where that got him.He lost his head over a Plastic piece of junk. But like I say "To each his own". From your last line about gaudy stuff, does that mean you went to the dance with the most ugliest woman in town?? lol.
LOU

(quoted from post at 10:07:14 07/21/12) I can't comment on Taurus as I've never used one. I'm not impressed with Ruger and would never buy another. I had a couple of Mini-14's that were only good for 6" groups at 100 yards. Then I had a 10/22 that jamb so often I could never depend on it. I had a gunsmith work on it and it work for a while and then start jamming again.

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You just mentioned some of Rugers worst offenders. The biggest problem with Ruger is quality control, alot of time the guns are good but a percentage comes out that is just trash. Not only do the groups resemble shotgun patterns but they also tend to be jamb-o-matics. If you are the average buyer, you get an OK Ruger and when asked about it, you end up singing its praises, as this thread is proving. People like yourself that have owned several Rugers, the odds eventually go against you and you get a bad one. These problems are usually fixable, if you know what you are doing but should you have to? Why doesnt Ruger just do some quality control on known issues (10/22, mini-14 & 30, and the MK pistols come to mind).

I consider Ruger and Taurus pretty much the same, both will have some issues if you happen to get a bad gun. Taurus is great for the lifetime warranty. Ruger doesnt have a great warranty but they are pretty good about fixing stuff for you if you call and talk to somebody. They used to be good about just mailing you a part after talking to them on the phone but those days are getting so few and far between you can almost say they dont do it anymore. With either gun, since you are talking pistols, I assume it could be used as a carry pistol so I would shoot whatever you buy quite alot just to make sure its going to be a good gun.

(quoted from post at 05:01:06 07/21/12) I have a very good friend that is in the gun business. He is a licensed gun dealer plus a gun smith. He buys and sells thousands of guns each year. The older Colt 45 ACPs will bring right at a thousand dollars each. A Taurus copy will be worth half that price.

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To be fair, there really is no comparison between an old Colt and a new Taurus. Due to dismal sales, Colt had to go to low volume, high finish/quality 1911s. While it looks like Colt is taking a stab at more regular models again, for a while (other than the 1991) Colt was almost pushed out of the classic Colt 1911 business.

Now, if you make a fair comparison between Colt and Taurus, you gotta look at the modern 1991 and when you do that, its a very level playing field. Most people would just say flip a coin, others would argue till they lost their voice that anything other than a gen-u-ine Colt is nothing but a copy. Any way you slice it though, its simply apples and oranges to compair an old Colt to a Taurus.

I shoot a lot and have amassed a pretty good sized collection over the years. In my opinion Taurus can do a pretty fair job on automatics, but their revolvers leave a lot to be desired.
I have a 44 Tracker that Io refuse to sell because it is so bad I would hate to pass it off to anothe shooter. Bought it new, as I was wanting a k frame sized gun to shoot 44 Specials in. This thing has nevert seen ONE magnum round, and is falling apart. Been back to Taurus 3 times and is no better now thqn it was.
Thaat life time warranty doesn't mean much if it costs you $50 in air freight every time you have to send it back for them to try again.

Go with a Ruger, or my favorite, a Smith.

Lou as a Glock owner I will say I've never experienced nor heard of what your talking about. What are all these "people" getting on the poly frame that needs heavy solvents to remove??? I've got many thousands of rounds through my glocks and only ever give the poly frame a light wipe down as its never been that dirty.

Who cares what it looks like (its a useful tool not some polished safe queen)... I want a gun that I KNOW will work ANYTIME and EVERYTIME, and so far in my many thousands of glock fired rounds I haven't had any issues. I love tossing it in a backpack while hunting, its been in the rain/slow/salt/mud/dust/dirt/etc and still looks like the day I bought it many years ago (except for some holster wear), and still works like the day it left the factory.

If it wasn't so heavy it would be my fulltime carry gun. Instead I carry a 11.4 ounce .357 because I like being comfortable with my firearm as I put it in my pocket when I roll out of bed in the AM and don't remove it until I crawl into bed in the PM 365 days a year.

