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John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum
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JD model A Power Trol

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Heitkamp

03-28-2021 09:33:30




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I have a 1949 JD A with a power trol problem. When hooking up a remote cylinder I only have pressure in one direction. To complicate the problem the tractor has been modified with a remote pump behind the distributor and a hydraulic line into the bottom of the power troll unit. Without removing the physical housing, I have removed every piece possible and found no dirt. Put it back together to find the same problem, does anyone have the possible solution to this problem?

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Heitkamp

04-06-2021 16:55:46




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to Heitkamp, 03-28-2021 09:33:30  
Problem solved, we plugged the side ports and bought (2) JD couplings using the back ports. Thanks for you all's input



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jd man wis

03-29-2021 18:07:23




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to Heitkamp, 03-28-2021 09:33:30  
I use to set up the old deeres that didn't have a power trol buy running a pump off the fan pully and a tank under the carb to supply oil to it. Ran pressure hose to control valve and out to rams and the return to other side of tank. Work good this way on lots of a,b and g. Had live power all the time.



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coonie minnie

03-29-2021 17:09:09




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to Heitkamp, 03-28-2021 09:33:30  
There is a way to set the power trol valve for a double or single acting cylinder.... but off the top of my head, I don't remember how you do it! I'm guessing yours is in the single acting mode. Do you have an operator's manual for your tractor? If not, I suggest you get one.



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Heitkamp

03-29-2021 16:45:49




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to Heitkamp, 03-28-2021 09:33:30  
The previous owner did not use the coupling ports coming out of the back of the power trol. He removed the pipe plugs on the right side screwed in a 90-degree elbow attached a pioneer quick couples while leaving the John Deere dummy coupling plugs in the back of the power troll. Could this be the cause of my problem?



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buckeye al

03-31-2021 11:04:45




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to Heitkamp, 03-29-2021 16:45:49  
Yes indeed this CAN be the problem! With the factory Power Trol (PT) plugs (not hose end adapters) in the PT valve body, one port directs oil up to the rockshaft cylinder. (Would have to look to be sure but I think it's the upper port.) The other port (I think the lower) just lets oil back into the reservoir. The pipe plug type ports on the side of the PT body were actually just holes needed to machine the PT body and were not actually intended to be used for operating remote cylinders. to use these ports for double acting cylinders there was a special plug with an external cap on it that allowed access to an internal valve that shut that forward port stopping the return of oil to the reservoir. This made the pipe plug hole out the side usable. The disadvantages of those side ports were that this special plug was needed for double acting cylinders AND the rockshaft cylinder was always full and under pressure in parallel with the remote cylinder working from the side port. If using a small bore cylinder (such as a 2 cylinder on a #44H plow) the shock pressures encountered when crossing furrows or hitting potholes when in transport caused pressure rupture gasket failures between the rockshaft cylinder and the basic housing or the rockshaft piston's cup. Been there & fought those problems! I re-plumbed mine to use hose end connectors out the back with one dropping straight down and crossing under the PT valve body then up to a Pioneer break away coupling and the other hose going through three (one 9 then two 45 degree) street ells then with hose crossed over the gear case but under the platform to the other side of the break away coupling. Have done this on two A's and a 70D. Never regretted it yet! Have not had any rockshaft failures or drifting cylinder problems since!

Hope that helps.

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Heitkamp

03-31-2021 13:15:43




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to buckeye al, 03-31-2021 11:04:45  
Next week I will plug the side pipe holes and then use the oil line couplings coming out of back of the Power Trol. I'll let you all know how that works. Have a good Easter



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Dan in Ohio

03-29-2021 17:31:47




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to Heitkamp, 03-29-2021 16:45:49  
No, they will work fine that way. Get an operators manual for your tractor. There is a metering valve on the left side of the powrtrol unit. Take the nut off and screw in the valve screw until it seats. If you need rock shaft turn that valve out about two turns. That pump behind the distributor is a live hydraulic pump it has a lever on the side so it can be turned off although it has probably been left in the on position. If you did not have the live hydraulic pump you would have to shift to neutral and engage the clutch to get hydraulic function. If you don't want it I will gladly take it off your hands.

What exactly are you trying to do with the cylinder, raise a plow, raise a disk, what? If you are trying to run a wood splitter with your A you need either a special valve or a different tractor.

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Dan in Ohio

03-29-2021 17:38:23




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to Dan in Ohio, 03-29-2021 17:31:47  
Just had another thought. If you are using a John Deere cylinder they have to be hooked up with the hose on the cylinder marked L going to the pressure (lower) port on the powrtrol unit. I have had that problem too with the cylinder on my 82 snow blade.



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susandiane

03-29-2021 13:47:19




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to Heitkamp, 03-28-2021 09:33:30  
I don't get what the extra pump does. Does it have any other hoses and to where. My power trol gives double action with two hoses to remote cylinder and single action to single action (loader) cylinders when hooked up to bottom hole only. ??



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Heitkamp

03-29-2021 16:51:34




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to susandiane, 03-29-2021 13:47:19  
The extra pump provides live hydraulics because it runs full time. Yes there are 2 hoses running from the that pump to the bottom of the power trol. The original pump located behind the PTO has been disabled.



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jd man wis

03-29-2021 03:20:18




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to Heitkamp, 03-28-2021 09:33:30  
Do the rams have one hose or two. If they have only one the reason only to work one way. If they have two then you need to put on a another valve like one that's run too change the Hyd oil the other way in the hose like a wood spliter spool valve or one like it.



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Heitkamp

03-29-2021 05:12:34




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to jd man wis, 03-29-2021 03:20:18  
The ram(cylinder) has 2 hoses. The pump from behind the distributor has 1 hose to the bottom of the power trol housing. I assumed the 2-way directional valve controlled by the hand level would provide 2-way power. But your reply indicates it will only provide 1. Am I understanding your reply? Thanks for your feed back



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jd man wis

03-29-2021 17:43:22




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 Re: JD model A Power Trol in reply to Heitkamp, 03-29-2021 05:12:34  
Only one hose from the pump by the mag must be the oil suttion hose there should be a port that is smaller for pressure. That one need to go to a valive to return the oil to the back of the tractor and also put oil to raise or lower the loader with down pressure. The leaver on the side of seat to raise an lower when it's pulled back will trip it self when the pressures is to much. That leaver works only with the pto going where the pump buy the mag is like live power.

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