Hello and Bad News

I love this board! I have gotten lots of info for my 8N and my MF.

A little background since this is my first post of consequence:

Prolly like most of you, I have worked on my own vehicles all my life mostly due to the fact I couldn't afford to get someone else to do the work when I was younger. This led to me building up a decent set of tools and knowledge for someone who grew up in the city. My uncle had 100 acres and a cabin up in the NC mountains where we'd go every summer, and really any other time we could, to chill out and soak up some nature. My uncle had an early 8N up there. At only about 6 or 7, I helped him swap the rotor, distributor cap and wires on that old Ford. As everyone knows, it's a tight squeeze on those front-mounts... and my uncle never missed an opportunity to involve us kids in what he was working on. Damn near 45 years later I am handing a guy $1,200 for my own 49 8N!

I hope that you guys can elucidate a path forward on my 62 MF 35 Utility.

UGF655001540. Z-134, It has the 100 loader and 220 Backhoe

I bought it for $1500, running and hydraulics working, back in October. In my view, a very good deal--worst case being I part it out. But my goal is to have a working machine I can use.

First thing I did when I got it home is check the motor oil. There was water in the oil--which didn't scare me right out since it had been sitting. I drained the coolant and oil, refilled 'em and ran it. I didn't see any oil in the coolant and the crank oil remained clear. I continued to run it for a couple weeks mainly as I replaced the hydraulic lines and worked on it. I checked the oil and coolant every time before and after I ran it. All good.

It needed a new manifold since the original manifold to tailpipe flange was in "ruff" shape, to quote my buddy. I parked it and started the disassembly. Everything went really well. The fuel tank interior is pristine, btw. I pulled the manifold... and all the nuts I could get to easily turned off with a speedwrench (my way of starting out pulling manifold nuts). The other two or so came off without a fight on a combo. One stud decided to turn loose and come out... but the main point is no major force was used or needed.

So it sat waiting as I got my parts and prepped them with Eastwood exhaust coatings inside and out. I live in central NC and we rarely see anything below 15 F. We had a couple cold snaps of 20 or so in late December into early January. But, I had new coolant in there, albeit rusty dirty by that point--the typical you expect from a poorly maintained or sitting motor.

Just prior to putting on the new manifold I pulled the old studs (minimal effort) and chased the threads with a tap (turned by hand) and wire brushed and cleanout out the threads very well. Put in new studs with copper anti-seize. All the studs turned in by hand.

I add the gasket and put on the new manifold. I did not torque these or turn them on a pattern. But we're talking 3/8" short driver tight... maybe 20 pounds.

I added a new carb and new tailpipe. New sediment bowl and new fuel line. Put her back together up to the gas tank.

She started right up, allowing for the fuel line and carb to populate.

Sounded great. I walk around to the right side... and turkey gravy is spewing out of the broken oil pressure line--the break being in the line, about an inch above the elbow fitting that goes into the blocks. A trip to Napa and that line is replaced.

That day, which was two days ago, before I started her up again I drained the oil. And this is when my heart sank.

Nice bright green and clean coolant was the bottom layer that poured out first. Followed by the turkey gravy emulsion, and then some relatively clean-looking motor oil. I refilled the oil and the coolant right then. She ran fine. I checked the dipstick and it appears to me to be ok. It looks like oil would look in a motor that had water and then one oil change. The coolant level remains steady.

I have many ideas as to the cause of that coolant. But I do not want to mention them since they wouldn't help. Everything one would need to know, most likely, is in my description above.

Here's a video of her running. And yep, that is bottled water, lol. It just happened to be sitting there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DglTxt_MLk

This post was edited by 62MF35Utility on 01/23/2022 at 09:39 am.
 
Not a bad deal. On getting coolant in the oil it is either bad sealing rings on the cylinder sleeves (it's a wet sleeve engine), or it has the famous crack between the cylinders in the bottom of the block (the block is pretty light on these). It could also be a head gasket, but I don't think so since it runs good. If you were to drop the oil pan then put some water in it you can see if it's either the sealing rings, or a crack, or you could try some block sealer. Depends on how far you want to get into it.

This post was edited by ptfarmer on 01/23/2022 at 02:34 pm.
 

Thanks ptfarmer! Ya know, I've used it enough to discover just how nice it is to have a loader--this one is my first.

In all I've done, I've never had to deal with a cracked block. With what few marbles I have left rolling around in my head I'm a crunchin the numbers. I cannot find a working backhoe loader in this vicinity for less than 10k. I'm due for a good ol' rebuild... this block or a new one.

I will be pulling the oil pan tomorrow.

If nothing else, I will damn sure learn a lot. And, still have a loader and backhoe to sell. hahahahaha. Pert near even or better.
 
I'm in the process of rebuilding a MH50 with a Z134 engine that had 6000+ on the meter, same engine as yours I believe and it had no cracks in the block. As PT farmer said it probably a bad head gasket. Mine had no coolant leaks however the head gasket was showing some wear between the cylinder and the water ports.

The oil pan is surprisingly hard to take off, I think it has 12 bolts to take off, 3 in front 3 at back and the sides ones + the bold from the tranny housing Then I used an olfa knife all around and finally used a wood chisel to start splitting it from the block where it meets the tranny. Place some blocks of wood under it to catch it, its at least 20-30 pounds and the cast could break.
 
Most say if it's cracked at bottom then its toast. You could put cardboard under and pressurize with 6lbs. through water drain and see the leaks underneath.
 
