emergency generators

Last Friday afternoon a severe storm took out our electicity.Not going to be restored untill late Wendsday.WE used to be on REMC and if the power went out we were never down more than 24 hrs.After AEP took over ,its always days before power is restored!!We have a small gas generator. just big enough so we can keep the freezers and fridge going ,I ran a extension cord to the computor for today just to get online.OK ,My question is Im looking to buy a generator to run thr hole house and barns so we can pump water etc. what is your sugestions???? PTO run from tractor// or large stationary one?? Both have their advantages. PTO will be cheaper and 1 less motor on the farm to worry about.On the other hand , a stationary one would be esier for the wife to get going if Im not home.What do y7ou guys think??

if you go with the stationary one it can be installed so when it sense's the loss of voltage on the electric service it will disconnect from the incoming power service and start and take over on its own.

If you have a PTO. Will that tractor start when it is -20°F. Will it run all night on a tank of fuel. If Diesel will it gel. If an old JD will it run smooth enough. Oh yes I have been there.

If you have propane or natural gas I would go with a standby generator. With a standby your wife wouldn't have to do anything it kicks in when the electric goes out. They are great if you are gone and power goes out. I live in the same area that I grew up in. We have alway had I&M or as its called today AEP. When it was I&M we had very little problems with power being out. Now that it AEP the electric even in nice weather it goes out and takes forever to get back on.

Last year we used a generator for about a week.
We didn't need to run it ALL night. Turned it off
at 10 pm. started it up at 6 am. Depend on where you live. Depend on condition of your tractor.
Depends on where you can keep your tractor if you
are in the frigid zone. For me tractor PTO is the
best way to go. You are the one to decide. ggp.

Very interesting to read in the replies below that there are generators that kick-in by themselves when needed.

Will say that as a woman, that kind would be the type I would prefer if we decided to purchase one (and I wish we would - but for us it means installing a larger service to our house, so we have not done it yet).

My problem with the tractor driven generators is, do your tractors have safety shut offs? I wouldn't want to start a tractor, then head off for the rest of the day with out having safeties on it.

About 3 years ago, we bought a self contained unit. Should have sprung for the complete rollover set up, but this one cost about 5 grand, for a 12.5KW. We have 2 houses, shop, barn, and 2 wells we run off of it. 1 of the houses are all electric.

As an electrical contractor.....

1) do you want to be able to use it somewhere other than your home?

2) do you want automatic power, or do you mind having to go hook equipment up, get it out, and plug it in?

Even with a PTO generator....you would want/need a small like 5kW gasoline powered unit.....might have to jump start or plug in block heater on your tractor?

The cadillac would be a unit w/ ATS (Automatic Transfer Switch) It starts up with in 30 seconds, and you have full power to your WHOLE house. Also, It will do weekly test runs to make sure it is always ready to go!

Interesting replies. We live in a huricane zone, but only have a 6500 watt portable. When Dolly came through a few years ago we lost power for nearly a week. I would run it now and then to keep the freezer and fridge cool. Also to fire up the well pump so we could shower or flush a toilet as needed (filled a few buckets each time to leave nearby to flush with). We were working every day cutting trees that fell and to cool down after working we would hop in the truck and fire it up for a half hour or so, and also to charge up the cell phones at the same time.
We still have the same generator and I don't plan to do anything different in the future. Worked fine for us since we really didn't need all the creature comforts we thought we needed.
BTW, we have AEP and the service is great through them versus what we had before. We had many power outages for no reason before, but AEP came through asking permission to remove trees near their lines, and if permission wasn't given they simply trimmed them away from the lines. I gave permission to remove 3 palm trees that were taller than the power lines. The following week the folks they contracted arrived and removed them down to the ground, and hauled everything off. I had planned to hire someone to do this one day eventually, cost would have been about 4 to 5 hundred dollars. I have nothing to complain about. Neighbor had 7 trees about the same size as mine removed free too.
The pics below is the last tree removed. It was about 2 feet from the powerline and sat between the fence and the ditch which is 3 feet deep.

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I have a 5500 unit that also has 220 for the well i dont need any more than that just dont need everything. Boiler dont take much for heat and gas waterheater.

Not much that I can add.
It's ironic that I just got ours out and hooked it up, but the power is back on already.
So, it depends on your situation. Are you apt to be gone so that your wife would be left to get the power going?
As a crop farmer who is generally around home, with several old gas tractors, I chose PTO.
The idea of another(seldom used) small engine to keep running, fumes where you don't want them, limited power, cords, all are negatives to me.

