1965 ford 4000 ford hydraulic problem

1965 ford 4000-very early model-C103703 bought with PTO kicked out-repaired that-all new fluid-got running a few months later; pto,3ph, hydraulics all working. Put a new hydraulic line on mower ,tooklines off of tractor to replace connectors. Started it:3ph very slow to move-now hardly at all. hydraulic lines not working. Pto worked a little while-now not at all. Tried bleeding air out of hydraulic lines-got some, but not a lot. Guessing there's an airlock somewhere, maybe causing a valve to stick. There seems to be some pressure at hydraulic hookups as very difficult to impossible to make connections. Does not seem to bleed down pressure by moving levers. Bled down a little overnite-still difficult, but possible to make connections. Not enough pressure to raise back of mower once load hits. PTO now does nothing. Trying to move hyd levers and 3ph levers back and forth not helpful Any helpful suggestions would be appreciated. Considering draining fluid, opening lines to relieve pressure and start over. Very frustrating!! Have read many posts online and haven't found solution Thanks

With all new fluids, I'll assume the
correct amount and type.
No PTO operation would make me suspect
the PTO drive hub or input shaft splines.
The hydraulic pump runs off the same
shaft.

(quoted from post at 11:15:01 09/30/21) With all new fluids, I'll assume the
correct amount and type.
No PTO operation would make me suspect
the PTO drive hub or input shaft splines.
The hydraulic pump runs off the same
shaft.

Click to expand...

It's very puzzling since everything worked OK before introducing air to system. Pto even worked- but after air intro-not enough pressure to lock clutches-now nothing. Is it possible a valve is stuck cause of the air? Thanks for your suggestions. I'm reluctant to believe something is broke, although I've experienced some unexpected co-incidences in the past.

Something completely off the wall but did you put the oil
in the right place?

Two different compartments on that tractor, gearbox and
rear axle. Just a thought, sorry if teaching my grandmother
to suck eggs.

The hydraulic pump is under the oil in the rear compartment
and very unlikely to get air in the system.

got air in the system when I repaired hydraulic lines.
Put the right kind/amount of fluid in the right place-tractor operated normally until lines fiddled with. I think I was pretty explicit in my original post!

There is no information regarding what type of 4000 this is about. Do you have a model code?

PTO not working points to an independent PTO, which (normally) would mean a rear axle mounted gear pump. But, some 4000 tractors were equipped with an engine mounted piston pump. That type needs priming/bleeding when the system has been open.

Just to make sure, which type does this tractor have (see picture)?




This post was edited by Hacke on 10/01/2021 at 05:38 am.

very early 65 3 cyl 4000-gear pump
I posted S# in 1st post
Thank you!

(quoted from post at 16:24:53 10/01/21) very early 65 3 cyl 4000-gear pump
I posted S# in 1st post
Thank you!

Click to expand...

Yes you did, are you willing to share the model no as well (if any)?
http://www.springfieldbiz.com/oaktree/sn.html

not sure if this is model #-full S3 is C103703-6205
If this is not it , how do I find it?
Thanks again!

(quoted from post at 16:54:13 10/01/21) not sure if this is model #-full S3 is C103703-6205
If this is not it , how do I find it?
Thanks again!

Click to expand...

Use this link:
http://www.springfieldbiz.com/oaktree/sn.html

here's what i found:
on bell housing-top to bottom
512
41024
C103706 0205
engine
C5NE6015C
Trans
C5NN7006E
Rear
41B02
3PH
5B25N
I'm unable to decode these #'s? According to the local F/NH parts man(just retired-sadly), this is a very early production model-just rebuilt power steering cylinder-has a 7/8" shaft

The numbers on the bell housing are the important numbers. Attached is a screenshot from a manual that shows the structure for these numbers. All punch operators were not following this when they punched the numbers, so there are variants.

This link helps when you are decoding the numbers:
http://www.springfieldbiz.com/oaktree/rhcodes_serial.html

The date codes on your tractor are not that easy to make a certain decision from. But if the serial number is correct, it is like you say: early 1965. That is early 4000 altogether, it is number 3706 from the beginning of the US production of the 4000 3-cylinders:
https://www.tractordata.com/farm-tractors/003/7/7/3771-ford-4000.html

The model number 41024 is missing a letter at the end that would have showed what type of transmission you have:

410: 4000 Agricultural All Purpose (4100)
2: Gasoline engine
4: Independent PTO

Do you have a stick shift or Select-O-Speed (a lever on a round white box on the dash cowl)?


What type of connectors did you use?
If they are of the quick-connect (push-in) type, there could be something wrong with them. I am just thinking here, but if a check valve in a connection is not opening properly when it is connected, there might be a problem like you described. The safety valve in the pump opens.

I am not sure about this, but maybe that could lead to that the PTO clutch is "bypassed".
But then there is the air intrusion...I really do not know.

Acetone and elbow grease revealed a C hidden under the paint!
Trans is 4spd,hi and low.
The connectors were cheapies from Amazon bought as a set. Took the originals off as none of my implements would connect.
Your guess aligns with my thinking-either a valve is stuck or a safety bypass is taking over. Everything was fine till I started messing with the hydraulic lines. Will never hook up w/o first priming lines in the future.
Thanks for your thoughts! Will post future results.

Priming the lines has nothing to do with the issues you're having with that system, the pump and suction screen are mostly submerged in the system so getting air in the pump is nearly impossible, unless it's low on fluid or the suction screen is plugged.
What hydraulic remote valve does it have?
It's odd that it's lost the pro as well since it operates off of a secondary pump attached to the main pump and supplies fluid directly to the pto control valve.
Other than getting it's fluid from the main pump the pto is totally independent of the three point lift.
Have you checked the fluid level at the square plug in the side of the hydraulic pump to make sure is still full, a leaking brake boot seal can drain the rear axle in a short amount of time.