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Tool Talk Discussion Forum

97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2

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old

09-12-2018 15:45:11




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So here is what I have done. New body to battery ground. New engine to battery ground. New 10 gauge wire form alternator charge stud to + side of battery. Spliced into the excite and sense wire and checked voltage at them when running and get battery volts of around 12.5. When running battery still only reads in the 12.5-12.9 volts range. If I touch the excite and sense wire to the + post of the battery no change. So what am I missing?? The only thing that it seems it can be is a bad new alternator.

Also not that I wanted to but while testing the starter went bad so have to replace the starter today.

Any ideas?? THANKS

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chcase

09-15-2018 08:49:11




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Old, Hang in there as wire issues can make a person really upset at times. My advise is to have alt retested. (I am sure you can unbolt the alt with your eyes closed by now) Replace the pigtail with a new one and add a wire on each splice for testing in future.If you don't own a very good wire cutter,crimper borrow or buy one.Please use the high end splice connectors and heat shrink covers.Have battery retested at the same time as alt is.Once everything is reinstalled,Then you can check voltage at your test leads (wires) Good luck and post back

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old

09-15-2018 10:22:57




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to chcase, 09-15-2018 08:49:11  
Have new plug on order by way if a friend. As for doing the wiring I hope to use solder to do the splices so as to know there good and will not come loose. I was pretty good at soldering when In the navy so should still be able to do a good job and yes heat shrink



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Mule Meat

09-15-2018 08:23:57




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Just go to DB Electrical and get a single wire 10si type alternator and be done with it.

One wire from the BAT terminal on the alternatir to the postive battery post and you are done. U

Unless you wish to run it through an Amp or Volt meter first then to the battery.



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old

09-15-2018 10:26:46




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to Mule Meat, 09-15-2018 08:23:57  
No way to mount a Delco 10si on it due to space limits and mounting problems. If it was something that could have been done I would have done it 2 weeks ago. A Delco 3 wire cost is around $45 and the one this calls for is $125.



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DoubleO7

09-14-2018 17:46:41




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
I was out to an auction today and so could not say..............

I spent a good hour or more trying to find the connector.

The one I posted is made to fit all of those alternators listed in my last post.

I suspect it has three wires because some applications require three.

Neither Dorman nor Standard Motor Products had anything.

Does your 97 have this three terminal round connector?

But only utilizing two wires/terminals?

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old

09-14-2018 20:51:04




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to DoubleO7, 09-14-2018 17:46:41  
If you look at it from the female end yes it has 3 but only 2 are used. But it look like the 3 wire on will work I just need to be sure to hook up the 2 wires correctly. A friend has it on order so the worse it could be is a $12 gamble. Alternator stopped charging again today by the way. Did not get a chance to look at or play with the wires to see if I could make it work again because it was to hot engine wise to do so

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ChasK

09-14-2018 10:53:47




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
This is the part # of the pigtail on the link.

Brand: LActrical

Manufacturer Part Number: 30016320A,30006109A



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old

09-14-2018 12:07:09




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to ChasK, 09-14-2018 10:53:47  
Thanks for trying but that part number does not come up so O'Reilly's could get it.



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MtMan

09-13-2018 20:49:03




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Old, Thanks for the posts of your trouble shooting and hopeful repair job done on your 1997 Geo Tracker. It was very interesting to me and Hope I learned something along the way. God Luck to you and your family and Thanks again



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DoubleO7

09-13-2018 17:18:13




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Does it look like this?



Suppose to be for these alternators (part numbers):

GENERAL MOTORS # 30016320,30006109

MITSUBISHI # A5TA0791,A5T07091A,A5TA0791ZC

BOSCH -REMAN # AL4500X

SUZUKI # 31400-50G10,31400-60A21

$12 on ebay https://www.ebay.com/itm/ALTERNATOR-REPAIR-PLUG-HARNESS-3-WIRE-PIN-CONNECTOR-FOR-GEO-TRACKER-1989-1997/292161762476?fits=Model%3ATracker%7CMake%3AGeo&epid=2142796346&hash=item440632b4ac:g:R14AAOSwu-BWO3f1





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old

09-14-2018 17:21:31




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to DoubleO7, 09-13-2018 17:18:13  
A friend of ours who also works at O'Reilly's has that on order from eBay. I've known this gal for over 34 years now and way back she would baby sit my youngest daughter who is now 34. By the way it has stopped charging again



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old

09-14-2018 09:43:50




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to DoubleO7, 09-13-2018 17:18:13  
All the number you have listed come back to the alternator not the 2 wire round plug that I need. Just got off the phone with O'Reilly's and all they can see if they go back to the alternator numbers



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old

09-13-2018 17:28:03




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to DoubleO7, 09-13-2018 17:18:13  
Close but I do not see the hold down tab and it only has 2 wires but has a place for the 3rd wire



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DoubleO7

09-13-2018 12:48:44




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
If that alt. is down low on the engine and getting any road splash, maybe the connector and/or the wires are corroding at the crimps and/or inside the wire insulation?

