RANT the court system and Lawers now days

Well I have had a driveway to my place for 32 years as of July. Well back 8 or so years ago a guy buys the land I cross and says he can stop me. Well my dead says I have access and said access but he wants to stop me and my mom from going across his land. Now then 8K latter we still have no judgement and the judge who is over see this has been over seeing another case which has to do whit my mom so he should not be over seeing this plus the other lawyers when i had called them said conflict of interest but are still here so what is up with the legal system now days is it all run by who has the most $$$ Yep sort of upset tonight since we just got another bill for 2 grand the the lawyer has not gotten us anything but a year of driveway problems

Cost me $14,000 to get my issue with an easement settled. Judge ruled in my favor on all counts but it still cost me that to prove I was right. I know exactly what your going through. Tell your lawyer to move for a summary judgment and get it over with or they will keep on dragging it on.

Yep seeks as we get better as for things the laws get to the point they have no clue. So far it has cost more to get no where then I get in a full year. and still get no where. My deed says I have access and said access but now they say that is not an easement so what the heck is it then and back in 1976 when my dad got this place a lawyer wrote this all up but now getting hit with this bull

Who transferred the land to you with access across the land in question as a feature of the land as listed on the deed? You could sue them as your new neighbor is claiming rights purchased with the property.

Is the deed and easement recorded at the courthouse? If it is, just tell him to go pound sand. If it isn't, then you got a problem.

2 chances: your deed should list the right-a-way, and there should (have) been a note in the paperwork that the seller had for your new neighbor, land is subject to right-a-way.. If it is recorded somewhere, somehow, that's what will clarify that. You can did in public records yourself at the county clerk's office.....starting with nowaday and go backwards on both....
Is the new neighbor a fellow countryman or a town/city folk moving in?
Until it is settled, try to get a temporary order/ injunction barring him from not letting you cross.
Would moving the route change things for him???
Can you buy him out? Here in OK, if a person sells, the traditional, local custom is to offer it to the neighbors first.

The real issue is what HIS deed says. A legal easement will be listed on ALL the deeds that the easement is in force on. I have a house/acreage that is accessible by an easement. There are actually three of us adjoining land owners that have an easement on each other.

That easement is listed on all three deeds. It even has a legal description of where the easement is. That way none of us can build or block the easement.

The only issue we have ever had is the maintenance of the drive way. Two of us use the drive regularly. I use it the most. So what I do is pay for the load or two of gravel that we need each year. When the other neighbor uses it to empty his hog buildings ( about every other year) then he and I split the bill. The other land owner and I get along very well. He only needs the easement when he is harvesting his crops. He has another way in but it is too steep for loaded wagons. He only makes 4-5 trips fpr the whole year.

You need to know what the other man's deed has on it. Deeds are public records so you can go to the county court house and look at the recorded deed. If you want a copy there is usually a small fee but it is not too much. You also should see if your copy of your deed is the same as the one that is recorded. I had to buy a right-of-way because the deed I had did not match what was recorded. What is recorded at the court house is the only one that has legal standing.

Old, It's the system...Remember, ALL judges are lawyers, and most politicians are lawyers, if they settled things as simply and easily as they could, alot less money for lawyers would be generated, through, postponements, and other lawyerly games they generate millions and millions for each other.
My ex and I had an amicable parting of the ways, so we decided to do our own separation agreement and eventually divorce packet...eventually it worked and was alot less expensive, but if I had a nickle for every road block we ran into and someone (including clerks...as a matter of fact mostly clerks, so I assume there are kick backs from lawyers) said "you should really get a lawyer for this." At one point we called one and explained that we were doing a friendly uncontested divorce and just wanted to hire her to help hasten the paperwork jumble, she told us it would be unethical to hendle it for both of us, we would both need to hire a lawyer, "can I reccomend one for you?" Yet I regularly see several firms now advertising that they can handle uncontested's with one attorney. It's all BS!
I think that before anyone enters law school they should have to sign an affidavit agreeing that they will NEVER run for public office, they should agree that if they do they will be disbarred and face criminal charges. The Country would be much better off!

The biggest problem with Easements and Rights of Way is that the people who create them almost never draft them in enough detail to avoid changed circumstances problems in the future. Then everybody gets to pay a bundle to get a judge to fill in the blanks.

Got this through the search engine.
There are some other examples there which may not hurt to read.

