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John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum
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1010 Starting Problems

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Mnethercutt

12-21-2016 08:42:28




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Just swapped the engine on my 1010, trying to start it. Points are properly spaced, all plugs are sparking and timed correctly, but it won't crank. Choke is open, throttle is at half. I'm trying to just get it to pop a bit with starting fluid, but it refuses to do anything. Any ideas why the tractor wouldn't be starting?




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tractorkrum

12-26-2016 05:31:33




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
Sounds like you are going through the same problems I have been through. Would like to chat with you directly. Email me at pjkrum@wwt.net



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Hay maker2

12-25-2016 16:53:16




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

Thanks for the update



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Mnethercutt

12-24-2016 14:28:55




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
Just wanted to say thanks for all the help. I got it running and it seems that it was just due to a very dry carb. The engine hadn't been run in quite a while and after I shot a little starter fluid up the intake manifold, it started and ran. The way I had the distributor timed was correct, seems that it just took a while to get the carb saturated with gas again. I started it 4 times off gas so all seems to be working now. Thanks for all the help.

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Hay maker2

12-24-2016 05:52:35




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
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Seems to me that you have an issue with no spark, well at least no spark at the right time. Rotate your distributor and set it like mine, this will be about 180 degrees from where you are now.

At this point it is worth a shot.



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Mnethercutt

12-23-2016 18:53:57




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
Not sure if this will help, but here's a link to a video of me trying to start it.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bx8tsINIbB8UeEF5REdSUjIyVlU/view?usp=sharing



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Mnethercutt

12-23-2016 18:29:52




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
Fairly certain it's getting good compression based on the sound and condition of the engine; I just can't imagine what else would cause it not to have any kind of combustion besides lack of gas if everything is sparking.



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Hay maker2

12-23-2016 16:34:03




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
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I think you need to take the manifold off and watch to see if the valves are going up and down unless you have a compression tester? Even on low compression a gas engine will run.

The only way to see if your getting gas in all four cylinders is to pull the plugs and choke the carb and see if you can smell gas, kind of hard to figure out if each cylinder is getting gas all thou.
Maybe there is a mouse nest in the manifold blocking.

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Mnethercutt

12-23-2016 15:02:59




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
Yes, I know no. 1 is the front. It should be wired correctly now. Is there any way to tell if the cylinders are getting gas w/out taking the carb off? I'm just filling the fuel line w/ gas and I can see the level drop, so I would think it's getting gas.



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Hay maker2

12-23-2016 14:51:51




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
It will only be wet if the carb is flooded. Maybe just a little gas is normal, but don't expect much if any.



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Hay maker2

12-23-2016 14:25:26




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
Your positive that you know which cylinder is #1 and which cylinder is #4????

Number one is the front (fan) and #4 is the rear (flywheel)

Notice the wire location in the attached picture...
third party image



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Mnethercutt

12-23-2016 14:21:30




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
Just switched the cables but still got nothing. Do you know if the bowl of the carb is supposed to be wet with gas, like if I stick my finger in the carb thru the air intake hole should my finger be wet w/ gas?



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Hay maker2

12-23-2016 14:15:43




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
I assure you that my 1010 runs on all 4 cylinders and that the firing order is 1-3-4-2...


third party image



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Mnethercutt

12-23-2016 14:04:30




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
I've got a wico, so I think thats why it's off. However, yours has the firing order as 1342, but I have mine set as 1324. I was told 1324 by the JD Dealer in my town, but they don't know much about the 1010. Is it supposed to be 1342?



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Hay maker2

12-23-2016 13:35:23




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
Frustrating to say the least.
I have viewed your pictures and it appears that your distributor is about 180 degrees out from where mine is. Notice the ground wire going to the distributor, your is a lot different than mine. Also, your spark plug wires are in totally different location than mine. For reference, my distributor is a Delco, if you have a Prestolite, or Wico it may be different (the ground wire location)

I have two 1010's and a 2010, neither are as bad as everyone says they are. I think most people condemn them as they are just repeating what someone else says / thinks. third party image third party image

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iatractorkid

12-26-2016 06:28:33




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Hay maker2, 12-23-2016 13:35:23  
I agree! I grew up on a 1010 and 2010 and we never had any trouble with either one. Dad's two main tractors on his small hay/cattle operation.



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Mnethercutt

12-23-2016 13:07:39




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
I removed and checked all of the spark plugs. They all had a clear blue spark and seemed fine but i'm not sure how big the spark should be. At one point of testing one of the plugs slipped off the ground and the spark jumped from the plug to the ground (a good half inch), so I think they're ok? They were all dry, so is that a sign they aren't getting fuel? My neighbor and I opened the carb today and checked it, and everything seemed to be working but I do not feel gas being blown onto my hand when I put my hand over the air intake. Thanks again.

