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Antique Tractor Paint and Bodywork

Question: Clear Coating Lacquer over Enamel paint?

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Mike in MI

02-11-2013 06:49:07




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I just done some painting on Oliver fenders, Hood,Dash,Ect for a friend. Mostly sheet metal work. He bought the paint for me and it"s TSC store paint. He also wanted me to clear coat the finish with TSC clear coat Lacquer paint.
After letting the other paint dry for a few days I mixed up a small batch and tryed a small section on the cowl. I noticed after a few minutes the paint started to curel/wrinking effect. After doing this I should of remembered as I was told a long time ago from a guy that did painting on tractors he said you can paint enamel over laquer but never paint lacquer over enamel paints. Anyways my friend said the guy at the store told him he could us the lacquer for a finish coat.
Well now I"m thinking I might of done something wrong in preping it? Do they have a clear coat enamel paint out there? Mike

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kylemorley

02-13-2013 07:09:01




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 Re: Question: Clear Coating Lacquer over Enamel paint? in reply to Mike in MI, 02-11-2013 06:49:07  
Curiously enough, considering the ubiquity of the no-lacquer-over-enamel rule, the Van Sickle clear seems to be a brand new product, marketed specifically for use over Van Sickle's tractor and implement paints, all of which are enamel. You'd think that would be a recipe for disaster.

They do say it's got to be properly cured though first.



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Stephen Newell

02-12-2013 05:34:01




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 Re: Question: Clear Coating Lacquer over Enamel paint? in reply to Mike in MI, 02-11-2013 06:49:07  
What you experienced is what you can expect from putting any lacquer over any enamel. Sometimes if the enamel has cured for many years you can get away with it but it's still a risk especially if the enamel is sanded first. Also lacquer works by melting into the previous coat so if it doesn't melt in it won't bond very well. A lacquer clear coat only works well over lacquer paint. Lacquer is very easy to work with but I think anyone that works with paint looks down on it as a inferior product now. You could expect good results from a urethane clear coat.

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Tom-PA

02-12-2013 03:11:23




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 Re: Question: Clear Coating Lacquer over Enamel paint? in reply to Mike in MI, 02-11-2013 06:49:07  
Back in 1966, I attended a 3 wk class at North Island, San Diego, for the Overhaul and Repair Paint school. At the time Many Naval A/C were still using Enamal, Nitro Cellulose,Acrylic paint and other paints and were at the time Using Epoxy as the A/C came thru the overhaul cycly. One thing they stressed for us from out in the field. E over L, but never L over E. Enamel over Lacquer, but never Laquer over Enamal. I have held to this and found it works. I have also experimented the reverse and frankly, It just makes a mess you have to clean up and repair properly. Just my 2 cents worth
Tom Pa

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GordoSD

02-11-2013 18:39:00




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 Re: Question: Clear Coating Lacquer over Enamel paint? in reply to Mike in MI, 02-11-2013 06:49:07  
You are a novice painter. And you are taking advice from dumb and dumber. Get the picture? Leave the paint alone. If you want come back in three months, color wet sand it with 400 WD and shoot it again. Lose the clear on those cheap finishes.You can't put lipstick on a pig.



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B-maniac

02-11-2013 09:01:04




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 Re: Question: Clear Coating Lacquer over Enamel paint? in reply to Mike in MI, 02-11-2013 06:49:07  
At this point I wouldn't even try urethane clear over it. Not much you can apply over uncured enamel accept maybe more enamel. If the enamel is applied correctly it will shine just as much as if clear coated. It is the prep and the application technique that gives the shine. If one can't get enamel to shine adequately than clear will be no different. Scuff it down and take what you learned from the first job and usually the second time will look twice as good. That's why one should practice on old car hoods/fenders until it looks good and gun adjustments /reducer/air pressure and technique are all correct. No amount of clear will make up for this.Simply put ( and no judgement intended here) if it doesn't shine , application technique/prep was probably not correct. Laquer clear (didn't know you could still get it ) has absolutely no use in modern refinish industry.

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Mike in MI

02-11-2013 14:33:09




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 Re: Question: Clear Coating Lacquer over Enamel paint? in reply to B-maniac, 02-11-2013 09:01:04  
I was thinking of the same thing why clear coat it?
I try posting pictures later on what I have got done.
Mike



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B-maniac

02-11-2013 09:25:40




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 Re: Question: Clear Coating Lacquer over Enamel paint? in reply to B-maniac, 02-11-2013 09:01:04  
One thing I forgot to mention was that usually the people who say that simply putting a cote of clear on makes it shine a lot more are bassically saying that they are a better painter after practicing for two coats before , plus they now have laid down two coats of paint that will flow and bridge any prep flaws a little and applying a third coat of anything will probably look better than the first and second. It"s not the clear , it"s the practice.

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Jason S.

02-11-2013 08:25:45




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 Re: Question: Clear Coating Lacquer over Enamel paint? in reply to Mike in MI, 02-11-2013 06:49:07  
You can clear laquer over enamel but only if it is well cured, but I have no clue why anybody would want to do that. You will probably have more shine with the single stage than with having laquer cleared over it. As the laquer dries the shine will die off. You have to buff it to get a good shine. I would just get some urethane clear and clear over it if he is wanting some extra protection for his paint.

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glennster

02-11-2013 08:21:48




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 Re: Question: Clear Coating Lacquer over Enamel paint? in reply to Mike in MI, 02-11-2013 06:49:07  
lacquer wont work over enamel. the solvents are too hot and will do exactly what yours is doing. depending on what enamel is on the tractor, you may be able to get a urethane clear over it. jumping paint lines and products create all kinds of problems.



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