TV Antenna Advice

Well, after almost 18 years of living in this house, I'm finally going to have to do something about the TV antenna. The last storm Friday night/Saturday morning finally killed my signal reception to the TV. All my coax looked good, so when I went out and saw bits of aluminum antenna elements on the ground, and the coax hanging precariously off a dangling piece of antenna, I kinda knew what the problem was.

The point is, I don't want a monthly cable bill [or satellite dish bill], so I intend on replacing the antenna. The good Lord only knows how many years ago the previous owner of the house installed the antenna. If my eyes don't deceive me, there appears to be an antenna rotor motor up there, but no control wiring for it coming down the triangulated tower...which says to me that it's probably been here since the house was built in 1973.

The previous owner of the house set up the tower with a hinged plate, so it can be unbolted and lowered to the ground; and there's also a bracket just above the guttering to steady the tower at the highest point it can be done. Both are secured with bolts that are long-since rusted.

My plan is to install a cutoff wheel on my 4-1/2" grinder and just cut the rusty bolts, rather than play games with 'em...and then just replace 'em with new bolts. BUT...I'm figuring that it'll take probably 3 people to properly lower and raise the hinged tower; two on the ground to "walk" it up and down, and likely one on the roof to hold a rope attached to the upper portion, to assist the two on the ground.

[Or I could just tie the rope to the antenna tower, fasten the end to the riding mower, and position two people on the roof to handle the rope [with gloves, of course], and then use the riding mower to provide the actual muscle to raise and lower the tower.]

I also figure that, while the tower is hinged in the down position, it would be a good time to paint the tower, especially the parts I couldn't reach from the roof when I painted what I COULD reach back in 1995 or so.

Anyone have any suggestions or caveats about anything I might not have considered on this job? Since we lost reception just yesterday--or just NOTICED yesterday, when attempting to turn the TV on to watch the Kentucky Derby, after having some storms pass through the night before--my wife is getting kinda itchy about not having her TV for "her" shows...starting with the NASCAR race today...so I'm going to have to get this operation underway soon.

Any constructive suggestions are very welcome. [If you're just going to tell me to get cable or a dish, go ahead and forward me enough cash to cover about 5 years' worth of monthly fees, and I'll seriously consider your "suggestion."]

DO NOT USE a riding lawn mower to lower the tower unless you want it to fall!!!! When the tower gets to about lever it will just drag your mower around. Most lawn mowers only weight 600-800 lbs. So unless you have a real large garden tractor all you are going to do is get hurt. Your car or pickup would work better. The best would be a tractor and loader. I have used mine to lay my antenna tower down several times.

Also check the condition of the hinge. I had to rebuild mine because it was rusted solid. It broke when I was laying the tower down several years ago. Since I had it held with a loader I was able to control it to get it down.

Just be careful as the weight is more than you think. You can also use a long pole with your rope over the top to help hinge it down too. Look up how they used to stand up the old barn frames for a picture of how you use one. Basically when the barn frame was laying flat they would tie two ropes to the frame. One would be hooked to the top and then ran up over a pole then back to the ground. This way the rope was angled up instead of just sliding the frame along the ground. Then they had a rope going the other way to stop it from going too far over center.

We have an antenna at our cabin, on a different kind of tip down. I use a come-a-long to lower it as I am usually alone. I would recommend a working rotor as I understand digital signals make alignment more important. Find someone local to recommend an antenna.

The lawn mower idea is not a good or safe one. Poor brakes and lack of weight will get you or some one else hurt. Use a car or truck so you have the weight you need and brakes that will hold.
As for the new antenna I replace my moms a few years back with one that Radio shack sold that sort of looks like a flying saucer and she gets all the stations that are in this area and all come form 75 plus miles away so it does pretty good. Cost her around $100

I built my own 50 foot triangular tower out of pipe, and have moved it once, tipped it down several times. For tipping I use either a FEL with bale fork (tower between the forks), of a bale thrower wagon, letting the tower slide along the back side of the thrower box.