Does your title insurance cover the easement? Probably not, but you should check your policy. No title insurance? Like the old oil filter ad, "pay me now or pay me later".

You may be right but the lawyers will get paid. Don't let them pull you in too far. How much land is this? If it's a small piece you may have to ask yourself if the dollars are worth it. This is a question only you can answer. I had a friend getting divorced several years ago that asked a lawyer how much a divorce would cost him and the lawyer said "How much do you have?" Good luck and sorry to hear of this. Gerard

Keep using it and let him spend the money to prove different. He most likly back off. I would fire the lawer that you have got, he's milking you for what he can get. I would have fired him after the first mounth.

"A legal easement will be listed on ALL the deeds that the easement is in force on" Actually maybe and maybe not grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Unfortunately references to easements on Deeds is often vaugue or even non existent. For example on most deeds I review for clients there may be only one sentence at the very end which says "SUBJECT TO DULY RECORDED COVENANTS, EASEMENTS AND RESTRICTIONS OF RECORD" thats obviously not a lot to hang your hat on but does suffice legally (and if there is one, even if not stated, it can still survive as a matter of law). NOTE what you described is the way it should be done (and the modern approach) and how I generally do things buttttttttttt thats so often NOT the case. Whats done now in a subdivision (all sorts of planning and zoning laws etc) is NOT how it was done for yearsssssssss out in rural areas.

HOWEVER if Im hired to prepare new deeds and there are easements involved, I carefully and precisely draft and describe the purpose and location and legal description etc SO AS TO AVOID THE TYPES OF FUTURE PROBLEMS RICH IS TALKING ABOUT. I take pride and joy in doing it RIGHT. When recorders or abstractors or title insurance companies see my deeds they comment for yearssssssssss to come future owners and abstractors and title companies will loveeeeeeeeeeee me lol I once presented one to our local planning commission for their review and they said from now on they were going to require all deeds to conform to the details and standards I drafted into mine (now Im afraid other lawyers will hate me for the extra work they have to do lol)

Even if the adjoining deed says nothing about an easement, that doesnt mean one doesnt exist (could have been acquired by prescription). While the Grantor can convey to the Grantee ALL his right title and interest, he cant convey anymore then what he actually has i.e. if he has a piece of land and the neighbor has an easement (by deed or by prescription) to cross it, when the seller sells that land that right of the neighbor doesnt go away just because the deed fails to mention it.....

Hope this helps, I always enjoyed the study and practice of property law, because after all ITS THE OLDEST AND MOST ORIGINAL AND BASIC LAW OUT THERE. All the johnny come lately laws came about to protect PROPERTY RIGHTS

God Bless and best wishes, sounds like your deed was done right.........

John T Attorney at Law

I would spend the money on a back hoe. Every thing he put up to block the road would get get torn back down.

If $$$ is an issue with you, oldiron, only fire your lawyer as a last resort. Once you go shopping for lawyer #2, their initial fee will be higher, since they are #2, with the "logic" that you are a difficult client, ...#3 will be higher than #2, etc....plus remember most of them play golf or drink beer together, and they WILL TALK to each other!

OLD, how about mediation? email me if that might be an option for you, work in that field. Glad to give some pointers.

In SC, the way I understand it and have seen a case like this, if you use the driveway for one year, it cannot be blocked. Saw this go to court a few years ago. Family was driving over neighbors property as a shortcut. Neighbor decided to block it and make them take their old longer route. Judge said if the owner had blocked in the first year he could stop them. If not, they could keep on using it.
Richard

Rich, sorry to hear of your problems and expense. While I practice (semi retired) in the areas of property law and estates and probate I dont litigate nowadays because its so much work and expense for my clients. I'm more into semi retired paper work law LITIGATION COSTS TOO MUCH.....Im just not into all that at my age and career (retired electrical engineer and farmer longggggggg before this semi retired law man gig) and stage in life...