Your moving the wires around might have reconnected enough strands to work again.

Maybe



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old

09-13-2018 13:09:33




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to DoubleO7, 09-13-2018 12:48:44  
It does sit pretty low on the right side of the engine. Starter is lower but not by much. And yes with my driveway being as it is good chance water has hit that plug a few times to many



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Carls70

09-13-2018 11:37:46




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Ditto on the new pigtail repair harness from Carquest. It is probably giving you an intermittent open right on the terminals in the ALT. I run into this frequently on older engines/boats/vehicles.
IMHO use Good Quality heat shrink butt connectors with a good ratcheting crimper tool or solder & good adhesive lined shrink tubing.

Good Luck Old!

Carl



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old

09-13-2018 12:20:43




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to Carls70, 09-13-2018 11:37:46  
Problem is there are no carquest stores in this area. We have an O'Reilly's and an auto zone or as I call them auto clones. The auto zone place is about as useless as a shovel with out a handle or in other word the people working there cannot find any thing unless it is in the computer and they know exactly what it is and what it is called



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ss55

09-13-2018 10:44:15




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Is the battery fully charged? Try a battery charger to fully top off the battery and then watch if the alternator will keep it charged or if the battery looses charge when you drive.

12.5 to 12.7 volts is about what you should have with a fully charged battery without the engine running. With a fully charged battery and the engine running it should be around 14.7 volts.



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old

09-13-2018 11:08:23




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to ss55, 09-13-2018 10:44:15  
Since this problem started I have been putting a battery charger on it every evening so as to have a full charged battery the next day. So battery should be full charged. Do not know for sure what I have done but a little bit ago I messed with it some and now when running I am getting 13.8 plus volts at idle which is a big improvement from what it has been



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ss55

09-13-2018 12:35:53




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-13-2018 11:08:23  
If the battery is good, and the alternator is working right, I would look for drain on the battery when the vehicle is shut off: a radio going bad, a starter with a lot of carbon dust causing a small short, a light bulb that stays on, etc. With the vehicle shut off, remove one of the battery cables and put an amp meter between the battery and the cable to see how large the current is. If there is a battery drain, try adding a battery disconnect or removing the ground cable when the vehicle is parked, and see if the battery holds a charge longer.

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old

09-13-2018 12:42:44




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to ss55, 09-13-2018 12:35:53  
When parked I have had no problem with a battery drain. Up till a few days ago we had little to no problem with the battery and charging system. But yes if the front door is not closed well the over head light in the thing can drain the battery if not seen and let sit over night. I did also change the battery with one out of my Oliver 77. I haven't used the 77 in a couple years and figure might as well remove the battery and use it in her car and if I do use the 77 I'll just use the battery from her car

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Bob

09-13-2018 11:12:15




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-13-2018 11:08:23  
HANG IN THERE, old! And stick around! ;-)



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old

09-13-2018 11:17:22




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to Bob, 09-13-2018 11:12:15  
Bob did you see the answer I posted about where I had done the splice into the 2 small wires so I could then check voltage to them when running?? By the way I have 12.5 or so volts on both when running. About 30 minutes ago I did the magnet test with a hard soda cap and it help the cap in place. I then checked voltage on the battery while running and had 13.8 plus volts so maybe it is working now. Not sure what I did other then spray the 2 wire plug out with carb cleaner spray so maybe that was enough to clean a poor/dirty connection

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Bob

09-13-2018 11:24:16




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-13-2018 11:17:22  
Yes, I saw that post.



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GEO-TH, In

09-13-2018 10:04:59




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Old, ask the people who tested your alternator if one of the small wires goes to positive and those other goes to ground, negative.



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old

09-13-2018 10:31:53




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to GEO-TH, In, 09-13-2018 10:04:59  
Wiring diagram shows both small wires are hot with ignition on and testing them show that also. Not sure what I did but did a magnet test with a hard soda cap and it stayed in place with engine running. I then checked battery voltage with it running and now have 13.8 plus while running. Don't know if it was me pulling the 2 wire plug back out and spraying it with carb cleaner spray or me messing with and moving the wires around but it is working as of right now

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Geo-TH,In

09-13-2018 14:24:35




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-13-2018 10:31:53  
Sounds to me like you need a new 2 wire plug. Good chance the contract are rusty.

