4000 engine swap with 545D turbo?

greezmky · Jul 17, 2020

Hello,

I purchased a Ford 4000 diesel with a seized engine. I need machine work but found a decent deal on a 545D Turbo engine the seller says the tractor has a 201 engine. Could I swap the turbo engine into my 4000 and call it a day? I believe mine is a 69, we tried for hours to run various numbers with little luck. The tractor was built in Europe I guess and they didn't document the numbers as well as we did?

Any info would be greatly appreciated.
Robert

Destroked 450 · Jul 17, 2020

(reply to post at 10:50:01 07/17/20)

All of the later models were built in Europe, list those numbers here and maybe we can help.
My info on the 545D says it has a 201 engine but no turbo, the only 3 cylinder engine I know that they added a turbo to was the 192 engine that replaced the 201.

Don't toss the old 201, they are a lot cheaper to repair than the newer engines.

greezmky · Jul 17, 2020

Thank you for the info. I will get numbers
later on.

I know I need the block bored out and the
crank has a couple rust spots on main
journals that concerns me, the rod and main
journals mic out good. Problem is that none
of the 3 machinists are available to do
work for 6+ weeks. I am located in the
northern part of lower Michigan, Cadillac
area and one of the machinists was 1hr
south, I guess everyone is rebuilding an
engine right now.

Ultradog MN · Jul 17, 2020

I would not hessitate to drop it into a
4000. You see folks put turbos on 5000
engines fairly often and they hold up
with the added horsepower.
Of course if you go turning up the pump
and ramrodding the tractor they may not
like that much power but for "normal" use
I'd say you'll be fine.

JoeM(GA) · Jul 17, 2020

the "EMISSIONIZED" 201 was a turbo, guess it was sold in one of those tree-hugger states

Sean in PA · Jul 17, 2020

(quoted from post at 21:28:43 07/17/20) the "EMISSIONIZED" 201 was a turbo, guess it was sold in one of those tree-hugger states

I think they switched to the emissionized engine partway through the production run due to federal emissions standards for diesel engines. Just like all diesel engines above a certain displacement sold now have to use ultra low sulfur fuel and DEF whether they're for on-road or off-road use. They don't technically have to have the DEF system, but they can't meet the emissions standards without one.

aircrue · Jul 21, 2020

VanAlstine Truck in Sandusky, MI machined mine, did a fantastic quick job. Its a haul for you, but they might have the time?

greezmky · Aug 28, 2020

Sorry it took so long. The block is ready for final machining so I need to order my rebuild kit with pistons. Below are the numbers on the tractor and engine block. Any information is appreciated.

Right hand side stamping:
C22
822956

Block cast numbers:
C5NE 6015C

Block stamped numbers:
FD071034H265

I am pretty sure this is a "world tractor" and that is why I am having a hard time decoding, if that is not the case please educate me.

Thank you,
Robert

greezmky · Aug 28, 2020

Thought there might be significance in the fact that the. C22 number is C22
*822956

Not sure if the star has any significance?

Destroked 450 · Aug 28, 2020

On the right side just behind the starter are hand stamped numbers
List those numbers so we can better understand what you have
Should look similar to the photo.

greezmky · Aug 28, 2020

Well the forum is not letting me post pictures but that is the location where the numbers came from.

Destroked 450 · Aug 28, 2020

Clean it good and see if there's a number in front of the C22

greezmky · Aug 28, 2020

I did and there is not a number in front. Nor a the are the numbers after the C22 consecutive, they are on a new line

Sean in PA · Aug 28, 2020

I am pretty sure this is a "world tractor" and that is why I am having a hard time decoding, if that is not the case please educate me.

All new Ford tractor models starting in 1965 were "World Tractors". That was a marketing name for them since they were making them at various factories around the world but they were all made using the same design and same parts, so a 4000 made in the US was the same as one made in the UK or in Belgium, with slight differences for the various markets, like more lighting and the mandatory hand brake on the European models, etc.

For the first couple of years the European assembly plants didn't follow the same rules as the US plant in te4rms of stamping the numbers though.

