1650 Acts Like Running Out of Fuel

Married2Allis

Well-known Member
Mowing today with a 1650 diesel, not working it hard with an RM990. Full tank of fuel, fuel filters changed about 20 hours ago. Has an electric fuel pump that is wired to run when starter cranks then fuel flow is gravity fed.

I warm it up to operating temp and then start mowing. A few minutes later motor starts to sputter, sometimes recovers but usually dies acting like its running out of fuel. Level or hill does not matter. Then let it sit for a few minutes and starts up fine and runs until it repeats the trouble.

Could this be the injection pump filter? -thanks
 
Could be wrong but seems like you?re gonna have a hard time
getting adequate fuel to gravity feed through an electric pump.
 
If the fuel supply is good it can be the injection pump itself that needs repair. When the governor weight retainer ring begins to fail, the bits plug the return side and cause housing pressure to rise which then will shut down the pump. You can confirm by loosening the two screw side cover when it acts up, and if it runs OK WITH the cover loose/fuel leak, then acts up again with the cover tight pump needs repair soon. DON'T clean the return side and keep running it, as you WILL soon shear off the retainer pins, seize the head/rotor and break the drive shaft. I just finished repairing/testing a JD pump for the same trouble.
 
(quoted from post at 13:09:48 05/06/19) If the fuel supply is good it can be the injection pump itself that needs repair. When the governor weight retainer ring begins to fail, the bits plug the return side and cause housing pressure to rise which then will shut down the pump. You can confirm by loosening the two screw side cover when it acts up, and if it runs OK WITH the cover loose/fuel leak, then acts up again with the cover tight pump needs repair soon. DON'T clean the return side and keep running it, as you WILL soon shear off the retainer pins, seize the head/rotor and break the drive shaft. I just finished repairing/testing a JD pump for the same trouble.
How would I repair it? Should it be rebuilt ? -thanks
 
Married2Allis, All the 1650 and White 2-70 engines I have
owned had a mechanical fuel pump. My 1555 was gravity
feed. I do remember having fuel flow problem with the 1555. I
would check the flow from the sediment bowl first and if that
isn?t it and your electric pump is a low volume pump I would
wire it to run with the engine. I just sold my 1650 injection
pump for $250 off the early series. Guy plans on rebuilding it
right away. Just my thoughts no guarantee! Lol
Untitled URL Link
 
Greg, I'm going to check my fuel flow to see if any filters are clogged -- that's why I thought the filter screen in the pump may have been the cause. I've got one in front of the electric pump also. I've never had a flow problem before with this setup. When I got the tractor the electirc pump it already had was dead and it ran fine, and replaced the pump because it was easier to bleed the fuel system. Thanks for the suggestion to make the pump to stay on -- that will help rule out a flow problem. Seems to happen when everything is at running temperature. If I need to get a pump rebuild, I'll have to eat baloney!
 
I just thought of another thing fuel cap not venting. The IH
truck at work almost died last winter. Acted like it ran out of
fuel . I was thinking fuel gelling up and being stranded on a
back road and when I tried to remove fuel cap I could hardly
pull it off the due to the vaccuum. Just another thought from
an empty head! Lol
 
It was probably 20 below out and I?m dreaming of sandy
beach?s and other things! We had a few exciting times my
co worker spun out and slid sideways! Ended up flipped over.
I slid backwards and stuck on a berm didn?t flip it. I had been
up the same road only a few hours earlier with no problems
and chained up both times.
cvphoto22247.jpg


cvphoto22248.jpg
 
Wow, that looks like a wild day at work. Glad you all weren't hurt. Did you hear him say 'Watch This' before he flipped? lol
 
Brent he came on the radio and said I just flipped the truck.
Sounded pretty despondent. I was like yeah right thinking he?s
in the ditch not expecting to see him sideways in the road. He
had quite a time getting his seatbelt off hanging sideways and
a portly fellow! Lol
 
His name is Dave. If you ever heard the commercial for
Geico. Don?t be like Dave is mentioned quite often in the
shop, much to his chagrin.
 
All the late 1650, 1655, and 2-70 diesels I've worked on were gravity feed, no supply pump. System works fine without one. Lots of larger IH, AC, and White tractors never used supply pumps either. I still suspect injection pump trouble, have seen those issues for forty plus years and counting repairing diesel systems.
 
