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Harry Ferguson Tractors Discussion Forum
:

z134 mystery pecking noise

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54FergieTO30

06-12-2019 19:53:51




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Here's the story. Crankshaft ground, new main bearings, new rod bearings. Sleeve and pistons were relatively new, I did put new rings on them. Head was refurbished with new valves. Brand new rocker assembly. Valves were set, engine was ran then valves set again to .013. Oil pump rebuild. New governor. New water pump.

I have a pecking or ticking noise that I can't track down. I have pulled the oil pan and timing cover to check everything and nothing shows up. I am not exactly an expert as this is only the second Continental engine rebuild I have dove into.

The oil pump gear back lash is more than it should be, but I have removed all the shims and it is as tight as I can get it.
I briefly ran the motor with the fan belt off to see if the noise was coming from the water pump or alternator and its not. I pulled the power steering pump and ran the motor without it and that's not the culprit either.
Oil pressure is 35-38. It runs fine and has good power. I have mowed with it a few times and it has more power than my TO30 (which also has a new engine rebuild)

I would not decribe it as a knock, like a rod knock. But there is a noise that should not be there.

Anyone else dealt with an issue like this?

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54FergieTO30

06-17-2019 12:14:54




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
I had a gentleman who knows old engines listen to it and he believes the noise is coming from the camshaft. Since there are no bushings on this camshaft, it's just going to be run like it is. Maybe someday I will tear it down again and check all the camshaft specs and see what could be done. As for now, I will just work it and enjoy every second. Sure turns easy with that power steering as compared to my TO30.

Thanks for the input, I am moving on! Now to address an oil leak around the lift shaft. Always something.....

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54FergieTO30

06-16-2019 06:39:57




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
Mowed a bit today with it and pulled each plug wire to see if sound changed. I don't believe there was a difference in the noise when any wire was removed. Valve rocker assembly was just purchase new and has plugs. I am going to set the valves again sometime in the next month or so.

Right now I am just gonna to use it and see what happens, oil pressure is good. It runs well, as it should with all that has been done. I guess I can add a radio on the fender and just crank it up to drown out the pecking noise.

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miner09

06-16-2019 11:44:36




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-16-2019 06:39:57  
Sometimes we just here things we shouldn't. LOL Probably OK if oil pressure good. Just got a MH50 and I hear a ping but think it's valves.Mine has been setting for 4 yrs but has good oil pressure and good compression.



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54FergieTO30

06-14-2019 04:48:48




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
It looks like yours was a 1959 model, which may be the same year as mine. Mine had no serial tag, but the Continental engine number shows it was built in '59 also. Mine has spin out rims and the hood was in worse shape that what your pics looks like. So I don't think they are the same machine. Plus mine had two cracks in the block that I had a machine shop weld, that repair seems to be holding up so far.

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54FergieTO30

06-14-2019 04:41:44




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
I originally thought it was from the valve rockers as the assembly I had was worn way beyond book specs. Bought a brand new rocker assembly and reset valves to .013 warm and the sound is still there. (Which is what I get for changing parts without knowing the exact cause, but the old rocker assembly was definitely worn out)

When I get time I am going to try setting valves tighter and then try your suggestion of pulling each plug wire to see if sound changes, thanks.

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Steve@Advance

06-13-2019 20:55:33




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
Try pulling one plug wire at a time, see if the sound changes.

If it does, could be a wrist pin, loose piston skirt clearance, rod bearing, main...

Usually a rod will have a double rap, and loss of oil pressure.

A main more so under load, deep bottom knock/rattle.

But a wrist pin or skirt slap can run for years without a problem.

If the sound does not change, could be a valve train noise. Check the lash with a feeler gauge while running. Look for a bent pushrod, dry rocker bushing. Be sure the plugs are in the ends of the rocker shaft.

Did you check the teeth of the cam and crank gears carefully? Those are known for the governor ball cage breaking. A piece of a broken cage could be jammed into one of the gears.