Okay, 1) If you have used a neighbors land for ingress and egress the 32 years as you describe THE LAW SAYS (subject to a few technicalities) YOU HAVE AN EASEMENT at least by prescription. 2) If the easement was executed properly and is on the face of the deeds (was reserved for your benefit on that adjoining land) and they were recorded YOU HAVE AN EVEN "BETTER" EASEMENT. SO IT LOOKS LIKE YOU HAVE ONE SORT OR THE OTHER IN MY UNRESEARCHED YET PROFESSIONAL LEGAL OPINION. So being unresearched and even if so, thats worth NOTHING. Only a court of law can make that call no one here

If a client came to me with your problem and research established you had a legal written and conveyed easement orrrrrr you had an easement by prescription, my advice would have been to continue its use and force the neighbor to keep you out (without any breach of the peace mind you)

If your easement was only by prescription and the neighbor complained, then you would have more expense as we would have to bring an action to quiet title to judicially determine (court finding and order) existence of the easement.

Soooooooo sorry I cant help and for all your expense, from what you say you should have a slam dunk case (less so if by prescription but still likely) and I would have still advised you to continue its use and force the neighbor to obtain a court order saying you cant.

CAUTION NOTE (I cant know this sitting here) Just because YOUR deed says you have an easement to cross adjoining land THAT DOESNT ESTABLISH YOU CAN. The easement would have to be reserved on that adjoining land in your favor. I cant give you a deed that legally allows you to cross my neighbors land, but I can give the neighbor (if I sold him that property) a deed SUBJECT TO RESERVATION THAT ME OR MY SUCCESSORS CAN CROSS THAT LAND. See why its impossible to give you any exact answer here I WOULD HAVE TO RESEARCH YOUR DEED AND THE NEIGHBORS DEED. So be cautious of anyyyyyyyyyyyy opinions (lay or professional) including mine here of having any weight or value whatsoever.........

I still think you have an easement because even if it doesnt meet the legal requirements above sounds like you have acquired one over time with use, the problem is those type are more expensive grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Best wishes n God Bless

John T BSEE, JD Attorney at Law

When I first started on Y/T, about 5 years ago,
you mentioned this problem! If not settled yet,
I think that you've got a lazy lawyer!

They have got you bullwinkeled. A good lawer can get things done in very little time if they want to. Most of them try to get as much as they can from a novis but they don't try that with someone that's been around.

How did it even get to this point in the first place? People tend to put on a friendly face and try to be good neighbors when meeting for the first few times... Who provoked whom?

If you ever thought the legal system was fair,watch what's about to happen in the John Edwards case. He'll walk.

What exactly has the neighbor done to stop you?
Court pleadings, legal motions, stuff on the road. verbal altercations?
DOn't task your lawyer with anythin other than responding to legal matters. Wait for the neighbor to try to stop you, then repond.

What caused the new guy to try and stop you? he knew you had access when he bought the place, so why is he tryin to stop it?

Bad thing is this started over a year ago with the guy installing a cattle guard on top of the driveway in such a way few cars and truck could drive over it. He has been told to remove it but now he has installed it again and on top of the drive instead of in the road and of course it causing problems again but the judge keeps on putting it down for next time which of course then costs us more $$

In South Carolina if you use road that crosses another land owner's property for a year they cant stop you. It's called 'adverse possession' or 'easement by necessity'. I know because I went through what Old is experiencing. I left it up to the opposing landowner to stop me. I can't see how the laws could be so different in any other state.

sounds like the judge & lawyers are in cahoots to bleed the both of you for all you're worth! Seen that happen before.

ASEguy, From what Rich has said on here for a long time it is his whole farm even tho it may be small acording to some of you, and it not only includes all his buildings including his home and his Mom's home so it is not something small and worthless. If you had all the money in the world having to find new homes and moving would be a big hassel so the dollars are worth it. If it was only a couple of scrub acreas it could be different but loosing your home is a big deal and if you cannot get to your home it is a big deal.

Purchase the mineral rights to his land without him knowing it. Then the next time you have dealings with him, show him a legal copy of "your" mineral right to his property and give him a verbal warning that you will be sending some guys his way to start exploring for oil, natural gas, and coal which could result in strip mining. Tell him that your new partners, Tommy "No Nose" Lombardo, Jimmy "the surgeon" Giancano, and "Landfill" Louie Angelini are from Philadelphia, and will be over to talk terms over with him.

Mark

I was not aware of that.

One of the big problems here is these guy who now own the land my driveway is on had restrictions that they agreed with but since we have owned this place since 1976 we do not have the restrictions so they say we do. One of the things is I have a dump truck drive in and out at times of the year and they are now saying I can not do so but I have had it done long before they got there land so they knew about it plus I run a private repair shop here and have for 30 plus years and they say I can not do so