Need a new rotor, new RG-6 low loss cable, an antenna mounted amp with a FM filter. And a ultra deep fringe antenna rated for channels 7 to 51 such as the wineman HD7698P .
My old antenna is getting beat from the extreme local wind and a HD7698P is going up.
The long heavy 2 through 6 elements are not required for channels 2-6. Those frequencies travel long distances with the lowest loss and will still receive just fine on the shorter elements.
The long elements just add extra wind loading, ice loading and worst of all. They drag in FM analog radio signal which is seen as noise by the digital TV tuner.
An antenna without a rotor is a waste of time and money. The Channel Master unit does rather well with the 7-51 antennas.
A setup as described will make satellite dish owners upset and jealous with all the channels you receive in 1080HD for FREE. Dishes run either 480 or 720 lines of data.

What is your location? Somebody found and located an excellent tool from tvfool to local broadcasters, signal strength and beam direction.

http://www.tvfool.com/

http://www.winegard.com/offair/fringe-vhf-uhf-antennas.php

http://www.channelmaster.com/Television_Antenna_Booster_Preamplifier_CM_7777_s/92.htm

http://www.channelmaster.com/Best_Antenna_Rotor_Drive_Unit_Channel_Master_CM_4512931_s/62.htm

http://www.channelmaster.com/Coax_Cable_Antenna_Coaxial_and_Wire_by_Channel_Master_s/39.htm

I use a hand winch with several pulleys and a group of loops along the tower, prividing great leverage against the house where I have pulley mounted. Like another poster says, there's a lot of weight and leverage there even with a 20 or 30 foot tower. Add an antenna and a rotor, and you have a bunch of weight out there dangling.

I also had a storm afew weeks ago that raised heck with my TV signal.It blew the little transformer apart where the cable hooks to the antenna. We replaced that and every thing was good for about 10 days and then nothing again. The we found a spot where it had burned a hole in the coax about 3/4 of the way up the pole. Spliced that and that fixed it. I did have to replace a couple of other coax ends where I had some splice connections. We also lost a computer printer, TV, surge protecter,DSL filter, Antenna rotor,2 TV signal amplifiers,and fried a relay in my A/C in my shop. The storm was during the night and I never heard a thing but the damage got a little spendy. If you need a new antenna, the guy at Radio Shack showed me an antenna that they are selling alot of now. It doesn't have all those long elements that they used to have. He said they are no longer required for the digtal signal.

Orrrrr just call up a digital satellite company (Directv or Dish for a couple of popular picks), kick back and enjoy. Sure beats all the stuff we had to deal with back in the old days.

Mark

I discovered that I got 20 local channels without having to change the direction of my old antenna...so if I can duplicate the old antenna's directional orientation, why in the world would I spend the money for a rotor I won't be using?

Before the old antenna gave up the ghost, I got 20 channels. I got NBC, CBS, ABC, FOX, PBS, 4 "church channels, and a couple of independent stations. Since I can't get ESPN's NASCAR races for free with any antenna, I'm pretty satisfied with what I had; and if I do things right, I should have the same channels available again.

In fact, I got a couple of channels that DON'T show up here:

http://transition.fcc.gov/mb/engineering/maps/

Other than horse fencing, is there ANY topic on which you DON'T think you're the ultimate expert?
"An antenna without a rotor is a waste of time and money." Gee...I was getting 20 channels in 5x5 WITHOUT needing to use an antenna rotor; why should I spend the extra money, just because YOU think I need it...without ever having seen my TV reception without one? Cheez, I asked for ADVICE, not a freakin' LECTURE...

OK...waiting on you to send me the first five years' satellite fees. When can I expect your certified check?

I helped my neighbor with his tower. We used my JD A with a loader to let it down and lift it back. I wouldn't trust anything like a lawn tractor, there's a lot of force there when it gets at about a 30* angle and the loader handled it easy.

You lost me there. For anybody still getting channel 2 and 6 on the VHF band, they still need long 1/4 wave antenna rods for fringe reception. It is NOT just for wind loading.

Channel 6 is one of the few channels that still uses the original frequency of 84 MHz, from where it started. Transmitter is 60 miles away from me with many mountain tops blocking the signal. Channel 6 (WRGB) 1/4 wave is 3 feet long and that is the usual optimal length for a TV antenna. Better yet is a full wave if you've got room.

Channel "2" in my area of New York doesn't count anymore. It gave up its frequency on VHF in 2010 and is now RF channel 29 on UHF. The "channel 2" designation now is just for marketing purposes. A 1/4 wave antenna for the new UHF frequency is only 5" long. When it was VHF at 60 MHz, the 1/4 antenna for best reception was 4 feet long.

