I'm converting old Harry back to 6 volt. Thoughts, tips

Friends,

For at least 35 years my 47 2N has been 12v. Handy for me to run sprayers, pumps and jump dead
batts, Now that I ain't pumpin' or sprayin' or jumpin' much I'd like to return to the original
6V system. I'm sick of chasing bugs in an inherently buggy system. No start since last
thanksgiving, Harry's been idle for too long. 6 is more practical for me as my hard working
tractor becomes an occasional driver and participant in the yearly hoggin' of the bush. Most
importantly, 6v is original to this American icon, born the same week old Hank died.
6 volts, cause 3 is not enough and 12 is too many.

I want to start fresh and build a bullet and idiot proof system from the ground up and I'm
starting my research here. Plenty online about going to 12v, not much about the reverse. Still a
searching for a good, clear diagram
So I need a 6v genny, coil, points and condensor.and starter w/relay?) run a few wires up the
tube, might as well do new plugs and cables. Should I run a slightly hotter plug ?
What am I missing guys ?
Oh yeah lamps ballast resistor (that one always confuses me) and something about a positive
ground.
I plan to buy here. I'm open to suggestions for recommended vendors especially for a complete
kit ?
Any thoughts on using a kit vs. the hunt and peck method ?
Am I overthinking this ? Or is it as simple as strip 'er down and plug'n'play ?
So many questions, so few brain cells.

thanks, in advance, for offering your expert advice and sharing your experiences
I always get good answers here

bert brown
#300618 (old harry)
mechanically sound,
electrically challenged.

Points and condensers do not care about voltage. Replace the bendix on your 6v starter . No need for a new switch. Get a 6v coil and an oem ballast resistor and no other resistors. You will need a 6v battery, generator and v/r. Make sure you polarize the generator after you hook up the 6v battery as positive ground. Get new 6v headlights.

Make your life easier by getting a 6v wiring harness.

You will not find a 6v kit.

Google wiring diagrams JMOR for the best wiring diagram you will find out there.

Now add up the cost of all of that before you make a final decision.
75 Tips

Two of my 6 Ford tractors were 12 volt when I got them. Since I like to keep everything original I converted both back to 6 Volt. No regrets.

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My local Farm equipment dealer shared this with me about the Fords ,he took in on trade ins . Every one of them the owner were complaining that they refuse to start issues .
He said the reason the 6 volts would not start is all were with a to small of a 6 volt battery . Because they were buying cheap small 6 volt com 1 . He would put the correct battery in the tractor with correct guage cables and sell the tractor .

"I'm sick of chasing bugs in an inherently buggy system."

If the wiring is messed up it does not matter if it is 6 or 12 volts, it will have the same problems. Proper rewire it and your problems will likely go away without changing back to 6 volts. If you want to go to 6 volts, properly rewiring it needs to be step one, or the problems will still be there.

Ditto. You know this already Jim, but for others who don't, read on. Our late sparkie-meister Dell always said, ...if it won't start on 6-VOLTS what makes you think
it will on 12-VOLTS.... I added this years ago: 99.98% of all non-starting issues are due to incorrect wiring regardless if 6V or 12V. I also added, the best
investment you can make for your tractor is to get the ESSENTIAL MANUALS. You cannot maintain your machines without knowing the proper procedures and systems. Many
guys think they how to do things but they really don't. These old, vintage machines are different that your grandpa's original tractor. Some figure all vehicles are
the same and treat their old tractor like they do their new car or truck. FORD (and some others) used the 6V/POS GRN electrical system; a mystery to some. The early
N's, '39-'50, used the Front Mount Distributor, the 2nd most mis-understood system on these Fords. Failure to function with one or both of these often resulted in the
owner thinking he needed to switch out to 12V. When he did that and it still didn't start/run, the next step was to switch out to EI. Now, just to be clear, there is
nothing wrong with any of these setups, as long as each system is wired correctly for that system. The front mount distributor must be mounted on the engine correctly
otherwise at first power up they will destroy the base as the camshaft head has an offset female slot and the unit cam & weights have an offset male tang on it and thy
both must mate up when assembled. Setting the points on the front mount must be done one correct way, unit pulled and on your bench, then TIMED using the OEM Manual.
Next, FORD TRACTOR prior to the late 1950 diesel models, never used 12V so there are no original manuals with any 12V wiring systems in it. When the 12V diesel system
was introduced, it used a 12V battery but still used a Generator with a Voltage Regulator. Thus just swapping out a 6V battery to a 12V battery is not doing a '12V
conversion'. Granted system will run on 6V or 12V but going full throttle out to 12V is the best solution. That means discarding the GEN and VR abd installing an ALT.
If using a 6V Coil ad going to 12V, you need to add an external 1-OHM resistor to the coil circuit. Eschew the extra resistor by replacing the coil with a 12V verified
Coil. Whichever setup you use, GEN or ALT, failure to have a fan belt tensioning bracket on it will result in battery never able to charge correctly. JMOR wrote a VG
document on how to wire all these N's correctly in both 6V and 12V. Search Wiring Pictograms by JMOR to locate them on the Internet or contact me and I can email you
a copy.

