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4020? Auction shocker!!

P

Phil9N3667

Well-known Member
My sister sent me a newspaper clipping today about a JD 4020(I think). It was an estate sale and the tractor had been bought new. It was used for 38 years and the widow had the sales invoice with matching serial number, etc. Bids started at $4000.00 and finally quit at $23,250!! A collector from Canada bought it. The original sale price was somewhere around $8900-9800 depending on the newspaper misprint. It didn"t look bad for a 40 year old tractor. If anyone on this forum is from southeastern VA/ norheastern N.C. you probably saw the article in the Franklin paper or went/heard about it. Pretty good deal for the widow.
 
i am not shocked.....the 4020 is AMERICAS FAVORITE TRACTOR.....new gens are coming on very strong.....you should buy,buy.
 
One in ohio brought 30000 a couple years ago.Look what a new comparable tractor cost.
 


I have the JD flyer in hand here with the 2011 version of the 4020. The 6100D 2WD, rops and an upgrade from the 4020 with 9 gears, wet clutch and power reverser.$39,467. How does that compare to 1970 dollars ?
 
This newer version will not compare in a lot of ways to a 4020. It will be lighter in weight and shorter in length. I had a 6420 90 horse and still have a 1969 4020. I never hooked them together, but if you were goin to the field to work that 4020, in the same new condition as the tractor you are asking about,it is goin to do more work. There are creature comforts on the new tractors that were not available for the 4020. In my honest opinion, for what its worth, I believe the 4020 was the best tractor John Deere built.
 
Roughly equal to $7200. About $200 more than my dad paid for a used (1966) 4020 in 1970 that my brother still uses today. Will the 6100 still be usable in 2055? I have my doubts, too much plastic and electronics.
Also the price of milk would be about $35 per cwt if it kept pace with inflation from 1981 when I started. There is a reason some of us still use 4020s. I just bought a 67 for $7000 a couple of years back, does everthing I need it to.
 
What electronics? The 6100D is as stripped down as the 4020.
$7000 4020? Seems cheap compared to what many folk are paying.
There comes a day when any and every machine costs more to repair than purchasing new.
I don't see trucking companies out there with 318 Detroits. Boeing 707's & DC8's are pretty much scrapped.
Ever figure the fuel cost difference between the 6100D and the 4020 over the next 20 years?
Parts for some select 4020 componets are becoming more difficult and $$$ to come by.
 
All good things come to an end.
The 6100D with M4WD will out produce the 4020 in heavy draft applications.The cab is quieter than the 4020's.
The gear spacing, wet clutch and power reverser are lacking on the 4020.
 
B AND D--your comments are really confusing me. i always look for your knowledgable and witty answers on here. i always look for you to "carry the flag" for the new gens...and a time
when things made sense and were simpler. when men were men and a woman was a woman-lol. i am perplexed.........and milk should be $45/cwt. using $2 corn/$15 milk scenario.....$6 corn/$45.
 
June or July this year by the look of it. Was looking at the 6100D 4WD. However the 10A backhoe and my tillage equipment is a better fit on a 5075E M4WD. A roof on the rops and a Heat Houser will do for running the snowblower.
Should be able to do the kitch and upgrade the hvac with a heatpump too.
Come on up and you can drive the tractor off the truck.
 
Just curious whether you would rather have $2 corn and no ethanol or the price of corn today, assuming you are a corn farmer.

We can't have it both ways! Personally, I'd like to see the cheaper corn prices and no ethanol. It bothers me that things using corn have shot up in price and we are wasting energy on a break-even fuel (takes about as much diesel fuel energy to make ethanol as the energy we get out of ethanol). It's good for the corn farmer but bad for the masses IMHO.
 
(quoted from post at 11:33:10 03/31/11) All good things come to an end. The 6100D with M4WD will out produce the 4020 in heavy draft applications.
Click to expand...

How can you try and compare a MFWD to a 2WD?

I would hope a 276 CID engine could be more fuel efficient than a 404 CID but I have my doubts it will out perform it.

Lets compare a 6100D 2WD to a 4020 2WD. The 6100D is rated @ 82 pto Shetland ponies from a 276 CID engine weighing between 7275 to 9170 pounds and the 4020 produces 94 pto hp from a 404 cid engine weighing between 8645 to 13980 pounds.
 
An open-station 6100D comes in at 9,000 pounds with fuel but no ballast. I don't think that's lighter than a 4020. At rated speed the 4020 burns 25% more fuel (6.4 gal per hour versus 5.1).

I'm not knocking the 4020, but the new ones are more than just a nice cab.
 
(quoted from post at 16:11:40 03/31/11) An open-station 6100D comes in at 9,000 pounds with fuel but no ballast. I don't think that's lighter than a 4020. At rated speed the 4020 burns 25% more fuel (6.4 gal per hour versus 5.1).

I'm not knocking the 4020, but the new ones are more than just a nice cab.
Click to expand...