The problem with a gas powered generator is-- if the power outage is wide spread, the gas stations may not have power either. You might have a long drive once you run through your reserve supply. Ellis

Though the cost may be more up front, and I believe the incentive/rebate you can get is still valid, a back up solar power system is something to consider.

Automatic back up, switches over without interruption, battery bank will last a good long while depending on size and electrical load, and they are easily wired for a back up generator in case the solar panels are not producing full power, load is discharging batteries down to the limit, you can bulk charge them back up in a short while, say before you turn in, then just run on battery power at night, repeat in the morning if its cloudy etc.

In this house, the system works great, so far the power went off for 6 hours, the 48V system battery bank reads 54 volts when power is on, full charge, after that 6 hours it went down to 52 volts, installer says it can go into the low 40's, before you should have to bulk or trickle charge. Only concern is discharging batteries beyond a certain limit, there is some kind of specification on the cycles of that and apparently it can shorten the life of them. The good thing is a system like this buys you a lot of time, you can manage loads from the breakers or switches. When power is on, the panels produce 690 watts per a bank of 3, (only have 3 myself, but plan to add more in groups of 3, I face south and am on a hill, full sun) This is producing power and lowering power costs, I am not sure how to read the display, but it seems with the load shown and what is produced, I'm still making some excess during peak sun, another benefit.

For back up to this, I have a Miller NT251 welder, 8000 watt continuous power, may not ever need to use it, unless extended power outage in summer, high temps. I can run a 8000 btu window A/C off the battery bank, the central A/C would likely deplete the bank rapidly at night or cloudy, but with that generator wired into the inverter, you could switch other loads off, cool the house down, then go back to the usual back up power mode, which common sense tells you to conserve power, don't use the stove, A/C, washer/dryer. I think with more panels and or larger battery bank, I could, but really not necessary, there are enough options to manage all needs, I really like this set up. Welder serves 2 functions, does all my welding needs and generates plenty of power, darned thing only cost me $1000 at a sale, had 1400 hours on it. I still have to add the extra hardware to have it wired in, but the system is designed for it to have another source besides the grid, installed is only a few hundred.

I have 1 chest freezer 2 full size refrigerators and 1 small refrigerator, nice to know you have plenty of time before you even have to think about spoilage, system runs the oil/hotwater furnance, and 220 well pump, all the above at the same time, but its rare to have all those on at the exact same time.

In summary, its a luxury to have this solar back up power, not sure what the service life will be on the panels and batteries, but was told that if the discharge cycle does not breach a certain, threshold, you balance them as needed, more so if straight solar because you use them a lot more, the system should last almost indefinitely, I'm skeptical of that, we shall see LOL !!

I had a PTO generator for over twenty years. What I found out was they are PIA. You will go months/years at a time and not need them. So they get pushed into the back of the shed so when you do need them you have to move stuff for half a day to get to them. Then twice mine would not work when I got it out. Something about the field being dead. The generator guy flashed the windings???? Don't have a clue to what that does. Second time I sold the piece of junk. I bought it new and it did not have 100 hours of use on it.

So several years ago I purchased a stand alone backup generator. It runs off of my 1000 gallon propane tank. It starts up within 30 seconds of the electric going off. It switches over automatically. I really like the fact that it starts and runs periodically to keep the batteries charged up and the motor running correctly. I have a 35K setup that will run everything here on the farm. Including the silo unloaders. I have about 15K in the setup but I have a lot more peace of mind with having it.

When I have the cattle yards full of cattle I have to have water 24/7 so I can't go for hours with out power to the well. Plus my wife has health problems. I don't want her to have to worry about things if the power goes off. She needs AC and her meds need keep cool. This way if I am alway from home I don't have to worry about things while I am gone.

We have many stages in place. We have oil lamps in the house, a generator I can fire up, an emergency hand pump for the well (might add motor some day), and we're getting a propane frig and a solar panel system to run a small electric frig and some outlets if needed (daughter is type-1 diabetic; insulin must be refrigerated). I want to depend on no one and have plenty of options. Just sayin'

I went with a PTO generator. I also have a 20 year old coleman 3200 watt that still operates just fine too. The PTO is rated at 50 amps/13500 run and 15000 surge. I bought a brushless type for the PTO and never had a problem having to excite to get it to operate and once set for 4 years. The tractor I use it on is 96 HP with 540 and 1000 pto. When generating I use the 1000 rpm PTO and run the engine at 1,200 rpms. Tractor has a Deutz engine and is easy on fuel. Also has full torque at 1,150 rpm's. So it handles the generator very good at a lower rpm. Tractor has a 40 gal. fuel tank so it'll run over 24 hours with no problem.