Post was meant for Jim above, but sounds to me Bert like you have a classic example of what I said - incorrect wiring to begin with. Model year only matters if a 9N/2N model using 6V and a GEN with the Cutout or an 8N Model using a GEN and the VR, and whether using a Front mount or Side mount, that is what matters. Wiring is different for all. Nothin 'wrong' with wanting to go to 6V or vice versa just be sure wiring for each is right. It doesn't sound like you have had the right wiring for 35 years. I'd start with a good visual inspection. One look at wiring and it may be apparent what the problem is. 9N/2N's used 6V/POS GRN and the front mount dizzy, an 11A, 1-Wire/3-Brush GEN with the Cutout Circuit to start with. A 12V setup involves removing the GEN & CUTOUT and installing an ALT. If the visual shows otherwise, could be first mistake. Next, the front mount distributor is the 2nd most likely place to be incorrect or worse, busted die to wrong mounting. Whether if using 6V or 12V, nothing changes on the distributor. I can rebuild you front mount for you but you will have to install it correctly. Email is open. Let's see what you have before you start swapping out any parts.


Tim Daley(MI)

No one here really gives a damn what voltage you run your tractor. Neither does your tractor.
There have been thousands of posts here from guys who can't or won't learn to fix their 'buggy' 6V tractor so they want to convert to 12V because they think there is some kind of magic in converting.
If you want to go back to 6V because you can't or won't learn to fix your buggy 12V system and you think there is some kind of magic in 6V go ahead.
But do it knowing there is a bunch of advantages to 12V.

Thanks Bruce and others,
Just the kind of friendly advice I was looking for. Clearly, some folks here do "give a damn" about helping out.
To clarify, this 2N was converted to 12v before I got it in 1985. It started and ran with no issues for many years. When I did a complete frame off in 1999 I refreshed the wiring and replaced a few electrical components. Thanks to some friendly advice from the nice guys on this forum, I did it correctly and had no issues until fall of 2022. A radiator swap, a few field repairs and a small fire in the barn disturbed and compromised the wiring causing intermittent no starts and stalling. Some serious life changes have prevented me from troubleshooting and doing the work until now. I don't need 12v anymore I have decided to return to 6v. Not a matter of "can't do 12v correctly again, I just don't wanna.
I have referred to JMOR's excellent diagrams in the past, but I don't seem to find one for "6 volt, very late 2N" (300618) Should I use the diagram for "6 volt early 8N" ?
I suppose any of the 6V variations can be made to work. I am going for an original, as-shipped scheme. Call me sentimental.
I have found a few partial kits but still looking for a good source for a bundle. At least for the front end.
Again, I appreciate and value any constructive comments on my project.



(

(quoted from post at 13:43:14 03/19/23) Points and condensers do not care about voltage. Replace the bendix on your 6v starter . No need for a new switch. Get a 6v coil and an oem ballast resistor and no other resistors. You will need a 6v battery, generator and v/r. Make sure you polarize the generator after you hook up the 6v battery as positive ground. Get new 6v headlights.

Make your life easier by getting a 6v wiring harness.

You will not find a 6v kit.

Google wiring diagrams JMOR for the best wiring diagram you will find out there.

Now add up the cost of all of that before you make a final decision.
75 Tips

Click to expand...

(quoted from post at 16:43:14 03/19/23) You will need a 6v battery, generator and v/r.

Click to expand...

Bruce knows, just missed it.
A 2n should have a 3 brush, single terminal generator and [u:ad8d32b701][i:ad8d32b701]N[/i:ad8d32b701]o[/u:ad8d32b701] VR. Just uses a cutout relay.