Peter
JD spec's don't back up your weight statement!!!!
2WDApprox. Ship Wgt, lb. (kg) Open 7495 (3400)

7495#s is a lot short of 9000#s and a full tank of fuel won't get it to 9000#s

Max Unballast Drwbr HP (kW) @ Eng RPM TBD-Nebraska Test
Fuel Use, U.S. gal./hr. & HP hr./gal. at:
PTO @ Rated Eng RPM TBD-Nebraska Test
Standard PTO Speed @ Eng Speed TBD-Nebraska Test
Maximum PTO Power @ Eng RPM TBD-Nebraska Test
 
(quoted from post at 15:30:30 03/31/11) June or July this year by the look of it. Was looking at the 6100D 4WD. However the 10A backhoe and my tillage equipment is a better fit on a 5075E M4WD. A roof on the rops and a Heat Houser will do for running the snowblower.
Should be able to do the kitch and upgrade the hvac with a heatpump too.
Come on up and you can drive the tractor off the truck.
Click to expand...

Looking at or talking about a new tractor and buying a NEW JD TRACTOR are a total different thing. I promise not to hold my breath until Mrs b&d gives you permission to purchase a new JD MFWD. I'd turn BLUE
 
The test itself is online even though Deere doesn't show it in their ad materials.

9,090 pounds for a ROPS tractor with the 9x3 transmission.

10,860 pounds ballasted with front and rear iron.

I don't know how Deere calculated the shipping weight. It might be without wheels?
test
 
(quoted from post at 17:02:30 03/31/11)The test itself is online even though Deere doesn't show it in their ad materials.
9,090 pounds for a ROPS tractor with the 9x3 transmission.
Click to expand...

Peter
The Nebraska test # 742 states 9090 #'s for a MFWD 6100D not a 2WD 6100D. So what are you trying to do compare apples to oranges? I stand by my statement !!!!!!!!!!
 
I prefer to compare fuel economy at 75% drawbar pull, I feel it is more realistic for normal use of a tractor. Both the 6100 and 4020 syncro (test 930) came in at 13.38 hp hours per gallon.
 
mmmmmmm i like cheese...look what you started peter-lol. like dude, sweet 4020s are bringin 7- 7,500 over here in indiana and on ebay?? someone said it...IT TAKES AS MUCH ENERGY TO PRODUCE ETHANOL AS IT RETURNS......i hope i dont
see the day when the choice is "CAN(GAS) OR CUPBOARD".....
 
(quoted from post at 00:14:58 04/01/11) I prefer to compare fuel economy at 75% drawbar pull, I feel it is more realistic for normal use of a tractor. Both the 6100 and 4020 syncro (test 930) came in at 13.38 hp hours per gallon.
Click to expand...

Dang low budget then what about buickanddeere's statement about saving on all that 20 yrs of diesel fuel money by buying a new tractor.

The maximum pull I see for a 6100D MFWD engaged is 7723#s and the 4020 is 11,249#s

I still don't see how a tractor with less HP & weight can be accurately compared to a 4020.
 
(quoted from post at 08:30:14 03/31/11) What electronics? The 6100D is as stripped down as the 4020.
$7000 4020? Seems cheap compared to what many folk are paying.
There comes a day when any and every machine costs more to repair than purchasing new.
I don't see trucking companies out there with 318 Detroits. Boeing 707's & DC8's are pretty much scrapped.
Ever figure the fuel cost difference between the 6100D and the 4020 over the next 20 years?
Parts for some select 4020 componets are becoming more difficult and $$$ to come by.
Click to expand...

http://salesmanual.deere.com/sales/...pecs_description.html?sbu=ag&link=prodcat

[b:f1c0bb17e1]The John Deere electronic fuel injection system[/b:f1c0bb17e1] and other key engine parts, work together to sense engine load and instantly respond as needed to pull through tough spots. This reduces engine rpm fluctuation resulting in the reduced need to downshift the transmission. Fewer shifts result in fewer ground variations, providing more overall tractor productivity.


[b:f1c0bb17e1]John Deere electronic engine controls [/b:f1c0bb17e1]Monitors critical engine functions providing warning and/or shutdown to prevent costly engine repairs; eliminates need for add-on governing components; all lowering total installed costs.
Snapshot diagnostic data that can be retrieved using commonly available diagnostic service tools
New common wiring interface connector for vehicles or available OEM instrumentation packages; new solid conduit and “T” connectors to reduce wiring stress, greater durability and improved appearance
Factory-installed engine-mounted ECU, wiring harness and associated components; industry standard SAE J1939 interface which communicates with other vehicle systems, eliminating redundant sensors and reducing vehicle total installed cost.

Kind of looks to me is has some electronics.
 
If you can purchase a complete intact 4020 that won't require major repairs for several thousand hours. For the modest price of $7000-$8000, then a 4020 is worth considering.
If looking in that catagory a 4230 with SGB is even better.
A 4020 priced in the mid teens condition unknown? One has to weigh several short and long term factors.
 