If you can find the plug you need at Napa, Auto Zone, Advanced Auto let me know what the part number is, I'll go to town and mail them to you.

I think my carquest went out of business.



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old

09-13-2018 14:32:19




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to Geo-TH,In, 09-13-2018 14:24:35  
What I can see of the plug the contacts look good but one cannot really see in it all that well. I talked to the manager of O'Reilly's today and he cannot find that plug listed any place and he tried a couple of the other company sites and came up with nothing. So I hope the guy who said car quest has them can give me the part # and then the local place can get one



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grizz02

09-13-2018 09:39:36




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
does the I idoit light go out when you start the car? does batt voltage change if you rev the engine ?



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old

09-13-2018 10:27:13




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to grizz02, 09-13-2018 09:39:36  
Idiot light is on when ignition is turned on and engine not running. Idiot light goes out when the engine is running and up till a little bit ago if I checked voltage to the battery with it running I got around 12.5. Why I say a little bit ago is I just messed with it some and pulled the 2 wire plug out and sprayed it with carb cleaner spray and put it back in and now I am getting around 13.8 volts when it is running. Al I can figure is clean it and messing with it did something to make it work but I'll not hold my breath as to how long

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DoubleO7

09-13-2018 09:20:45




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
I am out of suggestions, but when you find the problem, hopefully your palm will not be greasy as you slap yourself in the forehead for not finding the problem earlier. :oops:
p.s. the above is an attempt at humor.

Good luck, and be thankful it is not a newer vehicle as they just have too many doodads to confound any attempts of fixing something yourself.



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old

09-13-2018 10:44:13




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to DoubleO7, 09-13-2018 09:20:45  
Not sure what I did but as of a few minutes ago I have it working and had a voltage reading while running of 13.8 volts. I did the magnet test with a cap off a hard soda bottle and it held it in place while running. I then checked voltage at the battery and got that 13.8 plus. It my have ben me moving wires around or me spraying carb cleaner spray into the 2 wire plug.



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old

09-13-2018 09:26:23




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to DoubleO7, 09-13-2018 09:20:45  
As for the grease on face well your to late. LOL Did that the other day when a bug landed on my face and I slapped it. I have at least one more option I am going to try here in just a few minutes and that is to pull the stock 2 wire pig tail and use the 2 spliced in wire instead of the pig tail and see of maybe it isn't a bad plug in



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tech4

09-13-2018 07:52:38




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Are you sure that the belt or pulley is not slipping? Any chance the switch and light wires have been reversed?



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old

09-13-2018 08:51:58




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to tech4, 09-13-2018 07:52:38  
Belt is good and tight checked and double checked. As for the 2 smaller wires both when ignition on show 12 volts and both as of right now have spliced in wires so I can go straight to the battery to check and test



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tech4

09-13-2018 09:32:17




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-13-2018 08:51:58  
The light wire is in series with 12 volts and it does not have enough current to drive the field. You need straight 12 volts from the switch. It is not going to work if the two wires are transposed.



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old

09-13-2018 10:35:22




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to tech4, 09-13-2018 09:32:17  
Yes I understand the wires cannot be switch with each other or things will not work right. Not sure what I just did but it is now showing 13.8 plus volts when running. But I will keep a close eye on it till I know for sure it stay working



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Retired Farmer

09-13-2018 07:04:53




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
I kind of skimmed thru YouTube last night. A couple of videos mentioned something about an updated alternator kit for the Tracker. Are you sure you are getting the right alternator for your application? Maybe the store is giving you the wrong one.



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Geo-TH,In

09-13-2018 05:14:29




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Use jumper cables and connect ground to alternator. I've seen generators not charge because of rust.

Are you using a new alternator?

Electrical gremlins can be a Royal Pain in the ankle and points higher than the ankle.



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old

09-13-2018 08:49:18




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to Geo-TH,In, 09-13-2018 05:14:29  
I know for sure the alternator is grounded well because I use a simple short test to check. I.E. took a jumper wire from the charge stud on the alternator to alternator case and got the sparks I should have gotten when I shorted it out for a moment



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dim

09-13-2018 03:54:45




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
I ran into problems like this. The newer one are not wired like the older ones. On the newer ones the regulater turn the idiot light on and off. make sure you have the right wiring diagram. good luck.



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old

09-13-2018 08:46:40




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to dim, 09-13-2018 03:54:45  
I have 2 wiring diagrams for it. One in the Chilton's manual and one that was printed off by a guy I know who has a auto repair place. So I am pretty sure I have the right one. By the way the idiot light does go out when the engine is running just not charging



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dim

09-14-2018 03:52:29




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-13-2018 08:46:40  
If its the old set up the only way the idiot ligt can go out is if its chargeing. So you must have a newer set up where the regulater controls the idiot light.