What Glock owners are you talking about. Glock ownes 65% of the US police market, and that # is growing. The FBI issues Glocks. Sir, all those departments are capable of figuring these things out, and for them money is no object. You should study history, the war in Iraq was not about Saddam Hussein using a Glock, no more than the invasion of Panama was about Noriaga using a Colt 1911. See where that got him. So keep up with your slams on Glock if you want, no one that uses Glocks will believe you. All problems related to Glock , and there have been very few, have to do with over pressure ammo. No, I didn't take the ugliest woman to the dance, but the one I did take I didn't take in a pink Cadillic with leopard skin seat covers, fizzie diece hanging from the rear view mirror and a plastic dog on the back deck thats head went up and down. As per your mom, you are "ANOUTHER COUNTRY HEARD FROM"

Thanks Rick, however wait till you shoot the new Walther PPQ, you may be backing away from the Glock is best idea.

Scott in SF, There are several gun forums, whose owners are trying desperatly trying to trade off. 1911 Forum is just one forum to look at to see the unsatisfactory reports from Glock owners. Your statement about who uses Glocks in Law enforcement agencies, is only because of the terrific break in price that is afforded to the Gov agencies.They probably buy them for $50.00 each, and are forced by departmental rules that the agents are allowed to carry, you have to remember,It's all about money.
You could have taken the second ugliest woman to the dance, depends on how many alchoholic drinks you consumed,as the country song goes," The girls all get prettier at closing time." If you didn't try to gnaw your arm off the next morning --- you're safe or need better glasses.LOL
I never said we went to war over Saddam Hussein and his Glock, but maybe that is what Bush meant by weapons of mass destruction.Cause Glocks destroy themselves quickly and anyone near a 12 ft radius.The saying is "ANOTHER" not ANOUTHER as you stated.MOM hated misquotations.LOL.It's a good thing she passed on, or there would be ANOTHER COUNTRY HEARD FROM..LOL
LOU

Boy did this open a can of worms.

1. The early MINI 14's did have a barrel whip poblem that has sense been fixed.

2. I own 4 Rugers. Mini 14 in 6.8 SPC that shoots under an inch at 100 yards. No malfunctions so far. A P90 in 45 ACP. Many rounds, shoots well no problems. 10/22 Got used, never had a problem. 22/45 22 pistol, again lots of rounds and no problems. Wife has a MkIII 22. No problems. Use to own a security 6 357, many rounds no problems. Sounds to me like someone is still mad at Ruger for going to low cap mags.

3. Most common mod to a Glock is a new metal frame. Not a bad gun but for guys who do a lot of shooting they have thier problems.....it's all online look it up.

4. 40 Smith is a good round but research still has the 45 acp as a better round. Look it up.


5. I have a Rock Island 1911.....picky on ammo????? No problems with well over 2k round fired. Both reloads and factory ammo.

6. For the first 6 round the most reliable pistol is a revolver. After that the quick change mag is better.

For those of us who own guns not only for recreation but also for personal/home defence.......are you willing to bet your life and the lives of your loved ones????? That's what you are doing! So what if you can carry 15 rounds. You miss but the bad guy hits......still 14 rounds in your pistol in your dead hand. Ain't doing your loved ones any good.

For you shot placement guys.....wake up.....someone is in your home......adrenalin starts flowing....like mad....causing to to shake.....stress level is up......causing you to shake even more. All of a sudden bullets are wisping past your head....causing you to shake even more.....now tell me about a one shot stop?????? I think that many people think cause they can punch holes in paper or beer cans think that they can deal with a situation. Wait till the bullets are coming from the "target". That makes it a new game. Fast bullets make a snapping sound....a mini sonic boom.....you can still hear the slower ones too. Now you are shaking....and ducking....now take up a good hold and return fire! With a gun that may fail to fire, eject or feed. Oh by the way......now stick your head up to take a good sight picture......in the dark! If you are a lazer sight user.....make sure the gun is unloaded.....have someone activate the lazer while you are down range.....it points right back to the shooter!!!!! So now that the adrenilen is flowing and stress is at an all time high.......pin point your location! Don't bring up SpecOps stuff. Spec Ops most of the time do not have to meet civvy standards for a good shooting. Not the way they are going to look at you if you have to take someone down in your home. Granted better in jail than dead.....but you are not doing your family any favors behind bars or dead! Again look up the laws of your state! Don't want t believe this???? Ask any Spec Op guy. Don't want to believe that bullets coming from the wrong direction will not affect your judgment or aim?????? Ask any combat vet!