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Mnethercutt

12-23-2016 11:42:32




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
Hi all,

I followed your instructions, verified that the oil pump was correctly installed, and retimed the tractor. I also tried starting it with the throttle at idle and the choke closed. I also cleaned out the carb and fuel lines. Its about 60 here so I shot some starting fluid in, but I still cannot get it to pop one bit. I'm attaching some pictures that show the engine and wiring. If anybody knows why it won't crank, let me know. third party image third party image third party image third party image

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old

12-23-2016 12:41:48




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-23-2016 11:42:32  
As Bob say you need a good blue/white spark that jumps a 1/4 inch gap or more at the center wire of the cap and at all 4 plug wires. No spark or weak spark means a no start no matter how mush starting fluid etc you give it.

You might try hot wiring it by running a wire from the ignition side of the battery to the ignition side of the coil and then try to start it.

By the way the term cranks means that the engine spins over and does not mean it is running.

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Bob

12-23-2016 11:56:43




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-23-2016 11:42:32  
Do you have a nice, "hot" spark to the plugs?

Are the sparkplugs new?

Are the sparkplugs wet with gasoline, or carbon fouled?

Even if the plugs are new, if they are wet with gas they won't fire.

Sure you got clean, water-free gasoline in it?



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Hay maker2

12-21-2016 17:16:34




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
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Just because someone at the dealer told you how to time it does not mean that it is correct. You need to start from the beginning and not assume anything. The key statement that you said is that you swapped the engine in your 1010.

First thing first. Since the engine was swapped out, you must first confirm that the oil pump is timed correctly as if this is not the distributor will never be in time. Turn the engine over by hand and place your thumb over cylinder #1 (are you positive that you know which one is cylinder #1 and which one is cylinder #4?). Once you are on the compression stroke, keep rotating the engine until you can see "DC" in the timing window, line it up with the lines on the torque tube. Remember cylinder #1 can be on an exhaust stroke and the "DC" will be in the timing window. Make sure your on the compression stroke!

Remove the distributor and look down at the oil pump drive shaft. The slot should be parallel with the crank and since the slot is off centered and the narrow side MUST be towards the outside of the block. If neither are correct you will have to remove the oil pump and time it.
Install the distributor and once again rotate the engine by hand until you feel the compression stroke on cylinder #1. At this point, continue to turn the engine over by hand until you see "26" in the timing window of the torque tube and it lines up with the timing lines. DO NOT go past it, if you do, DO NOT turn the engine backwards you must restart the process. The reason being is that when timing the distributor, you want all of the lash out of the gearing.

Now, hold the rotor and turn it CCW as far as it will go. At this point turn the distributor slowly until the point just start to open up and lock the distributor into location. This is your starting point.

Do you have a 6 volt or a 12 volt coil?
Do you have the proper voltage at the coil when cranking?
When cranking, use a light tester and hold it on the supply side of the coil, do you have power?

Points gapped to 0.022"?

Spark plugs gapped to 0.025"?

Are the wires from the cap to the spark plus correct? Post a picture and confirm with other people that have 1010's...

Another weird thing that I ran into on a 430 was the linkage not being set correctly. Make sure the linkage to the governor is set correctly and the linkage to the carb is set correctly.

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JDEM

12-21-2016 15:57:55




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
1010 gas engine is pretty simple and reliable. Needs gas, air, compression and spark at the correct time to start. You must be missing at least one of those things. Are you sure there is good spark? 1010 is an oddity because it has the ignition ballast resistor built into the key switch. The switch, if original, can cause a no-start situation. Deere came out with a repair kit that eliminated the original setup and used a separate resistor.

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Mnethercutt

12-21-2016 15:08:53




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
Other spark plugs are in the right spot. I'll try setting the throttle at idle and closing the choke.



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Ray

12-21-2016 13:08:14




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
I've got 3 1010 tractors and none of them will start at half throttle.They all must be at idle or just above.The choke must be closed.Set up a gas can to use as a fuel tank.



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Mnethercutt

12-21-2016 10:08:05




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
I know it's timed correctly because I had the local John Deere service place show me how to do it; 1st cylinder dead top center, compression stroke, then timed it by rotating the distributor in the well until the no 1 spark plug sparked (bright blue spark). Then bolted down the distributor. I'm just using starter fluid to try and get it to fire a little bit; the gas tank isn't on it but I do have gas in the fuel line, but i'll have to check the suction.

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Mike(NEOhio)

12-21-2016 13:15:10




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 10:08:05  
No. 1 is on, do you have the others in the right locations?



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old

12-21-2016 12:57:08




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 10:08:05  
This time of year just spraying starter fluid in may or may not be enough to make it fire. As for the dealer showing you and you have it right I have seen where a guy has it right on #1 but the other 3 are not correct which can cause the problem your having. I use a lawn mower gas tank when I try to start engine that do not have a gas tank hooked up



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old

12-21-2016 09:12:15




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 Re: 1010 Starting Problems in reply to Mnethercutt, 12-21-2016 08:42:28  
To start with it is a 1010 which is one of the worst tractors JD ever made.

So how do you know you have it timed right?? You could be 180 out and look right. Do you have good compression?? Low compression no start. Also you say you have good spark is it blue/white in color and will it jump a 1/4 inch gap or more at the coil wire and at all 4 plug wires?? If you hold your hand over the air intake of the carb do you get a good suction and does your hand get covered with gas??

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