(quoted from post at 09:55:58 04/01/11) On a dry track maybe. Out in the real world of loose or wet soil. The M4WD out pulls.
Click to expand...

Do you have actual written proof a 6100D will out pull a 4020?

I thought you stated 6100D had no electronic components?

I'd bet the 4020 with a 6-1/2 longer wheelbase will ride better.
 
(quoted from post at 09:56:58 04/01/11)
(quoted from post at 08:30:14 03/31/11) What electronics? The 6100D is as stripped down as the 4020.
$7000 4020? Seems cheap compared to what many folk are paying.
There comes a day when any and every machine costs more to repair than purchasing new.
I don't see trucking companies out there with 318 Detroits. Boeing 707's & DC8's are pretty much scrapped.
Ever figure the fuel cost difference between the 6100D and the 4020 over the next 20 years?
Parts for some select 4020 componets are becoming more difficult and $$$ to come by.
Click to expand...

http://salesmanual.deere.com/sales/...pecs_description.html?sbu=ag&link=prodcat

[b:1f16ad832d]The John Deere electronic fuel injection system[/b:1f16ad832d] and other key engine parts, work together to sense engine load and instantly respond as needed to pull through tough spots. This reduces engine rpm fluctuation resulting in the reduced need to downshift the transmission. Fewer shifts result in fewer ground variations, providing more overall tractor productivity.


[b:1f16ad832d]John Deere electronic engine controls [/b:1f16ad832d]Monitors critical engine functions providing warning and/or shutdown to prevent costly engine repairs; eliminates need for add-on governing components; all lowering total installed costs.
Snapshot diagnostic data that can be retrieved using commonly available diagnostic service tools
New common wiring interface connector for vehicles or available OEM instrumentation packages; new solid conduit and “T” connectors to reduce wiring stress, greater durability and improved appearance
Factory-installed engine-mounted ECU, wiring harness and associated components; industry standard SAE J1939 interface which communicates with other vehicle systems, eliminating redundant sensors and reducing vehicle total installed cost.

Kind of looks to me is has some electronics.
Click to expand...

Look again. It's not the first time yoiu mixed up the 6000, 30 series and 6000, 30 series premium series tractors with the 6000 D series.

The 6100D uses a rotary injection pump. Not the common rail computer controlled system the larger 6000 D series tractors use.
I've often wondered why so many people are terrified of electricity, wiring etc?
I would wager the 6100D's wiring harness will be in better condition in 20 years than a 4020's wiring harness in 20 years.
 
6100D max pull ballasted to 10860lbs in 4WD is
8962 lbs.
There is no way a 4020 can have 11,249lbs of
drawbar pull. Unless it was ballasted to approx
14,000lbs.
That 11,249lb's looks like the gross weight of a
ballasted 4020 with cab
 
Looks like early this year JD updated the 6100D to
common rail injection Tier III engine to suit the
safety Nazis at the EPA.
The 6100D parts list shows from 2009 until
recently. A plain ordinary Tier I engine with a
rotary mechanical injection pump.
 
Nothing at auction is a shocker just two people wanting the same thing.In 1964 a SS impala was $3500 today a lot of cars are 10 times that.Same with tractors but whats different is the feeling you get when you sit in the seat of a classic and think back 40 some years.That my friends is priceless.As far as new tractors the technology is miles ahead, many new tractors will be in and out of my shed but my favorite 4020 will have a place in my shed and fields for as long as I live.
 
(quoted from post at 20:00:41 04/01/11) 6100D max pull ballasted to 10860lbs in 4WD is
8962 lbs.
There is no way a 4020 can have 11,249lbs of
drawbar pull. Unless it was ballasted to approx
14,000lbs.
That 11,249lb's looks like the gross weight of a
ballasted 4020 with cab
Click to expand...

buickanddeere
So are you stating that the Nebraska Test # 930 for a 4020 is incorrect on the 11,249#s of pull???? Even if the 4020 was weighted heavier the 6100D had "TWICE as many tires PULLING"

And yes I did accidentally misstate the max pull of the 6100D in my other post but that's not as bad as you misstating that the 6100D was non electronic!!!!!!!
 
(quoted from post at 15:33:41 04/01/11)
I've often wondered why so many people are terrified of electricity, wiring etc?

I would wager the 6100D's wiring harness will be in better condition in 20 years than a 4020's wiring harness in 20 years.
Click to expand...

Have you ever read any of the common electrical failures on the newer model tractors? Transmission,3pt or scv won't work all because of an electrical component failure.

On the 4020 VS 6100 wiring harness comparison. 4020's have 40+years wear & tear over a 6100 and the 4020 won't require an electrical engineer to repair wiring unlike a 6100.

This is Yesterdays Tractor site not a TODAY'S Tractor site.
 
