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Ford Tractors Discussion Forum
Order Ford 3000 Parts Online

Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough

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taylor74

11-30-2019 13:13:16




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My Ford 3000, 1966 model, gas, 3 cylinder was running rough. I put in new autolite plugs, new plug wires, new rotor, condenser and points. It is worse now, especially with open throttle. The bottom plate of the Holley Carb has been 'spitting' and it even spit out the gasket that was between the bottom plate and the carb. I reinstalled the gasket and it spit it out again. I attached a photo of the Holley Carb. On the photo, arrow #1 indicates the bottom plate (now without the gasket). Arrow #2 shows the broken gasket as it hangs below the carb.

Any suggestions on how to fix this problem? This was my first time doing a tune up but I think I got the gaps and everything right....but maybe not. I don't have a dwell meter. The plug wires were difficult in making a secure connection on the plugs. Is the carb the most likely problem? I have a carb kit on the way. Thanks for any advice.

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Off Road SHO

12-03-2019 04:27:50




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 11-30-2019 13:13:16  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

Well dang! I missed the part about it being the 3 cylinder. Forget what I said about finding top dead center. I'm going back to reading is fun.

Tom



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Royse

12-02-2019 20:27:30




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 11-30-2019 13:13:16  
There may be if you have help. You could engage the PTO and have
the helper turn the PTO shaft with a pipe wrench to turn the engine.

Clutch up/engaged, tranny in neutral. Removing the plugs is still a big help.



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Off Road SHO

12-02-2019 17:02:36




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 11-30-2019 13:13:16  
BTW, just touching that lever adjusting screw should not make the engine stumble. Maybe the brass sleeve that the arm's shaft rotates in is way worn and is letting in air where it shouldn't be. Or maybe the throttle plate has come off the shaft.

Tom



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Off Road SHO

12-02-2019 16:58:55




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 11-30-2019 13:13:16  
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Stick a long thin screwdriver into the front spark plug hole and rotate the engine by hand until the screwdriver comes out the farthest. That number one piston is now at one of two top dead centers. One is on the compression stroke and is when the rotor should be pointing at the wire that goes to that cylinder, and the other is when that cylinder is on the exhaust stroke AND the third cylinder in the firing order is on its compression stroke and the rotor will be pointing to that 3rd cylinder's wire.

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taylor74

12-02-2019 19:20:31




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to Off Road SHO, 12-02-2019 16:58:55  
Royse and Off Road: This is really good. Is there an easier way to rotate the engine by hand? I've tried the fan but the belt slips. Maybe taking the 3 plugs out will make it easier. I will try these suggestions and report back. Thanks again.



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Royse

12-02-2019 16:53:50




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 11-30-2019 13:13:16  
"how do I get to or identify TDC."

Pull all three plugs so the engine will roll easier.

Put your finger over #1 spark plug hole and roll the engine over
by hand until you feel air pressure. Then look at the timing marks.

You may have to adjust it a little more to get it right at TDC, but

a couple of degrees before would also be Ok since what you want

to know is which cap tower/connector the rotor is pointing at.

Number one plug wire goes there.
One other thing I haven't seen mentioned. You said they are in
the right order, but make sure they are also in the correct direction.
I believe it is CW in this case, but I'm going from memory.

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Royse

12-02-2019 14:39:00




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 11-30-2019 13:13:16  
When the #1 cylinder is at top dead center of compression stroke,

is the rotor pointed to the cap terminal where #1 wire is connected?



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taylor74

12-02-2019 16:41:54




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to Royse, 12-02-2019 14:39:00  
Thanks for the reply. I am new at this but I read everything I can on how to find TDC and I still can't find a precise way to do this. If you have guidelines I could sure use them and I will check the rotor. Question is: how do I get to or identify TDC. Thanks again.



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showcrop

12-02-2019 10:16:59




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 11-30-2019 13:13:16  
The gasket being spit out is caused by the backfiring. The backfiring, as evryone else is telling you is misplaced plug wires.



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Jim L WA

12-01-2019 08:59:05




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 11-30-2019 13:13:16  
If the firing order is correct and the distributor cap isn't the problem, check that the centrifugal advance is working in the distributor. With the cap off, try to turn the rotor. It should move and spring back.



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Steve Brussell

12-01-2019 05:32:24




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 11-30-2019 13:13:16  
it Does sound like one of the spark plug wires are crossed. Verify firing order and check the cap. Might be some carbon tracking in there. You should be able to see it if there is.



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Royse

11-30-2019 22:51:22




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 11-30-2019 13:13:16  
I agree with Curt on your backfire issue. Probably crossed a wire.

Also, make sure you replace that gasket or it will be hard to start cold.



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curt cooke

11-30-2019 19:41:56




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 11-30-2019 13:13:16  
Doubt it's the carb. Backfire would indicate a spark at the wrong time. I would check to be very sure you have the plug wires in the right order and the right place. Verify TDC #1 and the rotation of the rotor. Just sounds like either your timing is incorrect or your plug wires are on wrong = which is the same thing.