I use a mechanical interlock on the service panel so the main breaker can't be turned on while the generator is in use. Got enough cable and quick plugs so I can set the tractor about 100 ft. from the house and after getting the generator on the tractor I can be hooked up and running in less than 5 minutes. Can hardly hear the tractor running in the house. Anyway that's what works for me.

http://www.generlink.com/about_generlink.cfm

This is an entirely respectable unit that is low cost, safe and simple to use.
Up to 30 amp continuous so a 10KW generator is about max.
There is no excuse to run a tangle of extension cords through a door or window in the dark. This transfer switch will power up all normal lights and receptacles. No more running cords back and forth from freezer, fridge, sump pump. Or trying to tie into hardwired furnace or AC circuit.

I know it is hard but bite the bullet and buy a standby unit.That way the wife will be safe as she dosen't have to do any thing in a power failure. Everything is done automactily.

What you need to do. Is have the power company or an electrician. Take an AMP ready of your house. This way you will know what load you are dealing with. If you have a 100 amp load. I would buy a genset that can handle a 150 amp load. Good to have a little more power than you need.

The way the system works.
Transfer switch sees a power dip or failure.
It will after a small time delay.
It will start the generator.
When it detects the proper voltage. It will transfer to the generator.
When power returns it will goe through another time delay. To make sure power is stable.
It will transfer back to normal or line side.
Then the genset will go through a cool down cycle and then shut down and reset it self for the next failure.

It can be on emergency in about ten seconds depending on what you set the delay up for. Cooldown is normally 5 minutes. I would go with Kohler or Onan. Stay away from Generac. I know cheap to buy but hard to get anyone to work on them.Plus if you need parts be prepared to get a bank loan. If I can help you call me 903-536-2816.

Thanks for all the replys! All great veiws! Gonna check next week on prices on all types. AEP now says it might be late Wednesday before we get power.So much major damage and so widespread,its gonna take time. Thanks Doug

The cost of a stand by whole house unit makes me say no. But there is a unit that is 15K watts and is a portable, $2,500 which is $1,000 or so less than a 15k whole house style. I think Generac makes it. Runs on gasoline. www.northerntool.com

Since i don't mind having to move a few things and run some drop cord to the fridges/freezer, and have the furnace/well wired to be able to run them from a drop cord that's the method we use. Our power outages normally don't run over a day or so, but have been longer.Even in winter the generator can be off for quite a few hours before the house cools down enough to be uncomfortable. We don't have livestock to water so this works ok for us, and it's a whole lot cheaper than other methods. We do all this with a 4400 watt unit. I do think a bigger fuel tank on the generator would be good. Even a 3000 watt unit will keep fridges/freezers and a furnace running so you won't have spoiled food or freeze in the winter, it's just how convenient do you need it to be.

What happens if you are not around to move things? Ever keep track of the number of people smothered by CO when running generators with doors and windows open using extension cords?
I hope I never get so cheap as to make the family walk around in the dark over extension cords.

we are seling our 55000 unit 460 ford industrail motor on tri axle trailer with 300 gallon lp tank amd mercron switch ---has 480 actaul hours and all man uals 4950--this will power several houses we are in ky

ALWAYS run a PTO generator at FULL RPMs, whether 540 or 1000. Never turn it slower! "Full torque @ 1150 rpms" doesn't mean a thing. A generator had to turn a certain number of rpms to run at 60 Hz (i.e. 60 cycles). Running it slower will cause lots of problems in the long run.

dougf, where are you located, I was hit at 4:10 friday, we were gone to the Van Wert tractor show and decided to go across town to WallMart. in store 5 minutes when came on tornado warning headed toward us, got everybody in back room, was there possibly about a half hour. came out and all the cart corals were riped up and one put out the back side window of a van. realy had to hunt to get back thru town with trees down all over. Got power back sometime today and internet as well. Have a 3500 wast 110 only generator that have used 3 or 4 tines so far this year. Have to get up every 3 hours to put in gas. The refrige would keep cool longer but in this heat needed to keep fans running.

While the savings are not going to add up unless running the 1000rpm at 540 for a couple of weeks. It"s ok to save on the noise of a full rpm tractor in the yard.
As long as the throttle is set to spin the generator at exactly 60hz. It" will work with such an over size tractor vs. gen set load.
Try one of those watt meter thing ma jigs that indicate frequency. Many surprises out there on indicated rpm vs real rpm.

I missed the part about running the 540 gen. on the 1000 tractor shaft. Thought he was saying to run at a lower gen rpm. We are both right on the cycles, but I need to do a better job reading the post next time! LOL!