Well Stated Larry,The sound and feel of an old Work Horse is a feeling that is hard to discribe, exspecialy to a city dweller, we all have spent long hours on these old Gals in the past,and it's a great exsperiance to put a new set of work clothes on one and going to the field with it again....
 
I just pulled up the Nebraska tests for both MFWD 6100D and 66+ 4020, tests 1974 and 930 respectively. I will put up some of the data for any one who hasn't looked it up.
The 4020 was 14,265lbs ballasted with a heavy operator. They list the weight breakdown by cast iron weight and liquid weights so I don't see any surpises in its weight of 14k on the track.
The 6100D totalled in at 10,860lbs ballasted but if you notice it only has iron weights and no liquid. That hurts it around 2,700 lbs final weight. If they put in liquid the final weight would be much closer.
They have a picture of each running the track ballasted and both are open station in case anyone doubts. They have more iron bolted on than most people would ever think of putting on. The 4020 had 2600lbs of ballast (5200lbs total) each rear tire and 226lbs front weight, the 6100D had 1000lbs iron weight (total), and 595lbs (total) front.
At the maximum pull both were ran at almost the exact same speed, 2.63 (4020) and 2.82 (6100D) so thats not an issue.
They had comparable wheel slippage % 14.98 (4020), 14.8 (6100D).
The HP produced by each at the max pull ballasted was 78.91 (4020), 67.35 (6100D).
Fuel usage. Max power, rated egine speed 2hr test. 2200rpm, 5.995gph (4020), 2096rpm, 5.11 (6100D), PTO speed (1000rpm) 1hr test, 1894rpm, 5.295gph (4020), 2065rpm, 5.09gph (6100D). Varying PTO power (1k rpm), 1hr test, 51.09ave. hp, 2315rpm, 3.954gph (4020), 47.54ave. hp, ~2200rpm (got tired of calc'ing since they didn't) 3.325gph (6100D).

I think that is enough unbiased data to give us all something to compare. Each to his own preferance old or new. There is a good chance that if the 6100 had the 2700lbs it is shy it might get near the 11k lbs pull of the 4020 but we will not know. GPH efficiency the 6100D is a little more economical consistently but not by a lot. The 4020 has a HP advantage in hard lugging but not by a lot. To me they are pretty much comparable across the board as far and "hard work" and efficiency. The 6100D (cabbed) will be much more comfortable to operate and easier to shift as needed for the job (over synchro which is most common 4020), B&D says wet clutch for the 6100D and Nebraska lists it as dry clutch but I am assuming B&D's flyer is more accurate there. 4020 wiring is eay and not to expensive to replace or rewire to your own specs so that doesn't worry me. How about we all just go use or buy what we like and not fight over it? Both are great tractors. Thanks
 
4020_1966
There is point where TOO MUCH ballast is a drawback not an asset so adding more ballast to the 6100 might not get it to pull the same weight even with 2 EXTRA tires pulling!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
(quoted from post at 07:21:24 04/02/11)
(quoted from post at 20:00:41 04/01/11) 6100D max pull ballasted to 10860lbs in 4WD is
8962 lbs.
There is no way a 4020 can have 11,249lbs of
drawbar pull. Unless it was ballasted to approx
14,000lbs.
That 11,249lb's looks like the gross weight of a
ballasted 4020 with cab
Click to expand...

buickanddeere
So are you stating that the Nebraska Test # 930 for a 4020 is incorrect on the 11,249#s of pull???? Even if the 4020 was weighted heavier the 6100D had "TWICE as many tires PULLING"

And yes I did accidentally misstate the max pull of the 6100D in my other post but that's not as bad as you misstating that the 6100D was non electronic!!!!!!!
Click to expand...

The 6100D was used as the simplicity example as of until a earlier this year. The 6100D used a mechanical rotary injection pump. Instead of a common rail system.
Now that the 6100D has been updated to common rail. Depending on the injectors and turbo. It maybe identical to the models a size or two or three larger. With the exception of fuel delievery rates.
Maybe some extra HP there with some software updating or black box?
 
(quoted from post at 15:59:19 04/02/11)
buickanddeere
So you're admitting that the Nebraska Test # 930 is correct.

Also that the 6100D has an electronically controlled fuel system
Click to expand...

jim I know it's a tough concept for you to grasp even after being told a couple of times. The 6100D after two+ years of production. The 6100D was very recently changed to common rail injection. In preparation to meet the 2014 Tier IV emission specs.
2014 models will have to be equipped with cat converters particulate filters and urea injection.
Purchase your new equipment before the end of 2013.
Click to expand...
 
(quoted from post at 20:37:56 04/02/11)
jim I know it's a tough concept for you to grasp even after being told a couple of times. The 6100D after two+ years of production. The 6100D was very recently changed to common rail injection. In preparation to meet the 2014 Tier IV emission specs.
2014 models will have to be equipped with cat converters particulate filters and urea injection.
Purchase your new equipment before the end of 2013.
Click to expand...