(quoted from post at 00:34:11 05/07/12)

In fact, I got a couple of channels that DON'T show up here:

http://transition.fcc.gov/mb/engineering/maps/

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That's because no low power digital stations are listed there, at least not when I check my area. You could be getting full-power stations that are not listed there, too. It sounds wrong, but this website brought to you by your tax dollars via the people at the FCC is a very poor place to judge (potential) reception by. TV FOOL and Rabbitears are much better sites.

Most towers are heavy. Always check for corrosion. Be safe.

AG

Use RG6 wire,a booster and the biggest antenna you can find and you should get good reception if you are not more than 80 miles from the TV stations. I have the the two piece booster and a rotor because I live 82 miles from the stations. You need a rotor because the digital signals can be finicky.

Buzzman72
The tvfool is very good for station location , direction and distance.
Try www.antennaweb.org/aw/welcome.aspx for information.
Also www.solidsignal.com for a source to purchase. I found them very knowledgeable and helpful, and the price was fair with a good selection. My antenna was damaged when I opened it, I called to ask if they could send me a replacement small circuit board that was damaged, they sent a complete replacement antenna and were very nice about it. They told me to keep the damaged one, no charge for replacement, I thought that was very good service!

To those who offered advice, thanks. I won't be using the riding mower...just not sure what I will use, since I live in a subdivision and don't have a tractor with a loader.

As far as the tvfool website, it's pretty accurate about what I can pick up. Now, the reason I suspect that I've been successful at receiving stations without an antenna rotor is shown on their maps and charts: every station that is in the red, green, or yellow areas for reception quality at my address are between 82 and 85 degrees from me, or just a hair north of due east.

EVERY ONE OF THEM.

Most of the towers are within a few miles of one another in the Floyds Knobs/St. Marys, IN area, on a hill overlooking Louisville, KY. The others whose towers are NOT in this region are not receivable in my area with conventional means. The tvfool website confirms this, by designating them in gray.

Within a 3 degree span, I really don't think an antenna rotor is worth the cost. So my initial opinion hasn't changed; rather, it's been confirmed.

Again, thanks for all the good advice.

When tv came to this area they had just one station.A fellow who was about 35 miles from the transmitter bought a 40 foot tower.He could not get a decent signal.He tried the top of the tower,halfway and every foot of the tower.No luck.One day when he was messing with the antenna his wife came out and said the picture is perfect.The antenna was laying on the ground.If Channel Master is still in business they made a good antenna.I have spent many hours walking a roof looking for the best signal.I was in Vermont in the early 60s,stopped for gas and asked the station owner why there were no tv antennas.He said no signal.They were in a mountain valley.

A around here channel 2 and 4 have better reception after I clipped the 2 through 6 elements down to channel 8-13 length. The reduction in FM interierence improved 2 and 4 reception even with some loss of 2 and 6 signal.

Considering you were about to hitch your tv tower to your riding mower. Obviously you need help. Tower installations with all the transmitters within a few degrees and not requiring rotation is uncommon and even rare. If you can't afford a rotor , controller and cable. I could send you a set. I do have my Ham Radio ticket. Plus experience with tv, ham and two way radio systems for the emergency response team at work.

The only channel 2 and 4 in Canada that's not transmitting on UHF now are the two stations from Thunder Bay, Ontario. Maybe those are your's? CHFD (RF4 VHF) and CKBR (RF2 VHF). I get them sometimes when in Michigan. A true 1/4 wave antenna shouldn't be affected by FM "noise" as long as you have an FM trap. But who knows? I've never had a problem and I still use a real channel 6 here in NY.

(quoted from post at 20:28:39 05/07/12) The only channel 2 and 4 in Canada that's not transmitting on UHF now are the two stations from Thunder Bay, Ontario. Maybe those are your's? CHFD (RF4 VHF) and CKBR (RF2 VHF). I get them sometimes when in Michigan. A true 1/4 wave antenna shouldn't be affected by FM "noise" as long as you have an FM trap. But who knows? I've never had a problem and I still use a real channel 6 here in NY.

Click to expand...

opulation centers of 30,000 plus were required to go all digital except for some CBC transmitters. In centers under 30,000 population the analog transmitters are stil operating. 2 and 4 from Wiarton, 12 from OwenSound , 8 & 45 from Wingham. 20 from Sarnia as well.