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54FergieTO30

06-13-2019 18:36:37




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
I've spent way more than I will ever get back out of this tractor, but that is the nature of restoring. I just enjoy tinkering with it. Just frustrated with all that is new and the time and effort I've put in that I have this noise.



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54FergieTO30

06-13-2019 13:15:32




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
Good suggestion. I hope that's not the case, the shop who refurbished the head checked the pistons and rods, so they should be good, but who knows maybe they missed a loose wrist pin.



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54FergieTO30

06-13-2019 13:13:23




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
I was thinking along your lines. The engine tag lists the valve numbers as tighter than the service manual. When I get my honey-do jobs taken care of I will try the tighter settings and see what happens .



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54FergieTO30

06-13-2019 13:11:30




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

This one was basically salvage, non running and sitting with brush growing all over it when I bought it and in terrible shape. Doubt it's the same one, this one had no serial tag, only an engine tag



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JDEM

06-13-2019 13:53:51




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-13-2019 13:11:30  
Mine was also sitting in the bushes for many years. I wish I had kept it. I suspect the noise was a wrist pin, but I guess I will never know. Nice tractor with a live PTO, live hydraulics, and a hi and low range trans.



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pomester

06-13-2019 08:22:32




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
I'll just throw this out there -
wrist pin bushing - often overlooked during engine rebuilds - a much 'lighter/higher' sound than a low end rod knock - usually I wouldn't describe it as 'pecking/ticking' which would mostly be associated with the valve train, it's also hard to isolate as it's about as internal as it can get in the engine - something to consider - also as you look for the noise I'd suggest you carefully inspect your valve springs, even if new, one could have broken
good luck tracking it down -

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JDEM

06-13-2019 07:47:39




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
I have no answer for you but curious what you find. When I moved out of central NY a few years ago - I had a TO35 Deluxe. I had just pretty much done the same as you. I put new sleeves, pistons and rings. New engine bearings, went all through the head, etc. All clearances checked. I ran it maybe with 8 hours of moderate use and all of a sudden it started making an internal engine noise. Not a rod knock. In between what I'd describe as a knock and a tick but fairly low and certainly increased with engine RPM. I had no time to pull it back apart. I sold it as-is for $700. I wish I could of kept it. Maybe you have it now?

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miner09

06-13-2019 05:33:08




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
I built one and had valves make noise. Had to re-adjust and set just a little tight. Did you set valves cold or hot? Try setting with engine running and see if you can take noise out. I use a quart bottle with hose for gas.



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54FergieTO30

06-12-2019 21:16:26




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
Just picked up a cheap auto stethoscope. Have not had a chance to put it to use yet



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54FergieTO30

06-12-2019 21:14:50




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
Quoting Removed, click Modern View to see

Could be coming from oil pump gear and crankshaft gear. When I pulled oil pan the new oil pump gear already had some wear showing.



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John Deere D

06-12-2019 21:22:44




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 21:14:50  
INFO from MF SERVICE MANUAL:
TIMING GEARS:
New Oil Pump Gear to Crankshaft Gear Backlash....0.008-0.010 inch


Bob...



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John Deere D

06-12-2019 21:13:51




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
Stethoscope......or....long handled Screwdriver.....Ear Muffs (Hearing protection)... place handle of screwdriver against Ear Muff and listen at various locations on you Engine.....yes with Engine running...

If you thinks this sound nuts....well....it works....LOL


Bob...Retired power Engineer....



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steve19438

06-13-2019 04:27:47




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to John Deere D, 06-12-2019 21:13:51  
If you thinks this sound nuts....well....it works....LOL

not at all. been doing it for over 50 years although without the ear muffs.



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Duner Wi

06-12-2019 20:19:54




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 Re: z134 mystery pecking noise in reply to 54FergieTO30, 06-12-2019 19:53:51  
Click show up after rebuild?? If no or don't know I would look at the timing gears. They can chatter more than click.



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