Picture this... a drug guy enters a home...the 1st time anyone knows something is wrong is when the bad guy plunges a knife in the sleeping husbands heart....then rapes the wife...then passes giving her time to call 911.....this happened! A small barking dog could have saved him but no one knew something was about to happen! Could have saved her too. Bad guy was caught because he passed out affer the rape and was laying next to the dead hubby with a knife sill in his heart when the cops arrived!

Rick

Rick, You were the guy that claimed the first battles of WW2 were fought with 03A3 Springfields when Remington didn't produce the first one till late 1942. Also you claimed that the M16A1 shot a different Cartridge than the M16A2 when only the bullet and powder was changed. Either rifle can shoot either round. Now you are claiming the most common modification to Glock is a metal frame. Wrong, it is trigger modifications followed by sights. I have never seen a steel frame on a Glock and can't imagine why anyone would want one. People that are not combat vets successfully use guns all the time in self defense situations. I don't understand your point about getting killed and having 14 left in the mag, how is that any different then having 6 left in the mag of a 1911? I would Rather finish the fight with some left in a 15 round mag in my Glock than lose a fight with a empty 7 rounder in a 1911. When did Ruger go to low cap mags. I just bought a SR9 that came with 2 17 round mags.

Where, please do tell, did you get the idea that they are selling Glocks to police departments for $50. I am retired law enforcement and was working in admin when we switched from Smith autoloaders to Glocks. I know what we paid, that $50 is nonsence. If what you say is true, Glocks are dangerous and don't work and being forced on police for cost reasons, then the people behind the conspiricy shoud go to jail.Good luck with that. When we went to Glocks they were well liked by the officers, shooting scores went up and reports of weapon failures went down. Frankly, I hate dancing and would not go to one.

Scott in SF,
I didn't say that was what you paid, but what I said it is probably what your department paid per piece, and you are charged the extra.Look at nationwide Law enforcement agencies,which represents a remarkable savings advantage, and a remarkable hype for Glock sales to individuals.IE individuals who are suckers enough to swallow the hype of Glock pistols needs extensive therapy.Seems everyone want to be in law enforcement or emulate the cops who are forced to carry a Glock by Dept regulations. The only advantage is if one police officer is killed or wounded and his partner runs out of ammuntion, the surviving cop can use his partners magazine clip for reloading,without the worry of different ammo caliber or magazine design.Most cops carry a secondary,backup piece and most are not GLOCK,but PPK or 1911 designs. The marines just ordered a million or so 1911 design (metal) not plastic, to reintroduce back into Service.They don't like the Glocks.
You should have taken up dancing lessons,for a night out with women with only beautiful personalities going for them, thats why Arthur Murray was so successful in opening dance hall studios, giving these women a slight chance of happiness from guys who hate dancing.LOL In you younger days weren't you known as "twinkle Toes Scott"?The reason I ask is you have a way of dancing around the subject of Glocks.
As for officers shooting scores and failures, most cops I know like dougnuts with sprinkles,does that mean all other pastrys are not good for us little people? Also just because some can shoot better with one pistol and not another does not mean it's better for all,but just for that individual,only.
LOU

I didn't say that is what I paid, I said I know what the department paid. It was on open bids. The package included holsters, lots of extra mags and training both for the line officers and the armour guys. S&W and Ruger were a bit less, Baretta and H&K a bit more. The people that volunteered in the trials just prefered the Glock. Anyway, all bids averaged on either side of $1400 a unit for everything. A long way from your $50, and it was the people that were going to carry them that decided. However, any officer could carry anything he wanted, once approved, few did though. You may be amazed to hear this, but almost no police carry backup weapons. Have you looked at a cops belt. How much do you expect a guy to carry. Anyway, I think you need to see a psychiatrist, you have a irrational hatered of Glocks, seem a bit to fixated on my dancing abilities, and like guns a pimp would be proud to own.

