The Once a Year Figure Out How to Get It Started Saga

My 1949 8N seems to sit for about 6 months every winter. When I finally need to use it in the spring, there is always some issue or another that needs to be addressed before it will fire up.

The carburetor is such a common problem that I almost automatically take it apart to clean it out. This year I put the carb back on and it still wouldn't fire.

After pulling a couple of plugs out and finding no spark, I went down to the NAPA store to get points, condenser and rotor. Talk about sticker shock! They wanted over $60 for the three parts.
After my heart rate returned to nearly normal, I walked out without them.

So the tractor just sat for another month. Finally decided I as tired of doing everything the hard way and took another look at it.

Started at the coil and got no voltage there. Then went back to the ignition switch and started checking voltage from there out. A couple of connection were a bit fuzzy so I disconnected everything off the ballast resistor cleaned up the posts and reconnected it all.

Rechecked the coil lead and had 3.25 volts. I figured it was worth a try so I hit the starter and it fired right up. Would have been fine if I hadn't left my fresh mug of coffee on the hood!

So my question, if you're still with me, is if the 3.25 volts at the coil wire is what it should typically be. I couldn't seem to find any specs on that. Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that it is an original 6 volt system.

Thanks,
Mark

This post was edited by Mark Schrier on 08/10/2022 at 05:49 pm.
 
Hey duey,

Yeah, I'm no good at electrical theory.

So are there specific readings that would be found at the coil wire in each of the positions? I had only guessed that the resistor had lowered the voltage from 6.25 volts that I measured at the ignition switch to 3.25 volts at the wire that goes to the coil. I would sure be interested in knowing more if it is more complicated than that.

Thanks, Mark
 
What duey said.

Your points were closed. If they were
open, you would have seen battery voltage

Next year, just dress the points with
brown paper or card stock. Not a file.
They get corroded while sitting
75 Tips
 
Our 2N is our "most used" utility tractor even though we have an 8N and newer Massey.
Even with that, there have been winters of low or no usage for months.
In that event, I have had a similar problem.
But before I do anything, I ask, " How long since a new set of points"?
If I can't even remember, they get replaced. Problem solved.
Not rocket science by a long shot!
 
Are you using a 6V or 12V system? (A) FACT: The #1 reason for a non-starting machine is incorrect wiring regardless if 6V or 12V. A weak or dead battery is part of
that equation. Do you have a good float charger on it when tractor is idle? Battery lead plates begins sulfurization when not is use for weeks, months on end. Get A
battery Tender. A basic trickle charger connected whenever you need to start it won't do squat if battery is dead. Battery must sustain a full charge under load. Use a
Hydrometer or get tested at shop. (B) You should NOT have to rebuild the carb every 6 months --- something ain't right. Are you using the OEM Marvel-Schebler TSX 241
Carb or a cheap Cheena made junker? Have you done the Fuel Flow Test? Pass? Leave alone and move on, it's electrical. Got spark? (3) The FORD Front Mount Distributor
is a mystery to many and it shouldn't be when properly understood. It is a bit tricky to mount correctly on the engine; there is a right way and a wrong way. Get i off
180 DEG and it will destroy the aluminum base the second power is applied. The engine camshaft face has an offset female slot and the cam & weights on the distributor
has a male offset tang and they both must mate exactly. Rebuilding, testing, and mounting correctly are very important. Use one of the few good brands of points; many
are junk today. I advise the Standard Ignition/Blue Streak FD-6769X points, $16 typical. NAPA sells them but do not let them sell you the ECHLIN CS-35 ones. They used
to be a good set but no longer are as they can't be gapped correctly.

TESTING DISTRIBUTOR:
Next, test with your VOM set to CONTINUITY like this:
1. Coil off, cap off, points open, with one probe on the brass screw and the other probe on both sides of the open points. On the side closest to the cam, you should
have continuity. Not on the other side! If you do, you will also have continuity everywhere else because the points are grounded.
2. Coil off, cap off, points open. Place one probe on the brass screw and the other anywhere on the body of the distributor. You should have no continuity! Now, rotate
the tang on the distributor. As the points open & close, you should have continuity (closed) and none when they open.
3. Put the coil on the distributor, cap off, points open. Place one probe on the lead on the top of the coil, the other on the cam side of the open points. You should
have continuity!
4. Coil on, cap off, points open. Place one probe on the lead on the top of the coil, the other anywhere on the body of the distributor. You should have NO continuity!