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old

09-14-2018 08:46:24




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to dim, 09-14-2018 03:52:29  
Don't know which way it is set up just know before I got it working that I could only see 12.5-12.9 volts on the battery when running but after cleaning up the plug with carb cleaner and playing with the wires I have 13.8 plus



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wrenchere85

09-12-2018 22:33:54




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
After all your checking. I would remove the alt. and take it somewhere to be bench tested. Then if found bad I would have a new alt. bench tested before I installed it. Good luck and don't let them get to you.



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old

09-13-2018 08:43:41




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to wrenchere85, 09-12-2018 22:33:54  
The one on it right now was bench tested before I even left the store because the first one I put on did not work as it should so already been done. But yes it could have gone bad just because it can happen



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JD Seller

09-12-2018 22:24:51




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Old CARQUEST can easily get you a wiring plug and pig tail. I just looked on their site, well actually Advanced Auto's, site. I am 99% sure they have the plug/pigtail your needing.



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old

09-13-2018 13:06:47




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to JD Seller, 09-12-2018 22:24:51  
Any chance you can get me the part number from one of those places?? I just talked to the manager of O'Reilly's and also another guy who runs a local shop and neither one can cross over a number for that part. I was told if I can come up with the part number that he should be able to cross it over and then get one
THANKS



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rustred

09-12-2018 20:55:28




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
well... i would make my own harness and plug it all into the alt. with 12v exciting it, then install alt. then start engine and bingo... batt. is charging. plus get a fluke meter to get your readings instead of a piece hillbilly haywire. have you even checked the harness for continuity making sure the plug ends are good,?? you said troubleshoot before replacing parts. maybe remove alternator and send rest of unit for recycle.

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old

09-12-2018 21:10:34




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to rustred, 09-12-2018 20:55:28  
Go back and read please. I have checked and double checked things and I have battery voltage where I should have it but no charging. This it the 2nd new alternator and if you read you will see I have trouble shoot and used a VOM. As for hillbilly if you cannot address a person with respect DON'T do it at all



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JMOR

09-12-2018 20:51:35




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Since you can't trouble shoot it, just tell the wage earner of the family to buy herself a new car and be done with it. After all, SHE IS THE ONE THAT NEEDS TO GO TO WORK. 8)



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old

09-13-2018 08:32:51




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to JMOR, 09-12-2018 20:51:35  
So if you so smart what type of work does she do?? How much does she get paid by the hour?? How many hours doe she work?? Where does she work?? You do not have a clue so your just acting as any other bully on here



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Dean

09-13-2018 06:30:16




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to JMOR, 09-12-2018 20:51:35  
I've been staying out of this but that's good advise, JMOR.



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rustred

09-12-2018 21:03:49




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to JMOR, 09-12-2018 20:51:35  
LOL. get a a "smartcar".



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Steve@Advance

09-12-2018 19:52:47




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
Is this one of the alternators you had tested?

This uses a Nippondenso alt from what I looked up.

That has a 3 connector plug, did you temp jump all 3 to the battery? Are all the connection in the plug good?

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old

09-12-2018 20:11:38




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to Steve@Advance, 09-12-2018 19:52:47  
While the alternator appear to have a 3 wire plug only 2 of the 3 are used. You form the wiring diagram in the Chilton's manual shows a wire with the idiot light which to me says excite wire. A wire that goes to the ignition switch which to me says it is the sense wire and then the big charge stud wire. All 3 have voltage when running and all 3 have been run and rerun and tested. The only other thing I can think maybe wrong is the plug it self but I cannot find a new one which I did try to do. I may look at which wire is where on the plug pull it out then put ends on the 2 jumper wires I have spliced in and put them on and see if things change. But even that will be hard to do since there in blind locations so hard to put in place

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504

09-12-2018 19:32:43




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to old, 09-12-2018 15:45:11  
I do think the alt. is bad.



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FarmallMN

09-13-2018 05:21:35




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to 504, 09-12-2018 19:32:43  
Old if Iím not sure if this is right but the wire that goes to the idiot light should be grounded in the run posiisiton to excite the alternator and then give voltage when itís turning. If thatís right I would see of the terminal going to the idiot light was grounded. Maybe you indicator light is the wrong size? I really donít know just trying to be helpful.



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old

09-13-2018 08:38:18




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 Re: 97 Geo tracker alternaotr problems part 2 in reply to FarmallMN, 09-13-2018 05:21:35  
Only thing that has been changed is the alternator twice the idoit light is the same one it has had since we got this thing



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