3000 diesel diagnosis please

'74 3000 diesel w/ CAV pump.
New fuel filters
New fuel lines
New fuel tank
New air filter w/ correct amount of oil
New 2.0 battery cables
New battery
Engine will not start without a tiny shot of ether. Engine puffs gray-whitish smoke when turning over (before giving it a shot of ether).

Once started- will restart without ether.

When started cold- engine misses a bit but clears up after a couple of minutes. I started the engine cold and broke each injector line a bit. I think I noticed the sound didn't change much on #1 as it did on #2 and #3 when I broke the lines loose.

My brother-in-law thinks the problem is injector timing. I don't have a clue!

If I need a pump and injectors- is it cheaper to rebuild them? I live in north central Mississippi if anyone knows of a reputable business to do this.

I would suspect the injectors these come out w/o too much of a problem. You can have them tested locally. I would suspect a leaking injector or compression loss. With the injectors out you can check the compression.

If they checkout and the compression checks out, you can ask the question at the shop about how to check the pump timing.

Just my thoughts...sl

Sounds like either low compression, injector issue or glow plug(s) not working. If it's smoking, it's trying to start. Haven't worked on a 3000 but I would look into glow plug first (probably the easiest to check) then injectors. You can swap the #1 injector into another cylinder to see if the "skip" moves with it. If it does, get it checked out. If it doesn't, I would suspect a compression issue.

ditto what the others said.

while running rough at start.. crack each injector line with a wrench, and re-tighten.. see if one makes less of a difference than the other 2.

soundguy

how cold is it?

if its really cold weather, then yes, it will smoke badly...
does it have a cold starting aid, ie a thermo-start glow plug? was it 40 degrees when you started it or 70 degrees outside?

wait till its warmed up and run for 5 minutes before you crack off the injectors for testing.

lots of times a can of bg44 injector cleaner make a hugh difference. If its low compression, pass it by. but warm starting tell me that its probably not low compression is it starts fast the second time or third time after a short run.

retarded timing will do this also, a clogged air filter can do this. but cold weather, no thermostart glow plug, and your gonna have to bring the combustion chamber up to 400 degrees before it will fire off. the cold metal engine will suck off the heat when extreamly cold..

Temp doesn't matter. I live in north-central Mississippi, and it was 70 yesterday. No cold-start plugs. I'm pretty sure the thermostat is stuck open. After running for 3 minutes-it will restart without ether.

Your engine is worn out and doesn't have enough compression to fire those cold cylinders until they warm up.

(quoted from post at 01:08:54 02/11/09) Your engine is worn out and doesn't have enough compression to fire those cold cylinders until they warm up.

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The engine was gone through a few years ago but has never run right since- so I've been told. How do I check compression? I know I have to pull the injectors but what kind of tool do I need to purchase? A standard compression tester for a gas burner will do?

The engine was gone through a few years ago but has never run right since- so I've been told.

Since the engine was "gone through ...and hasn't run right since..." You will have to investigate, and see what you got.

You probably arn't the only one to use either on this machine. There are those that have gone before you..... On John Buds photo album, photobucket there are some pix of pistons w/the ring lands ....gone.... :shock:

This may be leading to low compression. likewise, the wrong rings or installation of new parts could also be the problem/s.
An engine rebuild is only as good as the installation.

About the fuel injection pump. was the drive gear timing set right? When the tractor runs, is it producing enough power? does the engine sputter or miss under load? excessive smoke and what color?
Also, there are some pumps that require oil internally, news to me. On this FORD forum in the last week these have been discussed. W/O the oil, they don't perform......

About the compression, It takes a gauge with a higher capacity. GOOGLE it. before you do this, while you have the tin removed, check the valve lash...... Probably hasn't been done in "... a few years".

let us know....sl

steve n carol
If you have a Simm's pump on your tractor, you are supposed to change the oil every 100 hours.
When you change the oil, clean the breather on top of the pump, the pump uses the same oil as in the motor.
While you have the oil drained, you could check for diaphragm for cracking, and dirt, water, etc. in your lift pump, (don't forget to turn off the fuel)
This lift pump is bolted to the side of the injection pump.
This can be replaced for about $50.00 (rebuilt).
For more information, check your service manual.
Brian

About the fuel injection pump. was the drive gear timing set right? When the tractor runs, is it producing enough power? does the engine sputter or miss under load? excessive smoke and what color?