I have referred to JMOR's excellent diagrams in the past, but I don't seem to find one for "6 volt, very late 2N" (300618) Should I use the diagram for "6 volt early 8N" ?
I suppose any of the 6V variations can be made to work.

Click to expand...

8n's use a VR, 2N / 9N (except very early 9N) do not.

Jmor's 2n/9n wiring diagram is good. It just uses the starting serial number of 1947 (9N258540) instead of the last serial number (around 9N306221)

This post was edited by jimtrs on 03/20/2023 at 07:56 am.

Wish you luck, most of it is easy. The reason I changed both of my 8n's to 12 was due to the fact that I could not get a voltage regulator that worked worth a darn. Life is good with 12 volts.

Times two, what R. Geiger said. But in your case you don't need to worry about a voltage regulator.
B.T.W. I got an original wiring harness for my 2N off of Just 8 n's.

This post was edited by Jim L WA on 03/20/2023 at 10:26 am.

Same here.

I've converted several back to 6V after (usually poorly done) earlier 12V conversions by POs.

6V system works fine if properly maintained. 12V system will not work well if not properly maintained.

(quoted from post at 15:03:21 03/20/23) Same here.

I've converted several back to 6V after (usually poorly done) earlier 12V conversions by POs.

6V system works fine if properly maintained. 12V system will not work well if not properly maintained.

Click to expand...

both systems will work fine if properly maintained. neither will work well if not properly maintained.

fixed

(quoted from post at 15:09:27 03/20/23)

(quoted from post at 15:03:21 03/20/23) Same here.

I've converted several back to 6V after (usually poorly done) earlier 12V conversions by POs.

6V system works fine if properly maintained. 12V system will not work well if not properly maintained.

Click to expand...

both systems will work fine if properly maintained. neither will work well if not properly maintained.

fixed

Click to expand...

wo have mentioned "properly maintained". My question is , what do you maintain on a 10SI alternator?? No grease fittings/oiler, no voltage or current adjustments, the belt tension is more important for water pump/fan than the alternator on same belt, so, ???

Touche! CORRECT WIRING for whatever system, you want to use is the key. Just because you vace a 6V battery or a 12V battery doesn't mean the rest of the wiring setup is correct. Simple.

Tim Daley(MI)

(quoted from post at 14:53:49 03/19/23)
So I need a 6v genny,

Click to expand...

Finding a good used tensioner bolt and hardware will be the hardest part .

(quoted from post at 12:53:49 03/19/23) Friends,

For at least 35 years my 47 2N has been 12v. ......... I'm sick of chasing bugs in an inherently buggy system. .

Click to expand...

If the system is now 35ish yrs old and starting to be buggy, why not just strip it all out and rewire it from end to end? by doing so you'll run across and fix all the dirty corroded rusty or broken contacts and circuits.

Strip the electrical system out, and replace it all. Relatively speaking there aint much to an 9/2/8N.

Then you'd have another 35 yrs before it got buggy again. Then again with the quality of todays parts, it might be only 35 hours.

Please read the replies. A reply from you is required; you asked, we are here to help, and nobody is condemning you. You can do whatever you want, it's your tractor. I would advise to wait til all the facts are in before you start buying new parts. It's irrelevant how often you run the tractor, but 12V will start stronger and faster. It sounds like you have a major electrical issue and justy guessing and flip-flopping back to 6V wouldn't matter if done wrong. I will offer again to rebuild your distributor so email me if interested -click on LINK at bottom RH corner. You pay for parts and shipping only. Unit will be rebuilt to OEM specs and guaranteed to fire up and run as it should. YOU will have to mount it correctly. It also would help if you can tell us how you have everything is wired now, include pictures too if you can.


Tim Daley(MI)

(quoted from post at 17:13:19 03/20/23)

(quoted from post at 15:09:27 03/20/23)

(quoted from post at 15:03:21 03/20/23) Same here.

I've converted several back to 6V after (usually poorly done) earlier 12V conversions by POs.

6V system works fine if properly maintained. 12V system will not work well if not properly maintained.

Click to expand...

both systems will work fine if properly maintained. neither will work well if not properly maintained.

fixed

Click to expand...

wo have mentioned "properly maintained". My question is , what do you maintain on a 10SI alternator?? No grease fittings/oiler, no voltage or current adjustments, the belt tension is more important for water pump/fan than the alternator on same belt, so, ???

Click to expand...

for me, it was front mount points. my arthritis got sick of them. being unable to get rid of my arthritis, i got rid of the points instead. life is better now.