Not as tough for me to grasp as it is for you to accept it when you're wrong!!!!!!!
 
(quoted from post at 06:31:56 04/03/11)
(quoted from post at 20:37:56 04/02/11)
jim I know it's a tough concept for you to grasp even after being told a couple of times. The 6100D after two+ years of production. The 6100D was very recently changed to common rail injection. In preparation to meet the 2014 Tier IV emission specs.
2014 models will have to be equipped with cat converters particulate filters and urea injection.
Purchase your new equipment before the end of 2013.
Click to expand...

Not as tough for me to grasp as it is for you to accept it when you're wrong!!!!!!!
Click to expand...

About what?
 
(quoted from post at 01:37:56 04/03/11)
(quoted from post at 15:59:19 04/02/11)
In preparation to meet the 2014 Tier IV emission specs.
2014 models will have to be equipped with cat converters particulate filters and urea injection.
Purchase your new equipment before the end of 2013.
Click to expand...

That emission crap messed up the diesel pickup trucks, now the tractors.
Good advice, get your tractor before 2014, I wonder how much in price it will add? 10K 12K
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
(quoted from post at 18:06:52 04/03/11)
(quoted from post at 01:37:56 04/03/11)
(quoted from post at 15:59:19 04/02/11)
In preparation to meet the 2014 Tier IV emission specs.
2014 models will have to be equipped with cat converters particulate filters and urea injection.
Purchase your new equipment before the end of 2013.
Click to expand...

That emission crap messed up the diesel pickup trucks, now the tractors.
Good advice, get your tractor before 2014, I wonder how much in price it will add? 10K 12K
Click to expand...


Tier 4 Emission Standards

The Tier 4 emission standards—to be phased-in from 2008-2015— introduce substantial reductions of NOx (for engines above 56 kW) and PM (above 19 kW), as well as more stringent HC limits. CO emission limits remain unchanged from the Tier 2-3 stage.

Engines up to 560 kW. Tier 4 emission standards for engines up to 560 kW are listed in Table 3.

Table 3
Tier 4 Emission Standards—Engines up to 560 kW, g/kWh (g/bhp-hr)
Engine Power Year CO NMHC NMHC+NOx NOx PM
kW < 8
(hp < 11) 2008 8.0 (6.0) - 7.5 (5.6) - 0.4a (0.3)
8 ≤ kW < 19
(11 ≤ hp < 25) 2008 6.6 (4.9) - 7.5 (5.6) - 0.4 (0.3)
19 ≤ kW < 37
(25 ≤ hp < 50) 2008 5.5 (4.1) - 7.5 (5.6) - 0.3 (0.22)
2013 5.5 (4.1) - 4.7 (3.5) - 0.03 (0.022)
37 ≤ kW < 56
(50 ≤ hp < 75) 2008 5.0 (3.7) - 4.7 (3.5) - 0.3b (0.22)
2013 5.0 (3.7) - 4.7 (3.5) - 0.03 (0.022)
56 ≤ kW < 130
(75 ≤ hp < 175) 2012-2014c 5.0 (3.7) 0.19 (0.14) - 0.40 (0.30) 0.02 (0.015)
130 ≤ kW ≤ 560
(175 ≤ hp ≤ 750) 2011-2014d 3.5 (2.6) 0.19 (0.14) - 0.40 (0.30) 0.02 (0.015)
a - hand-startable, air-cooled, DI engines may be certified to Tier 2 standards through 2009 and to an optional PM standard of 0.6 g/kWh starting in 2010
b - 0.4 g/kWh (Tier 2) if manufacturer complies with the 0.03 g/kWh standard from 2012
c - PM/CO: full compliance from 2012; NOx/HC: Option 1 (if banked Tier 2 credits used)—50% engines must comply in 2012-2013; Option 2 (if no Tier 2 credits claimed)—25% engines must comply in 2012-2014, with full compliance from 2014.12.31
d - PM/CO: full compliance from 2011; NOx/HC: 50% engines must comply in 2011-2013
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
(quoted from post at 20:22:59 04/03/11)
Click to expand...
ier 4 Emission Standards

The Tier 4 emission standards—to be phased-in from 2008-2015— introduce substantial reductions of NOx (for engines above 56 kW) and PM (above 19 kW), as well as more stringent HC limits. CO emission limits remain unchanged from the Tier 2-3 stage.
[/quote]

buickanddeere
You've exceeded my expectations with your subject changing SMOKE SCREEN.

Did you ever confirm what you stated that the Nebraska test 930 was incorrect that a 4020 pulled 11,249#s ????
 
I think the '63 Neb Test on a 64 4020 gives validity to the 11k, its a little lighter and less hp and was just under the 11k.
 