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After the engine warms up- no excessive smoke. The tractor pulls fine without any sputter

Also, there are some pumps that require oil internally, news to me. On this FORD forum in the last week these have been discussed. W/O the oil, they don't perform......

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This is a CAV pump. I was told this: After the rebuild, the mechanic suggested to the owner to have the pump "set". That's all I know about the history of the rebuild.

While you have the tin removed, check the valve lash...... Probably hasn't been done in "... a few years".

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I will check that this weekend. I have the hood off now. As far as how to check lash on this motor, my experience until now is only with auto engines. I cut my teeth in a '68 Nova w/ a 427. The 427 had a mechanical cam. Having said that- do I check lash with the motor warm and running. I do have a manual so I can read up on it. I will also check the timing of the pump.

check the compression. Could be a burnt valve.

I ran the tractor most all day today. I am thinking now that the rings are shot. After the engine is warmed up fully, the engine emits white smoke at idle.

AlanBarrett
White smoke tells me you could be burning antifreeze.
Are you loosing coolant? Does the engine oil smell like antifreeze?
With the rad cap off, do you see air bubbles in the radiator at an idle?
Post back.
Brian

White smoke tells me you could be burning antifreeze.
Are you loosing coolant? Does the engine oil smell like antifreeze?
With the rad cap off, do you see air bubbles in the radiator at an idle?

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The smoke might not be "white" but is the same color (greyish-white?)as when you are trying to crank it cold. No loss of coolant or coolant smell while running. I'll have to look for bubbles in the radiator.

I'm just going to run it this year as-is. Next year I will plan on a rebuild. I am going to start now buying parts here and there. I have noticed rebuild kits on Ebay. Are they worh it?


I was looking through a local classifieds paper and noticed a guy having a new 3000 block for sale at $500. I am tempted to buy it.

AlanBarrett
These blocks are known to have pin holes in the cylinder walls.
If it is, that cylinder will look like it is really clean, when you pull it apart.
Installing sleeve(s) would fix that.
I would prefer to rebuild the original motor to keep the numbers correct.
Just my$0,02 worth.
Brian

(quoted from post at 17:58:52 02/14/09) AlanBarrett
White smoke tells me you could be burning antifreeze.
Are you loosing coolant? Does the engine oil smell like antifreeze?
With the rad cap off, do you see air bubbles in the radiator at an idle?
Post back.
Brian

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ON a diesel "white smoke" is more likely to be from unburnt fuel. That would be as easy as the valve adjusted too tight, dirty air cleaner, clogged fuel filter, clogged injectors, low pop off pressure or a weak pump. Injectors are cheap to replace with rebuilt units. I would do that first. Well, actually, I would change all the filters, adjust the valves correctly then probably fill the fuel filter with injector cleaning solvent, then if that didn't help test the pop off pressure and spray pattern. But I have access to a test rig. :wink: Test the compression with the injectors out and if it is good and if it's not injectors, then it's the pump. Pump rebuilds are in the $4-700 range depending on the pump and what is wrong with them. DIY is way cheaper, but you could make a small goof and have the engine run to the red line and grenade. That's not so good.

Of course if you are feeding it ether, then it could very easily be ready for a major overhaul. And, I still keep that piston from the pictures on a shelf to show people what a shot of "devil spray" will do to an engine. As you may have guessed, I am not a fan of the manual use of ether to start recalcitrant, contumacious or even froward engines.

jb

( I am not a fan of the manual use of ether to start recalcitrant, contumacious or even froward engines.
jb

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LOL JB
And don't forget they can sometimes be atrabilious as well.
Got a link to that picture of the bad piston?