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taylor74

12-01-2019 08:02:28




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to curt cooke, 11-30-2019 19:41:56  
Thanks for the replies. I will double-check the points gap and check the timing and report back. I'm certain the plug wires are in the right order (I had a mechanic diagram them for me and they are in the same order as the replaced wires).

Does anyone think the coil could be the problem?



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PatsTractor

12-02-2019 07:26:02




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 12-01-2019 08:02:28  
One more note...

Once you are done resolving your current problem...
In the future if you haven't considered switching out your points for Pertronix electronic ignition you might want to consider doing that sooner then later...

I switched my old 57 Ford 640 over to Pertronix and what a difference, especially starting the tractor up.
Starts twice as fast now, runs smooth as a button and no more points to mess with, worry about etc.

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PatsTractor

12-02-2019 07:14:05




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 12-01-2019 08:02:28  
If the tractor ran fine prior to your tuneup attempt... Obviously something got installed incorrectly.
It's ok.. Not the end of the world and when you find the problem you'll never forget where you went wrong in the future. :-)

Doesn't sound like a coil issue
Check and double check the firing order. Make sure those wires are in the correct location. Get a second opinion if you have to.
If they are all correct try waiting till dark...start her up and spray the cap and wires with a mist of light water spray. LOOK FOR ARCING wires to ground or wires arcing across to each other.

If the motor fires right up, idles and revs but backfires through the carb (and you have ruled out bad wires, wires installed incorrectly, bad distributer cap or timing out of wack) you could have a bad/worn intake valve.

Popping/backfiring thru the carb = possible bad intake valve / weak spring
Popping/backfiring thru the exhaust = possible bad exhaust valve / weak spring

If you don't cure the problem electrically do a compression test.
See if all of the cylinders are up to par.

Just my thoughts
Let us know what you find or do not find

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taylor74

12-02-2019 14:07:48




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to PatsTractor, 12-02-2019 07:14:05  
Thanks Pat and others for the good advice. Here is today's update: I checked the timing with a timing light. The timing process was not clear to me (saw different info in 2 manuals and couldn't really translate that to what I saw on the flywheel marks) but I did turn the distributor and saw a "2" on the flywheel; turned dist. again and saw a "6"; turned dist. and saw a "10". None of the settings helped the engine at mid throttle idle. It still misses out. Please note that the engine runs very smoothly at low idle. Also, when I just touched the lever adjusting screw (it is on the carb left and behind the carb - see attached photo) it made the engine stumble and/or backfire. In summary, timing adjustments didn't seem to help in the engine performance at mid-idle.

I plan to check the fuel filters next. I double-checked the plug wires and they are in proper order. Any ideas with this new info?

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PatsTractor

12-03-2019 11:17:05




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to taylor74, 12-02-2019 14:07:48  
More stuff..
Start the engine
While it's idling, remove one spark plug wire at a time to see if the engine rpms drops (with wire removed)
If the RPMs drop on all 3 that's a good thing.

If doesn't change at all when removed, that's the cylinder with the problem.

Another way to find a problem cylinder is to let the motor cool down completely first.
Scratch some white welding chalk on top of the exhaust manifold right where the manifold comes off each individual cylinder. So you would end up with 3 white scratch marks.

Next, Start the engine and let it idle but keep a close eye on the welding chalk. The chalk mark that melts LAST is the cylinder you are having problems with.
This test works great on diesels but can work on gas engines as well.

Chalk Marks on Manifold Explained:
Good running cylinders will heat up quick.
Those that are not firing correctly or have bad compression will not heat up as quick as the others... they run COLDLER then a normal running cylinder.

Still in trouble?
You can remove the distributer cap and as I believe was mentioned above.
Check to see if the rotor is loose.
If it's loose check that the rotor clip under the rotor is still there securing the rotor.
If it's not loose try spinning the motor over with the cap off while watching the rotor.
Make sure it's not wobbling each time it spins around.
Not wobbling? Take another look at the inside of the cap for carbon tracking (gray rings going around the inside of the distributer cap)
No carbon tracks? and the points are secure, gapped correctly, not shorting out at higher rpms?
Put the cap back on // the problem is elsewhere.

Wanta do more?
You can try a poor man's timing adjustment:
Loosen the distributer hold down bolt...
Fire it up, bring the idle up a bit and when it starts to miss try turning the distributer slightly one way or the other and see if the miss goes away. If it runs better just lock down the distributer hold down bolt, shut it off and see how it starts. If it starts right up and revs good you are good to go.

That didn't work?
Remove all of the spark plugs and do a compression test.

Got good compression?
Back to square 1 chasing the problem down.

Got bad compression?
Time to tear down the motor.

At least by doing a compression test you'll know if the motor is good or bad internally before going forward.

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taylor74

12-08-2019 08:20:16




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 Re: Ford 3000 backfires thru carb, runs rough in reply to PatsTractor, 12-03-2019 11:17:05  
Hi all, thanks for the good advice to date! I am slowly checking through every suggestion.

So far, the engine idles smoothly but sputters, misses and backfires through the carb upon acceleration and at med to high idle. I'm reading that the accelerator pump can cause this. Anyone have guidance on how to identify and clean or adjust the accelerator pump?



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