When the rebuilt distributor passes timing and testing, it is ready to be mounted back on the engine. Take your VOM and measure your battery voltage and note it. On
the Ballast Resistor, looking at the rear dash, there are three terminals and only the top two are active, one on either side of the resistor. The LH terminal only
connects to the coil wire and the RH terminal is the Ignition Switch wire connection. That's it, nothing else wired on either side. The middle bottom terminal is only
a semi-passive junction post. Take your VOM and set to VDC. Apply one probe (polarity doesn't matter) to the LH Resistor terminal - should be the coil wire. Apply the
other VOM probe to metal ground anywhere. Ignition Key Switch ON but do NOT turn engine over. You should see battery voltage with points open and about half that
with points closed. You can open and close the points simply by tapping the neutral safety start pushbutton without key on. YES? So far all OK. Move a probe to the top
of the coil post now and repeat. Pass? Yes? You are getting the correct V to distributor. (4) Test for spark. Coil checks OK but still no spark? It's in the
distributor.



Tim Daley(MI)(
 
(quoted from post at 21:17:01 08/10/22) What duey said.

Your points were closed. If they were
open, you would have seen battery voltage

Next year, just dress the points with
brown paper or card stock. Not a file.
They get corroded while sitting
75 Tips
void the disassembly needed to get the brown paper between the points and simply "blow away" the oxide quick & easy! Been doing it nearly every spring for a dozen years. Wide blade/narrow blade is important.
MDANWcx.jpg
 
Hey Tim,
Thanks for the detailed method of diagnosing starting problems. It is a 6 volt system.

I think my carburetor issues stem from moisture in the fuel tank. There is always a little rust in the bottom of the bowl after it sits for the winter. Fortunately, I still have a real Marvel-Schebler TSX241. Next year, I will try to work on everything else before messing with the carb.

Surprisingly, the battery is never an issue. Unless I crank it for a while, thinking this is the year it will fire up!

When I discovered that I had no spark at the plugs, I pulled the distributor and inspected it. Yes, the points are Echlin and I agree that they are not built right. I will try to source out the Blue Streaks for my next tune up.
So what I think happened was when I found that there was no voltage at the coil wire post of the resistor (with the ignition switch in the on position), I disconnected all the wires that went to the resistor and reconnected them all. That's when I got the 3.25 volt reading at the coil wire post.

At that point, it started and ran fine. Since I did them all at once, Ill never know exactly where the problem was. I f I have this problem again, I will be sure to take it one post at a time to track it down.

Again, thanks for the info, Mark
 
Hey JMOR,

You may be a braver man than me!

I can see where this setup might work, just don't know if I have the cajones to attempt it. I don't remember seeing it anywhere in the manual. I am curious who was the first person to come up with it. :shock: :lol:
 
(quoted from post at 12:05:46 08/11/22) Hey JMOR,

You may be a braver man than me!

I can see where this setup might work, just don't know if I have the cajones to attempt it. I don't remember seeing it anywhere in the manual. I am curious who was the first person to come up with it. :shock: :lol:
aybe me. I had used same technique in garage door limit switches in the past & just applied it to tractor. Oh, there is no "might" to it. :) No danger if one observes the wide/narrow blade (neutral/hot), but I advise not touching the tractor & using dry stick to operate starter, for those that are not sure or might make a connection mistake.
 
An easy way to check the spark is to use a regular,modern timing light. I use a battery from one of my
motorcycles to power it,clip onto one of the plug wires,then crank away. This works on lawnmowers as well as
N tractors.
 
(quoted from post at 13:05:33 08/13/22) An easy way to check the spark is to use a regular,modern timing light. I use a battery from one of my
motorcycles to power it,clip onto one of the plug wires,then crank away. This works on lawnmowers as well as
N tractors.

I use the same procedure on some equipment but don't recommend it for N diagnosis. Spark intensity is what N owners need, not just the presence of spark.
 

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