(quoted from post at 07:16:13 04/04/11)
(quoted from post at 20:22:59 04/03/11)
Click to expand...
ier 4 Emission Standards

The Tier 4 emission standards—to be phased-in from 2008-2015— introduce substantial reductions of NOx (for engines above 56 kW) and PM (above 19 kW), as well as more stringent HC limits. CO emission limits remain unchanged from the Tier 2-3 stage.
Click to expand...

buickanddeere
You've exceeded my expectations with your subject changing SMOKE SCREEN.

Did you ever confirm what you stated that the Nebraska test 930 was incorrect that a 4020 pulled 11,249#s ????[/quote]

txjim you are convieniently overlooking that fact the 4020 is tested on bare dry pavement and was overballasted to 14,265lbs. What do you think the numbers will look like for a 10,860lb tractor?
Have you ever heard of farming out on the dirt instead of on concrete?
Any clues about soil compaction and fuel used to overcome rolling resistance. With a 14,265lb 2WD tractor on 18.4 wide bias tires?
If you can't or won't understand basic math and physics. Look at 4020_1966 's post.
 
Quote "Have you ever read any of the common electrical failures on the newer model tractors? Transmission,3pt or scv won't work all because of an electrical component failure.

On the 4020 VS 6100 wiring harness comparison. 4020's have 40+years wear & tear over a 6100 and the 4020 won't require an electrical engineer to repair wiring unlike a 6100.

This is Yesterdays Tractor site not a TODAY'S Tractor site. " Unquote

txjim. How is your proof of electric rockshaft, electric scv's, electric M4WD, electric pto etc on 6100D's coming along?
 
(quoted from post at 09:56:17 04/04/11)
txjim. How is your proof of electric rockshaft, electric scv's, electric M4WD, electric pto etc on 6100D's coming along?
Click to expand...

buickanddeere
I think you added a few components to my quote.

Here's the components I stated and I'll quote me[/quote]Transmission,3pt or scv won't work all because of an electrical component failure."[/quote]

I'll provide proof right after you provide proof that a 6100 will out perform a 4020!!!!!!!!!! But I know that you can't/won't do that.
BTW since a 2WD is suppose to compete against a 4WD at least the 2WD should have a weight advantage.
 
Still waiting for you to admit an error on your Transmission,3pt or scv electrical. Or are you going to try and dodge and hide again behind magic math saying 2WD should be heavier?
What about the soil compaction and wasted fuel hauling an over ballasted 2WD to try and compete with the lighter 4WD?
 
(quoted from post at 13:49:14 04/04/11) Still waiting for you to admit an error on your Transmission,3pt or scv electrical. Or are you going to try and dodge and hide again behind magic math saying 2WD should be heavier?
What about the soil compaction and wasted fuel hauling an over ballasted 2WD to try and compete with the lighter 4WD?
Click to expand...

No error to admit on the electrical failures. Check JD D-TAC. I'm sure since you have access to JD's 800 number you've heard of D-Tac.

No Magic math either!!! I suppose you want the 40+ yr old 2 WD 4020 to compete with a brand new MFWD weighing in at the same amt.?????? I guess you also think a 2WD 6100 will out pull the 4020 also as you stated it was the replacement for a 4020. BTW the extra weight on the 4020 is only for Nebraska test.

Can you prove from a performance test that a 6100 will out pull a 4020???

Keep your campfire burning so you won't run out of SMOKE!!!!!!!
 
(quoted from post at 14:08:59 04/04/11)
(quoted from post at 13:49:14 04/04/11) Still waiting for you to admit an error on your Transmission,3pt or scv electrical. Or are you going to try and dodge and hide again behind magic math saying 2WD should be heavier?
What about the soil compaction and wasted fuel hauling an over ballasted 2WD to try and compete with the lighter 4WD?
Click to expand...

No error to admit on the electrical failures.

You said try to get the Transmission,3pt or scv to operate with electrical problems

Check JD D-TAC. I'm sure since you have access to JD's 800 number you've heard of D-Tac.

No Magic math either!!! I suppose you want the 40+ yr old 2 WD 4020 to compete with a brand new MFWD weighing in at the same amt.??????

May as well show even the most basic new JD's today work more efficiently.


I guess you also think a 2WD 6100 will out pull the 4020 also as you stated it was the replacement for a 4020. BTW the extra weight on the 4020 is only for Nebraska test.

Seemed important to you that the 4020 could outpull a 6100D on pavement.

Can you prove from a performance test that a 6100 will out pull a 4020???

lb per lb a 2WD or 4WD 6100D weighing the same as a 4020 will pull the same in 2WD and more in 4WD. While buring less fuel per HP hr.
Keep your campfire burning so you won't run out of SMOKE!!!!!!!
Click to expand...
 
(quoted from post at 14:17:25 04/04/11) lb per lb a 2WD or 4WD 6100D weighing the same as a 4020 will pull the same in 2WD and more in 4WD. While buring less fuel per HP hr.
Click to expand...

Do you have PROOF that a 6100 weighted identically with a 4020 will out pull the 4020. NO & NO & NO

I'm glad you work at a Nuclear facility in Canada playing on the computer about tractors and not in Texas!!!!!!!!!!
 