(quoted from post at 18:33:20 05/06/19) All the late 1650, 1655, and 2-70 diesels I've worked on were gravity feed, no supply pump. System works fine without one. Lots of larger IH, AC, and White tractors never used supply pumps either. I still suspect injection pump trouble, have seen those issues for forty plus years and counting repairing diesel systems.
Does rebuilding a pump involve any machining or honing ?
 
My 1550 did the same thing. I also have an electric pump but mine runs full time. My fuel problem was at the sediment bowl where it goes into the tank. Bowl was clean but screen up in the tank was completely plugged. The bad news was the full tank of fuel that has to come out! I cleaned it once but it plugged again in just a few hours. Ended up pulling the tank and attaching it to my cement mixer with coffee can fill of rocks. Got it pretty clean and back on. Tractor running but haven't worked it hard yet. Unbelievable all the nasty stuff that came out of that tank. Hay season coming soon so will see if my problem is solved. I'm sure it is!
 
(quoted from post at 05:44:20 05/07/19) My 1550 did the same thing. I also have an electric pump but mine runs full time. My fuel problem was at the sediment bowl where it goes into the tank. Bowl was clean but screen up in the tank was completely plugged. The bad news was the full tank of fuel that has to come out! I cleaned it once but it plugged again in just a few hours. Ended up pulling the tank and attaching it to my cement mixer with coffee can fill of rocks. Got it pretty clean and back on. Tractor running but haven't worked it hard yet. Unbelievable all the nasty stuff that came out of that tank. Hay season coming soon so will see if my problem is solved. I'm sure it is!

Thanks, greg also had that advice -- I'll check the bowl and the screen. Ofcourse I just filled the tank, that's why it's even a better idea to empty it. lol
 
9 times out of ten it is the flex ring. Time to reseal it. Not an expensive repair, just one that needs to be done. Don't just pick the first guy who answers the phone or email. Make some calls and pick someone who you are comfortable with. Tons of guys can do it, some are cheap, some are expensive. Never pick the cheap guy because quality takes time. Last thing you want is someone who does half a job and misses important steps. . The expensive guys are just hosing you. A few phone calls will easily help you sort it out. Money is hard earned so don't just throw it at this problem without asking around and getting a feel for what you options are. Price, turn around time and warranty should all factor into your choice. Before you do any thing make sure you have good supply to the pump, and not a restriction on the fuel supply side. AL
 


If that includes all the updated parts, that doesn't sound too bad. The updated solid governor weight retainer is usually around $75 by itself, and the seal kit another $25, return check $25, and who knows what else it will need- metering valve, pilot bushing, cam screw, etc.

I bought all my parts and took everything to a local guy who charged me $425 total, and there was an extra $25 because I forgot the return check. Total for me was about $600 parts & labor. I did source the governor weight and seal kit online to save a couple bucks.
 
For most of those Stanadyne rotary-distributor pumps - no machine work and no real "rebuild." A few worn parts are replaced and new seals.
The major moving metal parts are reused, as is. Thus why I do not like the term "rebuild." If you tore apart a tractor engine and did
nothing but put in new gaskets and maybe grind the valves - I doubt you'd regard it "rebuilt."

That said, if a pump has a bad head & rotor assembly and had to get a brand new one - then I think the term "rebuilt" is fair. That also can
jack the repair price way up.

Someone with experience can take one apart, reseal it, and put back together in a couple of hours with no special tools other then the
Bristol 6-tooth wrench needed for the cam-ring screw on certain models.
 
Interesting note on fuel cap not venting. I actually run the IH type caps on all 4 of my 4 digits. Put a new one on my 1550. Keeps fuel from leaking all over hood.. BUT: first time I ran it for hour or so.. acted like out of fuel.. Took cap off to check tank, had a vacuum there so now every 15 minutes or so I loosen cap, problem fixed.
 
We had a big bug blocking the inlet to the fuel bowl one time. Caused your symptoms. Our perkins in the combine started
starving for fuel too one time. Line was partially clogged with bean dust.
 
Had same problem on our 1655D yesterday, drained the tank flushed it out new fuel filter and runs fine now.
 
If it ever stops raining I'll get a chance to flush everything. Would make sense that there is enough fuel in the lines and filters to run for 10 minutes or so until it dies.
 

We sell tractor parts! We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today.

Back
Top