Are you sure that the number stamped on the engine isn't PD071034H265? and is there some extra space before the H265 at the end? If so, then the first part, PD071034, is the engine serial number for a 201 ci diesel engine for a 4000 series tractor made before 4/1/68. 4000 series engines assembled on or after that date would have an engine serial number starting with a D instead of a P. The H265 part at the end is probably a scrambled assembly date code for August 26, 1965. Try looking on the flat spot on the left side of the transmission bell housing for additional numbers. The tractor serial number having no letter prefix makes me think it was made in Antwerp, as they didn't always include the A at the begining of the serial numbers for the first couple of years, and they sometimes stamped the model number on the left side instead of the right side back then as well.

greezmky · Aug 28, 2020

The number is as I posted no spaces and appears to be hand stamped. The serial is (C22) space (maybe a 6, but faint) newline (star or *822956)

Slot and single hole main bearing

1.452 rod bearing width
Alignment tang .125 wide

Not sure if that helps

Sean in PA · Aug 28, 2020

C5NE6015C is a 201 ci diesel engine from the 4000 series. And the engine serial number would have to start with either a P or a D.

An engine serial number starting with an F would be a 4 cylinder engine from a 7000 series tractor.

So it has to be a P where the end loop of the P was struck so lightly that it looks like an F.

greezmky · Aug 29, 2020

(quoted from post at 14:04:52 08/28/20) C5NE6015C is a 201 ci diesel engine from the 4000 series. And the engine serial number would have to start with either a P or a D.

An engine serial number starting with an F would be a 4 cylinder engine from a 7000 series tractor.

So it has to be a P where the end loop of the P was struck so lightly that it looks like an F.

I am super sorry guys, I was typing all the info off the phone and just realized that I typed an F I swore I went back and VERIFIED. Now that I am on the computer I see the error.

IT is a PD not FD !!!! I am sorry.

I checked my head bolts and there were 1/2" so I ordered the rebuild kit today.

Now for the new question, I have two sets of splines on the input to the transmission, no pictures of my clutch it is at my friend's house. I assume that I need a double clutch and that the seller was incorrect when he told to me that the tractor has an independent PTO?

Sorry again, this is my first tractor and not having a reference or the tractor running in there first place, I have to figure it all out over the internet.

Thank you for all your help thus far, I really appreciate the assistance.

Sean in PA · Aug 29, 2020

Now for the new question, I have two sets of splines on the input to the transmission, no pictures of my clutch it is at my friend's house. I assume that I need a double clutch and that the seller was incorrect when he told to me that the tractor has an independent PTO?

You were told the correct information. There is only one clutch and the tractor has independent PTO. The second set of splines that powers the independent PTO has no clutch and is always powered by the flywheel whenever the engine is running. That is why the PTO is independent of the clutch.

greezmky · Aug 29, 2020

That is good! So all I have to do now is find a clutch set

Destroked 450 · Aug 29, 2020

On a 4000 the outer splines that drives the independent pto's input shaft are a part of the pressure plate.

greezmky · Sep 17, 2020

Okay new problem, this dang engine is going to make me pull my hair out.

I purchased a premium rebuild kit with .040 over pistions, made sure bearings matched my old ones and everything. The machinist calls today and says that the compression height is incorrect, the dish is too big, and not the mexican hat design. From his research I have 2.66 height and the new pistons are 2.68?

I contacted the kit supplier and they insist that I have the correct piston, well it will protrude .020 above the block. A technician at the supplier is going to dig but I am afraid it will not turn out well.

I'm beginning to regret purchasing this tractor!

If you guys have any information I would be interested, the pistons are reliance brand.

greezmky · Oct 1, 2020

Well still no answer from the techs. Machinist says block deck height was higher then the spec given, so the pistons will not protrude as much as he thought, but he says the block needs to be surfaced. :evil:

Destroked 450 · Oct 1, 2020

The stroke difference on the 3 cylinder Ford engines is .200 so a piston for a 192 is going to stick way out of the hole.

Simplest thing to do is set the crank in on a couple of bearings, put a piston on a rod, put the bearing half in and stick them in without rings, then check actual piston height.
If they do mill the deck and the piston is to high a good machinist can mill .010 or .020 off of the top of the piston.

greezmky · Oct 2, 2020

Well I went and got the engine. He was really dragging his feet and then taking vacation next week so I am going to do like you said once I get the wrist pins machined and see what happens.

Still don't understand why I can't find pistons with wrist pin to crown height of 2.662 and mexican hat style? I don't understand why no one else has this issue?

Destroked 450 · Oct 2, 2020

Actually I've never checked the compression height on any of the 201 engines I've rebuilt.
I do check the piston protrusion which the manual calles for .011 to .023 piston protrusion above the surface of the block.

4000 engine swap with 545D turbo?

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