(quoted from post at 16:28:27 04/04/11)
(quoted from post at 14:17:25 04/04/11) lb per lb a 2WD or 4WD 6100D weighing the same as a 4020 will pull the same in 2WD and more in 4WD. While buring less fuel per HP hr.
Click to expand...

Do you have PROOF that a 6100 weighted identically with a 4020 will out pull the 4020. NO & NO & NO

I'm glad you work at a Nuclear facility in Canada playing on the computer about tractors and not in Texas!!!!!!!!!!
Click to expand...

Your proof answer is a sign of desperation and diversion from the issues at hand.
Ask anybody else here which tractor all other factors being equal can pull more on loose soil, mud or snow.
Jealous about Canada, the nuc's or both?
 
(quoted from post at 00:02:15 04/05/11)Your proof answer is a sign of desperation and diversion from the issues at hand.
Ask anybody else here which tractor all other factors being equal can pull more on loose soil, mud or snow.Jealous about Canada, the nuc's or both?
Click to expand...

I could also say that other than your talk you've proved nothing. You're of the mindset take it takes a MFWD to do any job on the farm which in my opinion is incorrect. AS I stated earlier you can't/won/'t prove your absurd reasoning so you'll continue with your SMOKE SCREEN.

The reason I brought up Nuclear Employee was because of you replying about tractors while at work. I thought nuclear plants needed full attention of employees. I'm not jealous of Canada as I have guns/ammo in my possession. As you well know I hate SNOW so I'm in no way jealous of Canada
 
(quoted from post at 07:44:53 04/05/11)
(quoted from post at 00:02:15 04/05/11)Your proof answer is a sign of desperation and diversion from the issues at hand.
Ask anybody else here which tractor all other factors being equal can pull more on loose soil, mud or snow.Jealous about Canada, the nuc's or both?
Click to expand...

I could also say that other than your talk you've proved nothing. You're of the mindset take it takes a MFWD to do any job on the farm which in my opinion is incorrect. AS I stated earlier you can't/won/'t prove your absurd reasoning so you'll continue with your SMOKE SCREEN.

The reason I brought up Nuclear Employee was because of you replying about tractors while at work. I thought nuclear plants needed full attention of employees. I'm not jealous of Canada as I have guns/ammo in my possession. As you well know I hate SNOW so I'm in no way jealous of Canada
Click to expand...

If you can to check back on previous posts. I've stated 2WD is just fine considering the applications. Flat landers, feed lot operations, low draft pto work such as haying, forage etc. And operation on dry or irrigated sand to loam soils.
4WD is for loader work off concrete. High draft loads on hills, loose soil, wet, muddy or snow conditions.
My family has numerous firearms and full health care. In winter exotic activities such as snowmobiling, cross country skiing, down hill skiing, ice fishing and hockey. No problems with roaches, fire ants or venomous snakes. Unless you count the provincial and Federal politicians who are all currently on the campaign trail.
All the fresh water one could want just by sinking your own personal well. No water authority to deal with or ration your water use.
 
(quoted from post at 08:55:51 04/05/11)
If you can to check back on previous posts. I've stated 2WD is just fine considering the applications. Flat landers, feed lot operations, low draft pto work such as haying, forage etc. And operation on dry or irrigated sand to loam soils.
4WD is for loader work off concrete. High draft loads on hills, loose soil, wet, muddy or snow conditions.
My family has numerous firearms and full health care. In winter exotic activities such as snowmobiling, cross country skiing, down hill skiing, ice fishing and hockey. No problems with roaches, fire ants or venomous snakes. Unless you count the provincial and Federal politicians who are all currently on the campaign trail.
All the fresh water one could want just by sinking your own personal well. No water authority to deal with or ration your water use.
Click to expand...

No need to defend the reasons for your living in Canada. All you glorious Winter activities include COLD weather which I HATE.

Could you please provide the date & time of you previous posted quote on 2WD's along with your proof that a 6100 will outpull a 4020!!!!!!!!!!
 
I have proof that the 3pt, SCVs, rockshaft and 4wd won't work with an electrical failure. As previously discussed the engine is now electronically injected. If the electronics for the injection system fail, the rest of the tractor fails right along with it. With an old sychro 4020 I can make it run without any electricity at all and everything will function except the lights, warning lights and fuel gauge which if you have spent any time on some beat down dairy tractors you know those are not essential to the operation of the tractor.
 
If you want to go back and check context. The subject was scv's, rockshaft, 4WD, pto etc that are operated with electrically operated valves. As the 30 series Premium tractors do. The 6100D in all versions do not use electricity to operate the scv's, rockshaft, pto, diff lock or 4WD.

b.t.w. why are so many people terrified of and unable to repair electrical equipment?

