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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

V belt angle : standard vs. JD

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Greenfrog

08-05-2020 20:53:17




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I think standard v belts are 40 degrees. I was told that JD belts , as in lawn mower belts, are different. Any truth to this? The angle is different and doesnít run properly on the faces of the pulley.




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tractorguy2

08-06-2020 18:58:44




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
I've repaired lawn mowers for 35 years. Have learned the only belts that work on John Deeres is John Deere. I hate to see John Deere mowers come into the shop. It's a pain to drive the 45 miles to Deere and their belts are way over priced. When ever possible I send the customer to John Deere so they can pay for the belt. When they come back I get an earful and how much that $#*^& belt cost!

On all other mowers I use Prime Line belts. The only time I ever had a problem was last summer on a 42" Craftsman 22hp. The guy was trying to mow weeds taller than the kitchen table. He insisted on mowing as short as possible. Every time he plugged the deck it would burn the belt off before you could pull the lever back. I put two belts on it. Then he took it to the gas station where they put one belt on. He burned it off. Never did get his yard mowed. This summer his yard is five foot tall.

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Greenfrog

08-06-2020 18:49:34




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
Interesting discussion here guys. Good info here for everyone. Much to be gained. Yes, those Kevlar belts cost more but last longer. I too, have to add that belt that I buy from the dealer do better. I too have an old CC and I know that the mule drive belt has to be tough. Are you aware that some v belts are not designed to be run on the top/back side...as in ...over an idler pulley??



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DoubleO7

08-06-2020 18:37:12




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

I will backup DrEvil's post on Cub Cadet mule drive belts.

At least the Cub Cadets from the first one until MTD bought the brand from IH in 1981.

None of which used kevlar belts because they did not exist.

But an OEM belt, whatever it is made of and whatever shape it is will out last all others by years.

John Deere probably unfollowed IH's que to make the belt just odd enough from industrial standards on purpose.

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gab

08-06-2020 15:05:33




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
I get about three years out of a Wheel Horse pto belt compared to one on a plain old belt. Also JD variator belts just work better and both need to be replaced at the same time.



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David G

08-06-2020 11:02:45




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
I do not know about the angle, but mower belts are much tougher than standard v belts so they can stand the shock of the electric clutch engaging.



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DR. EVIL

08-06-2020 05:55:31




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
I've got no experience with Deere belts, but from the reading I've done on the internet, Deere belts seem to work best on Deere equipment. I needed a new "Mule Drive belt" for my Cub Cadet 129 with 44 inch mower deck. Probably 100,000 similar tractors and mowers in use back then. I thought my dealer was high on his price. Our Wisconsin Bearing salesman came up to see if I needed anything, I worked in Purchasing at a major food/chemical processing equipment company. Salesman had been pushing his Gates and Dayco belts over the brand I had been using. So Saturday I go and buy a properly sized DAYCO belt, install it, start the tractor, engage mower, belt is the one that runs from front of engine down to two idle pulleys and back to top pulley on the center spindle of the mower. In about 4-5 seconds the belt jumps off the idlers, I shut things down, reinstall belt, try it again, and again, 4-5 times. Finally the belt shredded, I went to my Cub Cadet dealer and paid $30 instead of the $5-$6 the Gates cost. Installed the IH belt, started tractor, engaged mower, worked great, mowed the lawn for 4 hours! Monday morning the Wisconsin Bearing salesman called me to see how my cheap Gates belt worked. BOY did I give him an ear full! The starter/generator or snow blower belts I will use an non-OEM belt, they don't twist and turn. I have found that as tractor HP increases those mule drive belts life expectancy decreases ALOT. With a 7 or 8 hp engine they last for decades. With 10 hp 5 to 7 years. With 12 hp you can slip the belt in tall grass but with care you can get most of a summer from them. With my Hot-Rod 14 hp I have burned the belt up in a single mowing.

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Russ from MN

08-06-2020 07:18:14




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to DR. EVIL, 08-06-2020 05:55:31  
For $6 you did not get a Kevlar belt, and that's what you need for that application, and they can be bought online for a good price, but not $6!



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DR. EVIL

08-06-2020 09:54:29




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Russ from MN, 08-06-2020 07:18:14  
Nope, was just a nylon cord belt. My Zero turn I mow with now has belts that all run straight, they do run one on an idler on the back side of the belt, but 5 years and a bit over 180 hours and neither factory belt shows ANY sign of giving up, no wear showing at all. One new Kevlar belt was $80, other was $100.

The mule drive belt IH/Cub Cadet sells is not a kevlar belt either. In fact about 4-5 years ago CC had a design change on their most common mule drive belt, reduced the width from 7/16" to 13/32". It runs deeper in the pulleys, slips easier. I stopped mowing with the tractors that used that belt. I was mowing 6-7 yrs ago with my 982, I knew the mule drive belt (also not Kevlar) was getting used, was mowing grass over a foot and a half high, looked ahead of the tractor, cloud of blew smoke blowing out the grill, was coming off the belt, slowed down and turned to take half a swath with the 50" deck. Next time I visited my dealer got a new $60 replacement. The belt that drives the two outer spindles typically lasts 3 (three) times as long as the mule drive.

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wgm

08-07-2020 20:10:04




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to DR. EVIL, 08-06-2020 09:54:29  
The Dixie Chopper I bought new in 2005 still has the original industrial grade belts on it.



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dr sportster

08-06-2020 05:41:22




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
Check in Machinery Handbook .If I recall making pulleys for my early Hemi I set the lathe at 18 degrees for a 36 degree pulley. Standard auto belts.



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Duner Wi

08-06-2020 05:04:02




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
I have read on the internet JD belts are 37 or 38 degrees. Don't know if it is true. My JD that have to shift from forward to reverse does release better if I use genuine JD belts. Deck belts I can't tell a difference.



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cwtech

08-06-2020 04:53:40




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
V-belt angles vary between 30 degrees to 41 degrees.

Most common are 38-40 degrees.

Sometimes equipment manufacturers use special (odd) dimension belts to make you buy replacements from them.



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timcasbolt

08-06-2020 04:01:35




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to seeI've heard that too, but tend not to believe. Sounds like snake oil to me.



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Butch(oh)

08-06-2020 03:58:41




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
Some mower applications require a belt with special properties, others work fine with standard off the shelf belts and there doesn't seem to be much ryme or reason to it in my experience. For what a person saves it is usually worth a shot to try a regular belt, The blue belts at TSC seem to be better than the black ones when used on a mower deck.



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johnlobb

08-06-2020 03:21:52




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Greenfrog, 08-05-2020 20:53:17  
I've found that OEM belts last longer and seem to work better on any garden tractor I've worked on...



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Mike M

08-06-2020 05:57:24




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to johnlobb, 08-06-2020 03:21:52  
I agree. I learned years ago to save time, money, and aggravation to go to the OEM and get the proper belts from them.



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daisyman

08-06-2020 08:50:28




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 Re: V belt angle : standard vs. JD in reply to Mike M, 08-06-2020 05:57:24  
Many years ago, I bought a name brand drive belt for an 8 speed, C-120 Wheel Horse from our local auto parts store when the dealer was closed. Put it on and it wouldn't stop so you could shift it. Went back to the dealer when he was open, got the OEM belt and it worked perfect. Oh, and it was $4.00 cheaper. Sometimes close ain't good enough! I do, however, use some of those Kevlar belts for decks and things like that , but mostly use OEM.

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