I just went through this on my 202. PO left water in it last year and it split the block. My solution was to bolt it. If it's cracked or if one of the O rings is bad, I doubt stop-leak will help. If it were me, I'd drop the oil pan, pressurize the radiator, and go from there.
cvphoto115149.jpg


cvphoto115150.jpg
 
I tell ya, Stan, that's using the noodle.

I will start documenting my work with some pics.

Here's a link to some miscellaneous pics from when I picked it up and a few from working on it:

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1veb7f2SIvI9DSVG-cNG0_-91tWKDK_-R

This post was edited by 62MF35Utility on 01/24/2022 at 04:37 pm.
 
Thanks to all for the help. I hope this little journey pays off for everyone. I am going to correct whatever is wrong... source a block or whatever it takes. I am going to start saving my green stamps in a place I can remember :)
 

I would put a little work as possible into a cracked block. How permanent is my fix? You got me.

How is the compression? Oil pressure? What do the plugs look like?

My compression is/ was at 135 cold, oil pressure is/ was at 18@ 500 rpm. It's a shame the guy let it freeze. I ended giving $2500 for it (I figured the block was cracked. ) Not a deal, but after 3 months of looking... ya know. At least it ran and didn't leak oil that bad.

Mine sat outside for a while before I got it, I think. Since I've got it running, I have put about 60 hours on it. Well, what I thought was pretty tight (front end, 3 point, rear main, and hydraulics) aren't! Lol! It's a good machine that does real work. I'm happy with it.

So what I'm getting at is, if it's been sitting, take your time with the diagnosis. It's likely going to get worse before it gets better. These things are money pits. Run it for 4 hour and work on it for one, then repeat.

The picture attached is me drilling out one of the long bolts that goes through the front carrier and the oil pan. The threads were shot and it was seized in the carrier bosses. Likely, it had been that way a long time.

Stan


mvphoto87340.jpg
 
.

Looks a lot like the loader tractor we had on the farm back in the late 70s early 80s. My father bought it cheap because it had a few problems:
1-rear axle ring gear teeth and pinion peeled off.
2-engine was a mosquito smoker. You could work it all day in the woods and never know there were any mosquitos. That took an engine rebuild, probably a light rebuild of rings and head.

Both items were repaired and the tractor was used through about 2010.

On the farm we had a TO30 that I never saw ran. The story was it had a cracked block (coolant in the oil). At one point in the 2000s my father, farming two different locations and tired of transporting machinery, wanted to get that one working and had a friend's tractor repair shop do the work. He drove it the six or ten miles back to the farm and checked the oil only to find coolant in it again. Mad at the tractor, not the friend, he just parked the beast. Doing some tractor trading I came across a TO35 engine that is there now, maybe it will fit that old tractor.

If you are tearing into the motor of yours, follow through this youtube series and get hints on the common problems plaguing the leakers (often poor seal at the liner base due to crud knocked in there at installation/rebuild).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ti3BEffr6i8

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(quoted from post at 14:10:55 01/25/22

Thanks Jvin. That's some valuable info. I've been working to get time to pull the pan--might be this weekend. I had a couple side projects on this machine already in the works, and decided to finish them. I had to weld a split in the gas tank--which I thought was pretty odd... 3" material failure is all I can think. It was like that when I bought it. But it was essentially right in the middle of the stamped sheet. Not a seam. The closest thing is the port for the filter assembly, about 6" from the "rupture."

Someone may know this one... this tank does not have the plate and hole for the sending unit... absolutely nothing there. The various manuals show a plate to cover the sending unit hole. And for the "Utility" gasoline setup, a gas gauge was an add-on. Does that mean this is an aftermarket tank or original?

I also ordered a new tire before all the possible-cracked-block mess, and changed that this afternoon. First tractor tire change. And I'll say, that "golden" tire changer set is SWEET. I ordered some Murphy's tire mount paste (I was loading up for bear) and it all went pretty damn easy. That murphy's is like cotton candy that fell in axle grease. Never seen anything like it.
 
(quoted from post at 07:05:24 01/25/22) Another option is find a Florida tractor with other problems and check the cylinder pressure.

Nice idea. Been running it a little since the new tire.

I cannot part with this thing. Too useful. I have a small property compared to what you guys prolly have... only 3 acres. I have the required residential Cub Cadet ZT (MTD) that I got for $800 from a buddy... damn thing runs and looks great... and at that price!!

Reason I bring that up is I was pondering back last year about the mulch work I need to do. 20-25 yards every couple years. I hate paying someone to do something I can do. And I needed a way to do it faster AND cheaper. You start looking around at residential grade lawn tractors... man it makes me sick. And so I had this thought, why not buy an 8N? I can work on it. Parts are plentiful and cheap, it gives me the three-point and PTO, etc. Now, think about it for a sec. A good deal finder can get an 8N with lots of implements for less than 2-3K. And that purchase will do WAY more than any normal residential equipment option dollar for dollar.

Anyone could go into business pretty cheap setting up residential customers with an 8N tractor package. Find the tractors... you need someone who knows tractors and mechanics very well. Around here you can get clean 8Ns for 2k. Bring them back to the shop and do the standard 12V upgrade. Service all fluids and filters, tune-up. You get the idea. Maybe even paint, or clean it at least. Maybe add a ROPS??? for due diligence for insurance purposes.

Add turf tires for more money etc.

anyway, I type too much, hahahaha
 

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