As for the 6100D being able to operate without a functional electrical system. Which is certainly an issue which indicates operators and owners with no care or control. Those who are proud to operate equipment is such a state of dis-repair. They are an incident waiting to happen. Note "incident", not "accident".
If they can't keep simple electrics functional. They will be a multitude of other faults on the tractor, equipment and in/around the surrounding buildings and work areas.
Getting back to the 6100D and electrical. For 2+ years of production they were mechanical until made EPA legal during the past couple of months. So find an older 6100D.
As for the future. Lets find those people who voted for nnalert or didn't vote nnalert against these asinine EPA regulations. There is where blame lays.
Tier I or Tier II are tough but liveable. Tier III is overboard.
Just wait until everything is Tier IV with particulate filters, cat convertor, soot burner and urea injection. This is simply outrageous.
Does anybody here think that Deere or any other manufacture wants to invest research and certification. Then sell Tier III or Tier IV equipment?
 
(quoted from post at 11:25:38 04/05/11) The 6100D in all versions do not use electricity to operate the scv's, rockshaft, pto, diff lock or 4WD.
Click to expand...

On the electrical controlled functions I didn't single out 6100 but stated late model JD tractors but can you prove from facts not your talk that a 6100 will out pull a 4020??????????? NO & NO & NO & NO you can't.

Keep the smoke billowing so you can try to avoid answering. And to think all this started because you thought your fellow Canadian paid too much for a 4020.
 
(quoted from post at 07:37:00 04/02/11)
(quoted from post at 15:33:41 04/01/11)
I've often wondered why so many people are terrified of electricity, wiring etc?

I would wager the 6100D's wiring harness will be in better condition in 20 years than a 4020's wiring harness in 20 years.
Click to expand...

Have you ever read any of the common electrical failures on the newer model tractors? Transmission,3pt or scv won't work all because of an electrical component failure.

On the 4020 VS 6100 wiring harness comparison. 4020's have 40+years wear & tear over a 6100 and the 4020 won't require an electrical engineer to repair wiring unlike a 6100.

This is Yesterdays Tractor site not a TODAY'S Tractor site.
Click to expand...

It only states an ELECTRICAL COMPONENT FAILURE it never states which component. All three of those won't work because the engine doesn't run. There is an 8310 sitting out in the barn that has already had more electrical problems in it's 10 years than the 4430 has in it's life, that's including light bulbs and all on the 44. Don't get me wrong, the 8310 is a whole lot nicer to operate than the 4430 but for what I do with the 4430 and the hours put on I can't cash flow a new tractor and for someone that is just a hobby farmer I can't imagine they can either. Your comparing apples to hopes and dreams, they don't jive.

Besides, when did this turn into a one sided discussion about emissions, I thought it was about how a 6100D was superior in every way shape and form to a 4020?

As for the price of a 4020 it depends on which auction you go to, they can be had for the right price if you are the at the right place and time. The results below are from the same auctioneer, 2 weeks apart. The first one had been through a fire and had a standard dealer paint job but was mechanically sound. The second was all original, better tires, mechanically sound. Depends on who is there that day that wants it.

$14,000 1969 ½ JD 4020 DSL. TRACTOR, SIDE CONSOLE , 4600 DOCUMENTED HRS ., 2 REMOTES, 3PT., 18.4X34 TIRES, 2 ND . OWNER, SN# 205247

$7,500 1968 JD 4020 DSL. TRACTOR , ROPS BAR, 3661 METERED HRS., 18.4X34” TIRES, 1 REMOTE, ORIGINAL OWNER SN# 185999
 

J.ReinkeFarms
I agree and I think all buickanddear would have to do is Google electrical issues on 5,6,7 & 8000 series JD to get the the proof he denies.

FYI when b&d can't support his statements he changes the subject.
 
To be fair I should have raised the issue if the 4020 was destined for? A hobby farm, small bare bones farming operation or as a spare peak season tractor on a large operation. Sorry about that.
The train of thought was if somebody is paying well into the teens and even the 20's for a 4020. Isn't it time to weigh the pro's and con's of a new 6100D for $40,000?
As for electrical problems, the dealership too often is of little no assistance. Not to slam dealership mechanics everywhere. However they employ in the shop a higher than average percentage of those who had trouble in school.
Those folk maybe brilliantly skilled with hands on work. Tho some may tend to have challenges reading, tracing and testing hydraulic or electrical circuits.
Emissions raised it's ugly head when txjim updated the conversation with the bad news. That Deere was recently forced to change their simple basic rotary mechanical injection tractor. Into a common rail Tier III emissions tractor.
In preparation for the Tier IV ruination of the tractors.During the 2008 - 2014 phase in.
 
(quoted from post at 15:39:46 04/05/11) To be fair I should have raised the issue if the 4020 was destined for? A hobby farm, small bare bones farming operation or as a spare peak season tractor on a large operation. Sorry about that.
Click to expand...

We'll forgive your oversight. As I pointed out to you before "This is an Antique Tractor Forum not the Modern Tractor Forum"
 
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