Lou not sure where you get your information. Reading about a glock on a 1911 forum is like asking for chevy advice on a ford forum. I read on a glock forum that 1911's are evil and make you more prone to cancer. haha

Personally I think 1911 fans like yourself are nuts, who wants to carry an 8+1 round capacity gun that weights in at 30~40 ounces EMPTY, has an exposed hammer to snag and catch on clothing when trying to draw, has some crazy backstrap and thumb safety, and needs to be kept clean and dry because it isn't really an all weather gun....? Sure they look pretty in your picture but aren't practical for daily carry.

My glock 27 weights in at a little over 30 ounces LOADED with 13+1, has no hammer to catch on my shirt or pants when drawing, has no safety to remember to take off, and will fire after being subjected to some of the nastiest conditions on this planet. Sure its square, black, and bulky but it flat out works.

I didn't even bring up the point of field stripping, which can be done on a glock with one hand in about 2 seconds. Try that with a 1911. haha

Scot I acknowledged that you were correct about the M16. The info I was going by was what we were told BY THE ARMY when the A2 came out. I was on active duty at the time. No big deal, the Army has told people a lot of wrong things over the years.

My knowledge of the O3A3 came from a vet who was serving when WWII broke out. He said they were issued O3A3's in 1940. Guy was also a shooter on the the Army rifle team until 1960 and a gunsmith for them. My dad.

Yes a lot of people have defended themselves successfully. A lot have failed too.


I wasn't knocking the Glock. I should have said major mod, and yes people are changing to after market metal frames (which I find amusing). I do like the 1911 but there are other good guns out there. In fact the guys that most often say that they can do a on shot stop are guys who like smaller guns for concealability that carry fewer rounds than a 1911 shooting something like a .25 or such. Why do we see so many reports of police shootings where they fire a lot of ammo? Cops that bad of shots??? NO.......it's the factors that affect anyone who had lead flying at them. All the cops I know have to qualify at least once a year. They are not bad shots.

I know a bunch of retired cops and several active ones who carry/carried Glocks but I know 4 retired cops and 2 active cops who carry the 1911. One retired cop and good friend was chief of his department when they bought new guns by bid. Glock came in well under the other bidders. Really is good ad stuff when they can claim the number of cop shops that issue the Glock as a selling point.

Rick

Another country heard from. wondering who cares what you think. Go on and carry your p;astic brick, dont ever clean it, when it explodes in you hand brag about how many fingers and eyes you have left. Wonderful news to know your the absolute authority on any subject. Have a good day. LOU.

WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! To things your answer provided was the $1,400.00 package and the other was having the officer getting approval for a different weapon of choice.Ankle weapons as a backup weapon, proved to make the officer a lot surer when on a call.Now dancing proves to make a WELL ROUNDED ,intelligent individual,secure in his /her life style. lol.The mental picture you described about the convertible with the dice flowing in the breeze had me otflmao. Nice touch. LOU.

Yep, about $1400, including Glock provided training of the line officers, armourers, forensic people ect, training equipment like rubber pistols, videos, piles of extra mags,and a warehouse full of 40 Cal ammo, and a warrenty, so long as we use them they will service them for free. I have to wonder, is your imagination always so vivid, or only when you decide to stop taking your medication ? Do you always have problems following the conversation ? I never said any thing about a convertible. That is strictly a fabrication of your out of control imagination. Please go back on the Prozac before a Glock blows up and hurts you.

Ruger all the way... I've seen a few Tarus guns, they seem fine, but I definately see a big difference in quality versus my Ruger 357Mag LCR.